Booking flex ticket intra-Europe?
Jul 29, 2019, 9:46 am
#16
Original Poster
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: SUV
Programs: UA *G MM
Posts: 7,017
Well, I already booked. Yes, an economy ticket. But it is refundable...... Refundable is refundable. There was no "processing fee" in the terms and conditions. Some crappy airlines, Fiji Air comes to mind, will hit you with a $25 processing fee even if you buy a full fare ticket. But they fully disclose that.
Jul 29, 2019, 9:51 am
#17
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Netherlands
Programs: KL Platinum; A3 Gold
Posts: 28,659
It is not cancellable.
(I can't find HFFWNL on the Matrix, as it only lists AF's connecting itineraries via CDG. However, the "FF" in HFFWNL does at least suggest that this may indeed be Fully Flexible, but I can't verify this)
CANCELLATIONS
ANY TIME
TICKET IS NON-REFUNDABLE IN CASE OF CANCEL.
TICKET IS NON-REFUNDABLE IN CASE OF NO-SHOW.
NOTE -
BEFORE DEPARTURE
CANCELLATIONS RULES APPLY BY FARE COMPONENT
WHEN COMBINING A REFUNDABLE TICKET WITH A
NON REFUNDABLE TICKET PROVISIONS WILL APPLY
AS FOLLOWS
- THE AMOUNT PAID ON THE REFUNDABLE FARE
COMPONENT WILL BE REFUNDED UPON PAYMENT
OF THE PENALTY AMOUNT IF APPLICABLE
- THE AMOUNT PAID ON THE NON REFUNDABLE
FARE COMPONENT WILL NOT BE REFUNDED
AFTER DEPARTURE
-THE REFUND GIVEN WILL BE THE DIFFERENCE
BETWEEN THE FARE PAID AND THE APPLICABLE FARE
FLOWN
--------------------------------------------------
FOR NON REFUNDABLE TICKETS THE YQ/YR CARRIER
IMPOSED SURCHARGE WILL NOT BE REFUNDED
ANY TIME
TICKET IS NON-REFUNDABLE IN CASE OF CANCEL.
TICKET IS NON-REFUNDABLE IN CASE OF NO-SHOW.
NOTE -
BEFORE DEPARTURE
CANCELLATIONS RULES APPLY BY FARE COMPONENT
WHEN COMBINING A REFUNDABLE TICKET WITH A
NON REFUNDABLE TICKET PROVISIONS WILL APPLY
AS FOLLOWS
- THE AMOUNT PAID ON THE REFUNDABLE FARE
COMPONENT WILL BE REFUNDED UPON PAYMENT
OF THE PENALTY AMOUNT IF APPLICABLE
- THE AMOUNT PAID ON THE NON REFUNDABLE
FARE COMPONENT WILL NOT BE REFUNDED
AFTER DEPARTURE
-THE REFUND GIVEN WILL BE THE DIFFERENCE
BETWEEN THE FARE PAID AND THE APPLICABLE FARE
FLOWN
--------------------------------------------------
FOR NON REFUNDABLE TICKETS THE YQ/YR CARRIER
IMPOSED SURCHARGE WILL NOT BE REFUNDED
Spoiler
Jul 29, 2019, 9:56 am
#18
Join Date: Nov 2018
Location: Hull, UK
Programs: FB Plat, ALL Silver, HH Silver
Posts: 165
The 'Economy Flex' offers you the same privileges for Intra-European flights too, and you are granted full skypriority as well. I do not see anything wrong with it, because just like hotels booked with a flexible reservation, not everyone knows when they might need to travel.
EDIT: For Clarification, here is a dummy booking for LBA-AMS-LYS below. Flex states 'Refund if you cancel', 'Refund if you miss your flight' and a 'change fee of Ł 0 GBP'.
Last edited by Lawrious; Jul 29, 2019 at 10:07 am
Jul 29, 2019, 10:06 am
#19
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Netherlands
Programs: KL Platinum; A3 Gold
Posts: 28,659
Well, because I don't want to sit around AMS for hours after travelling 30+ hours. I already have a 3 hour buffer. If something goes wrong then the delay might be as much as a day. Well, I can fly on Korean and arrive late afternoon, I think, assuming that I make it to ICN.. You can't account for this kind of delay. When it's such a small fare difference then it makes sense. Actually, if I am really delayed then I will skip going to CPH and proceed to the next destination.
So you are suggesting to assume the worst and book an evening flight where I sit for 12 hours at AMS?
So you are suggesting to assume the worst and book an evening flight where I sit for 12 hours at AMS?
It seems that you are worried about missing your ICN-AMS flight, and also that CPH can be "ditched" if necessary.
All of this is new information.
I can't give you advice, because I still don't understand why you booked travel this way. As I currently understand it, you cannot be sure you will arrive from ICN on KL at 0500, but may instead arrive from ICN on KE at 1855 (or whatever specific times are in question on your travel dates), or even on KL at 0500 a day later than originally planned. However, in this scenario, I think I would have booked travel to CPH on the following day, allowing me a day to rest at AMS after that gruelling travel schedule if things went right, or an almost immediate hop to CPH having arrived on a vastly-delayed trip. However, as it seems that you have further travel planned almost immediately (though it appears not from CPH, though you mentioned only booking a one-way AMS-CPH, so it again raises the question - are you waiting to book your ticket to "proceed to your next destination" depending on where you arrive, and why you plan/book travel in this manner?), I would really doubt whether I would even attempt to get to CPH at all. If I felt like risking it, I would have booked the cheapest possible flight - not flex mind - hoping that I make the connection (and 3 hours here sounds reasonable) but with the expectation that I would just claim back taxes and not be too bothered about skipping CPH if I ended up not making it.
(Ideally, I would have booked a ticket to CPH, not AMS!!!)
But good luck to you on your travels!
Last edited by irishguy28; Jul 29, 2019 at 10:14 am
Jul 29, 2019, 10:29 am
#20
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Netherlands
Programs: KL Platinum; A3 Gold
Posts: 28,659
The 'Economy Flex' offers you the same privileges for Intra-European flights too, and you are granted full skypriority as well. I do not see anything wrong with it, because just like hotels booked with a flexible reservation, not everyone knows when they might need to travel.
EDIT: For Clarification, here is a dummy booking for LBA-AMS-LYS below. Flex states 'Refund if you cancel', 'Refund if you miss your flight' and a 'change fee of Ł 0 GBP'.
EDIT: For Clarification, here is a dummy booking for LBA-AMS-LYS below. Flex states 'Refund if you cancel', 'Refund if you miss your flight' and a 'change fee of Ł 0 GBP'.
They made mention way upthread of the "€7 extra" option, which adds a certain degree of flexibility up to T-48h, but doesn't change the underlying LIGHT ticket fare.
This €7 flexibility doesn't mention refunds or allowing cancellation. And it doesn't give you a baggage allowance (you still can/have to add that as an optional add-on). So, this type of "flexibility" doesn't change the ticket from being a "Light" ticket, either...it just allows you to avoid the €70 change fee up to T-48.
Jul 29, 2019, 5:55 pm
#21
Original Poster
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: SUV
Programs: UA *G MM
Posts: 7,017
I am not worried. It is pretty low probability. Once I get to ICN the biggest risk is a mechanical with the KLM flight. Actually you are right if you look at it from pure probability then if I have lower than 25% risk of missing the flight then it is better to buy the non-ref. I am not sure about KLM but, with my lengthy experience with many airlines, I think my chances are better for them to accommodate me with no extra charge if I have changeable ticket especially if KLM was at fault with an incoming delay due to a mechanical. Or a severely delayed incoming due to a mechanical in AMS. It is an old bird. 747 combi.
Like I said before, my business class ticket would have cost around USD 800 more to add the AMS-CPH leg to my ticket so I bought it thru AMS. It is an open jaw return form another city.
p.s. I booked the HFF fare from Air France. Pretty good website and it makes the terms and conditions crystal clear. Fully refundable and changeable. There is only verbiage about penalties for using a ticket out of sequence, which obviously does not apply to a one leg ticket. If I actually need to refund it and they start playing games with fees then my US credit card will take care of it.
p.p.s. KLM is #$#@$ airline charging EUR 600 one way with "economy light" terms close to departure.
Like I said before, my business class ticket would have cost around USD 800 more to add the AMS-CPH leg to my ticket so I bought it thru AMS. It is an open jaw return form another city.
p.s. I booked the HFF fare from Air France. Pretty good website and it makes the terms and conditions crystal clear. Fully refundable and changeable. There is only verbiage about penalties for using a ticket out of sequence, which obviously does not apply to a one leg ticket. If I actually need to refund it and they start playing games with fees then my US credit card will take care of it.
p.p.s. KLM is #$#@$ airline charging EUR 600 one way with "economy light" terms close to departure.
It seems that you are worried about missing your ICN-AMS flight, and also that CPH can be "ditched" if necessary.
All of this is new information.
I can't give you advice, because I still don't understand why you booked travel this way. As I currently understand it, you cannot be sure you will arrive from ICN on KL at 0500, but may instead arrive from ICN on KE at 1855 (or whatever specific times are in question on your travel dates), or even on KL at 0500 a day later than originally planned. However, in this scenario, I think I would have booked travel to CPH on the following day, allowing me a day to rest at AMS after that gruelling travel schedule if things went right, or an almost immediate hop to CPH having arrived on a vastly-delayed trip. However, as it seems that you have further travel planned almost immediately (though it appears not from CPH, though you mentioned only booking a one-way AMS-CPH, so it again raises the question - are you waiting to book your ticket to "proceed to your next destination" depending on where you arrive, and why you plan/book travel in this manner?), I would really doubt whether I would even attempt to get to CPH at all. If I felt like risking it, I would have booked the cheapest possible flight - not flex mind - hoping that I make the connection (and 3 hours here sounds reasonable) but with the expectation that I would just claim back taxes and not be too bothered about skipping CPH if I ended up not making it.
(Ideally, I would have booked a ticket to CPH, not AMS!!!)
But good luck to you on your travels!
All of this is new information.
I can't give you advice, because I still don't understand why you booked travel this way. As I currently understand it, you cannot be sure you will arrive from ICN on KL at 0500, but may instead arrive from ICN on KE at 1855 (or whatever specific times are in question on your travel dates), or even on KL at 0500 a day later than originally planned. However, in this scenario, I think I would have booked travel to CPH on the following day, allowing me a day to rest at AMS after that gruelling travel schedule if things went right, or an almost immediate hop to CPH having arrived on a vastly-delayed trip. However, as it seems that you have further travel planned almost immediately (though it appears not from CPH, though you mentioned only booking a one-way AMS-CPH, so it again raises the question - are you waiting to book your ticket to "proceed to your next destination" depending on where you arrive, and why you plan/book travel in this manner?), I would really doubt whether I would even attempt to get to CPH at all. If I felt like risking it, I would have booked the cheapest possible flight - not flex mind - hoping that I make the connection (and 3 hours here sounds reasonable) but with the expectation that I would just claim back taxes and not be too bothered about skipping CPH if I ended up not making it.
(Ideally, I would have booked a ticket to CPH, not AMS!!!)
But good luck to you on your travels!
Last edited by gnaget; Jul 29, 2019 at 6:02 pm
