lack of cabin passenger safety

Old Mar 25, 13, 1:59 pm
  #1  
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lack of cabin passenger safety

Was on evening flight out of JFK last week. Every seat apparently sold.

During safety briefing, it was quite loud, like a party ignoring the safety briefing.

For takeoff, people were turning their phone screens off, not turning phones off completely.

After some altitude gained and seat belt lights still on, FAs started selling snack boxes. Person across aisle from me asked FA if he could use lavatory. FA said yes. Two people from that row went to lavatories, while the other person pulled down a bag from overhead then went to back of aircraft to chat. I flagged an FA, asked for purser and she confirmed she was purser. I asked if seat belt light was on. She looked around for the lights and said yes. I asked why passengers were walking around. She said she didn't know. During this conversation, person in row in front of us got up and walked to front of aircraft. I pointed that out, said the inattentive safety briefing and people walking around is dangerous to FAs and me. I asked her to seat everyone, and she said she couldn't. I told her she had federal authority to do so, and she said that is not what they are taught by JetBlue. We went back and forth on this until she asked me if I wanted her to make an announcement that the seat belt light was still on. I said yes, and she went and did that. FAs never asked a specific person to go back to their seat. Spoke with purser again and she agreed with me about safety but had no authority to tell people what to do for safety.

After flight I spoke with captain who said the FAs get fired if there are three complaints, so they won't do anything. Captain said JetBlue tells him the only way a passenger can stop a take off roll is if a passenger is actually in a lavatory. A passenger walking around during take off roll or using cell phone would not stop the aircraft.

I will contact the company and for my safety I will not fly JetBlue. What else should I do? Does FAA listen to passengers? Is it possible/helpful to get after-flight purser report?
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Old Mar 25, 13, 3:45 pm
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Well this is not just a jetBlue issue. I have been on numerous flights especially out of Florida where safety briefings are ignored and people don't properly shut down electronic devices. This issue is wide spread.
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Old Mar 25, 13, 3:51 pm
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JBLU421NYC, Thanks for your reply.

So far this year I have 55 segments on United. One of those I was talking with seatmate during briefing and we were told to be quiet. I appreciated it - I had simply spaced out of what I should have been doing while I was concentrating on my new mate.

Regarding the jetBlue flight that had people walking around while seat belt light was on, I don't recall this happening on any other flights. I was surprised the FAs allowed it and I was shocked when they refused to actually do anything about it.
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Old Mar 25, 13, 4:34 pm
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I frankly don't see why this would be of any concern to you.
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Old Mar 25, 13, 6:23 pm
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Originally Posted by dw View Post
I frankly don't see why this would be of any concern to you.
I was wondering what other frequent fliers would think. If there is turbulence, people and their bags could fly around and hurt other passengers. The seat belt light indicates passengers should be strapped in, to avoid that danger.
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Old Mar 25, 13, 7:04 pm
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Originally Posted by JonMST View Post
I was wondering what other frequent fliers would think. If there is turbulence, people and their bags could fly around and hurt other passengers. The seat belt light indicates passengers should be strapped in, to avoid that danger.

You are overreacting...the only time they are actually required to be sitting down and not in the restroom is during takeoff. Any other time, even though the seat belt light is on, you can get up if you need to but you do so at your own risk.

Are you one of those that drive at 55mph in the left lane to "police" the highway yourself?
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Old Mar 25, 13, 7:14 pm
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Originally Posted by dw View Post
I frankly don't see why this would be of any concern to you.
Agreed - clearly you're a very observant person, but the application of (and enforcement of) laws and regulation onboard an aicraft is not your concern.

Yes, bring it to the attention of the FA if it really bothers you - but going on and on about it would've been severely irritating for the FA I dear say
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Old Mar 25, 13, 9:19 pm
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This is nonsense. What exactly do you expect the Inflight Crew to do... tape people's mouths shut? You can't stop people from talking.

People leave their phones on on every airline. Again, the crew is not going to go inspect phones.


Takeoff will be cancelled if people are standing.
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Old Mar 25, 13, 9:49 pm
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I thought passengers were required to comply with the seat belt sign. http://www.faa.gov/other_visit/aviat.../InFO11001.pdf

I am hearing the opinions of the posters that ignoring the seat belt sign is OK.
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Old Mar 26, 13, 12:29 am
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I don't think anyone is actually condoning it that its ok to stand up when the Seatbelt sign is on but the fact is when the aircraft reaches 10,000ft which is probably what was going on here since the FA was talking with you, when passengers here that DING DING and even though the FA will clearly say the sign is still illuminated and they are only authorized to use electronic devices people still get up and go to the bathroom.

However you seem like more of a hassle to the FA than the folks standing in the aisle. Let them get up. When their heads go through the ceiling because of turbulence Jetblue will not be paying any medical bills.
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Old Mar 26, 13, 5:48 am
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Originally Posted by JonMST View Post
So far this year I have 55 segments on United.
You have flown 55 segments on UA and never seen any of this? Do you mind if I ask if you are blind?
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Old Mar 26, 13, 6:03 am
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Originally Posted by JonMST View Post
I thought passengers were required to comply with the seat belt sign. http://www.faa.gov/other_visit/aviat.../InFO11001.pdf

I am hearing the opinions of the posters that ignoring the seat belt sign is OK.
Interesting link. Doesn't say there's a federal law requiring compliance. Wouldn't surprise me if there *was* such a law, but I can't find one on a quick 'net search.
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Old Mar 26, 13, 8:16 am
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People ignoring the seat belt sign is simply a fact of flying in the US, IMHO primarily because pilots in this country tend to be overly conservative with the seat belt sign. I've been on a lot of international flights where the seatbelt sign gets turned on, there is about 10 minutes of turbulence, and then the sign stays on for another two hours. At a certain point, people need to use the lavs.

When I fly on foreign carriers, I'm always surprised at (1) how quickly the seat belt sign gets turned off after take-off, (2) how long they wait before turning the sign on before landing (often just 10-15 min before landing) and (3) the level of turbulence it actually takes for the sign to go on.
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Old Mar 26, 13, 9:35 am
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JonMST I appreciate your post. Customer compliance is always a sticky issue for us and trying to enforce it can be tough. Trust me when I say that your safety is not only my priority but that of my fellow crewmembers. If anything every bothers you please continue to bring it to our attention and we will do our best to confront the issue so you feel safe and comfortable.

You'd be amazed how many times we just past through 10,000ft and we are getting ready to start service and a customer rings and asks if they can use the bathroom. I want to ask why they didn't go before boarding, one of the few things that runs through my head but I don't and I politely inform them that the seatbelt sign is on and I can't give them permission to get up and that it is at their own risk but I do recommend that they stay seated for their own safety as well as the safety of the other customers onboard but I know what can happen when nature calls or there is some other sort of emergency. I can see it now, I deny a customer access to the bathroom and they have an accident and go running to CNN or FOX or NBC and it's a PR nightmare. I can also see the otherside if we do give them permission and we hit a bump and they make like superman and break a leg or an arm or hurt another customer, same story is going to play out. If we are asked to stay seated or it is extremely bumpy I will make several PA's saying the bathrooms are unavailable until it smooths out but when an emergency calls an emergency calls.

If I know it is going to be bumpy I'll make an announcement before we depart informing customers as such and that they may want to complete any business in the overheads or lavs before we leave because of the bumps. I advocate getting everything situated as you board the plane in case the seatbelt sign is on for an extended period of time. Plan ahead and be prepared, headphones out, bathroom visited, food available and luggage stowed and anything else that I may need or need to take care of.

Still despite all the announcements and suggestions we make or try to convey we are still going to have customers in their own world doing their own thing regardless of the environment and situation around them. This goes in any environment and not just in the aircraft.

If you ever don't feel safe for any reason do not hesitate to bring it to our attention. There is no stupid worry when it comes to the cabin. We want everybody onboard to feel safe and comfortable. Safety is our number 1 value.
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Old Mar 26, 13, 10:11 am
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On a recent YUL-ORD flight with UA, the seat belt sign remained lit for a little while after take-off. I asked the FA if I could use the lavatory and they said "We can't tell you no." If it matters, I was in F. But I have had the same thing happen a couple times before in both F and Y.

Just my two cents.
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