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Itinerary for Senior First timers in Japan

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Itinerary for Senior First timers in Japan

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Old Dec 10, 2018, 9:22 am
  #16  
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Originally Posted by tt7
Do you really need to spend another day/night in Tokyo before you fly home? I would do what you're going to do in Tokyo, then go to Kyoto and then take the train from there to Narita (if it's not possible, as already suggested, to fly out of Osaka <KIX>). Getting from Kyoto to Narita on the train would take about four hours, so if you leave before lunch you should be able to make it to Narita for an 18.05 flight.

A 7 day Japan Rail Pass (¥29,110) would be worthwhile as it would be marginally cheaper than individual tickets (Tokyo - Kyoto = ¥13,800 + Kyoto - Narita = ¥16,780). Any additional usage you get from the pass would be a bonus. The only downside to a JR Pass is that you can't use the Nozomi Shinkansen (the most frequent and fastest) and have to use the Hikari Shinkansen (usually two per hour Tokyo - Kyoto). They're a bit slower but only because they make a few more stops, not because the train goes any slower. If you're not already familiar with it, use HyperDia for everything you ever wanted to know about train times, fares, track numbers and generally how to get from A to B (and if you need any help figuring out how to use it, please just ask).

You should also get IC (Suica) cards. These are prepaid transit cards that can be used to pay for trains (but not the seat fee), buses, subways and can also be used at convenience stores (7-Eleven, Family Mart, Lawson). Much, much easier than getting a ticket every time you want to hop on a train or the subway. There are a number of regional variations (Suica, Pasmo, Icoca, Nimoco etc.) but they operate interchangeably throughout Japan (more or less). Suica is issued by JR East in Tokyo, Pasmo by the non-JR private railways/subways in Tokyo - I'd get a Suica. If you have iPhones (8, X, XR, XS), you can load a virtual Suica card in Apple Wallet and top it up using Apple Pay - very convenient. If you get a physical card, it can be topped up at ticket machines (but cash only).
https://www.japan-guide.com/e/e2359_003.html
Very good information from all of you. Thanks a lot. I already booked the rooms last night for Tokyo-Kyoto-Tokyo tour. I could cancel the rooms via Booking.com without penalty if needed but let me think again. If I go straight from Kyoto to Narita then I have to cancel everything and book the rooms all over. Like I said, the reason I booked in that order in the first place was to take an advice from a co-worker. But now I realize that my chance of seeing Sakura is almost zero (even no one knows when it happens in March/April 2019 exactly). Yes, I planned to get a Suica card but I don't have an iphone so I will physically charge the card with cash.
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Old Dec 10, 2018, 11:22 am
  #17  
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Originally Posted by ksandness
You've done a lot of research, but are you aware that the fish market has moved to a less convenient location and has limited access? Also, why do you want to go to Ginza? It's one of the most expensive areas of Tokyo, filled mostly with expensive shops and restaurants, and the only really interesting spot for the first-time visitor is the new Kabuki theater. You can buy tickets for one act only and rent headphones that give an English narration. However, if you do go to Ginza, this might be the opportunity to explore the wonders of a Japanese department store. They not only sell everything imaginable but also have gourmet supermarkets in their basements and at least one, sometimes two or three floors of restaurants.

Never worry about where to eat. There is always a budget restaurant (meals for US$15 or less) nearby with either a picture menu or plastic models of the food in the window. In fact, the problem is often deciding where NOT to eat. Many of these small restaurants specialize in one category of food, such as noodles, sushi, o-konomiyaki (somewhere between an eggy crepe or a floury omelet with your choice of seafood, meat or vegetable ingredients), or Korean barbecue (meat that you grill yourself at the table). I have never gotten sick eating in one of these places, and by the way, if you haven't learned this otherwise, the tap water is safe to drink.

Unless the menu says that your meal includes a beverage, be content with water and quench your thirst by buying something from one of the countless vending machines that you will see on the street. The extra beverage may cost almost as much as the meal.

If you're really low budget, you can find surprisingly good box lunches in the convenience stores, and the clerks will heat them in the microwave for you. Many hotels, even in the budget category, provide coffee or tea and some kind of breakfast in the morning, even if it is just toast or sweet rolls or o-nigiri rice balls. If not, most coffee shops have something available for breakfast. The non-chain coffee shops (more and more rare these days) provide "morning service," that is, coffee or tea with toast, a hard-boiled egg, and a salad.

Asakusa, Ueno, and the Tokyo Sky Tree are worth seeing, as is the nearby Edo Tokyo Museum of life during the samurai era. In fact, your parents might enjoy the small, hands-on Sh*tamachi Museum near Ueno Park, with its exhibits about everyday life in prewar Tokyo.

If you're staying in Ikebukuro, you can get to Ueno on the JR Yamanote loop line, and from there, three subway stops to Asakusa.
Thanks for the info. We go to Ginza just to window-shop. We can't afford anything there except the lunch box food.
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Old Dec 10, 2018, 1:23 pm
  #18  
 
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I recently did the same trip with my parents, though we didn't stay as long as you're planning.

In Kyoto:The ryokan's are an experience in Kyoto. They'll usually take care of dinner and breakfast. It's a little pricey compared to an Airbnb. One thing you should look out for with Airbnb's is choosing a place near the subway line. Otherwise you'll have to take a taxi everywhere. Also keep in mind if you plan on walking everywhere, Kyoto is a little more spread out than you'd expect.

If you find yourself in Shibuya/Tokyo, Sushi No Midori has excellent cheap sushi. It's quite popular due to the cheap price, expect a line: https://goo.gl/maps/4v3ddphduc42

Second on the IC cards. They're very convenient, highly suggest them. Works for local buses in Kyoto too (board from back, pay up front when you leave, same with the local trains in Kyoto). If you're planning on buying local prepaid SIM cards in Japan, check out the vending machines at NRT. They're cheaper than the walk up counters. Download the Google Translate app, very useful for when asking for help.

You can definitely leave Kyoto for an afternoon flight in NRT. We had a 2pm flight in NRT, I think we ended up taking the 7am Shinkansen to Tokyo Station with a transfer to the Airport Express.
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Old Dec 10, 2018, 2:08 pm
  #19  
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Originally Posted by caburrito
I recently did the same trip with my parents, though we didn't stay as long as you're planning.

In Kyoto:The ryokan's are an experience in Kyoto. They'll usually take care of dinner and breakfast. It's a little pricey compared to an Airbnb. One thing you should look out for with Airbnb's is choosing a place near the subway line. Otherwise you'll have to take a taxi everywhere. Also keep in mind if you plan on walking everywhere, Kyoto is a little more spread out than you'd expect.

If you find yourself in Shibuya/Tokyo, Sushi No Midori has excellent cheap sushi. It's quite popular due to the cheap price, expect a line: https://goo.gl/maps/4v3ddphduc42

Second on the IC cards. They're very convenient, highly suggest them. Works for local buses in Kyoto too (board from back, pay up front when you leave, same with the local trains in Kyoto). If you're planning on buying local prepaid SIM cards in Japan, check out the vending machines at NRT. They're cheaper than the walk up counters. Download the Google Translate app, very useful for when asking for help.

You can definitely leave Kyoto for an afternoon flight in NRT. We had a 2pm flight in NRT, I think we ended up taking the 7am Shinkansen to Tokyo Station with a transfer to the Airport Express.
Thanks. Since the airfares have been bought, hotels have been booked, Sakura watching is pretty much out of the window, what I'm opening to this forum's advice is the places we could go to maximize Japan experience during the stay.
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Old Dec 10, 2018, 2:33 pm
  #20  
 
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Just a couple of things to add...
  • ​​​​​​The JR Rail Pass includes the Narita Express (NEX) train so you might as well take advantage of it. Just remember to activate your passes at the JR office as soon as you're done with customs.
  • JR Rail Pass includes all JR lines so take advantage of it whenever you can. Particularly useful in Tokyo with the Yamanote Loop Line, which has stops at every major part of Tokyo, including Ikebukuro.
  • Another perk of using an IC card like Suica or Pasmo is that some of the private lines in Tokyo offer discounted fares when you pay with an IC card instead of cash.
  • Probably a good idea to take a guided tour of Kyoto if you want to see all of the popular attractions there, but keep in mind that Kyoto is absolutely crawling with tourists so be prepared for crowds.
  • Unfortunately, many, if not most, of the historical landmarks in Japan, and especially in Kyoto, are not particularly friendly to the handicapped and elderly so it might be worth it to do a bit of research. Many of the temples and shrines have stairs/steps and rugged paths that may be difficult to walk. There are websites such as Accessible Japan that have some useful information about many of the major attractions in Japan so definitely check them out before you make your plans. Fushimi-Inari Shrine, for example, is a hugely popular spot, but it is built on a mountain. While main shrine is certainly accessible, the major highlight--the tunnels built of orange torii gates--is basically a serpentine climb up a mountain, and it can take hours just to make your way through it all.
  • With the last bit of info in mind, you should also know that Tokyo isn't particularly built for the elderly or handicapped. Many of the subway and railway stations in Japan have limited access to elevators and escalators so note your surroundings. Things are improving with the Olympics arriving in 2020, but there are still some major gaps. Pay attention to the video screens in the subway/railway cars and note the location of any elevators and escalators on the screen. They will usually flash the information prior to every stop. It will certainly save you some time when traveling with your parents.
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Old Dec 10, 2018, 2:53 pm
  #21  
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Originally Posted by hanajiro
Just a couple of things to add...
  • ​​​​​​The JR Rail Pass includes the Narita Express (NEX) train so you might as well take advantage of it. Just remember to activate your passes at the JR office as soon as you're done with customs.
  • JR Rail Pass includes all JR lines so take advantage of it whenever you can. Particularly useful in Tokyo with the Yamanote Loop Line, which has stops at every major part of Tokyo, including Ikebukuro.
  • Another perk of using an IC card like Suica or Pasmo is that some of the private lines in Tokyo offer discounted fares when you pay with an IC card instead of cash.
  • Probably a good idea to take a guided tour of Kyoto if you want to see all of the popular attractions there, but keep in mind that Kyoto is absolutely crawling with tourists so be prepared for crowds.
  • Unfortunately, many, if not most, of the historical landmarks in Japan, and especially in Kyoto, are not particularly friendly to the handicapped and elderly so it might be worth it to do a bit of research. Many of the temples and shrines have stairs/steps and rugged paths that may be difficult to walk. There are websites such as Accessible Japan that have some useful information about many of the major attractions in Japan so definitely check them out before you make your plans. Fushimi-Inari Shrine, for example, is a hugely popular spot, but it is built on a mountain. While main shrine is certainly accessible, the major highlight--the tunnels built of orange torii gates--is basically a serpentine climb up a mountain, and it can take hours just to make your way through it all.
  • With the last bit of info in mind, you should also know that Tokyo isn't particularly built for the elderly or handicapped. Many of the subway and railway stations in Japan have limited access to elevators and escalators so note your surroundings. Things are improving with the Olympics arriving in 2020, but there are still some major gaps. Pay attention to the video screens in the subway/railway cars and note the location of any elevators and escalators on the screen. They will usually flash the information prior to every stop. It will certainly save you some time when traveling with your parents.
Very good information there, my friend. Meaning I have to re-consider the places we plan to go. Such a pity that the famous Fushimi-Inari Shrine is now pretty much off the list because my mom will use a basic lightweight wheel chair (not electric) with her almost all the time of the tour. On top of your head, what other places required elevated walking? Thx.
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Old Dec 10, 2018, 3:26 pm
  #22  
 
Join Date: Mar 2016
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Originally Posted by fandi
Very good information there, my friend. Meaning I have to re-consider the places we plan to go. Such a pity that the famous Fushimi-Inari Shrine is now pretty much off the list because my mom will use a basic lightweight wheel chair (not electric) with her almost all the time of the tour. On top of your head, what other places required elevated walking? Thx.
I wouldn't necessarily cross it off the list, but I would reconsider my expectations of what you would be able to do/see while you are there. The main shrine is fairly accessible, and you can access the early portion of the tunnel before it starts to climb up the mountain. That said, I think that most people who visit the shrine do not make it all the way through because it would take hours as the grounds are massive. There is plenty to see around the main shrine so I would definitely keep it on the list.

Here are some resources that do a great job of discussing accessibility in Japan, complete with photos and maps of many of the major tourist attractions in Japan. Hope this helps!

https://www.accessible-japan.com
Japan Accessible Tourism Center
https://accessible-japan.jp

IMO, the biggest hurdle other than the lack of accessibility will be the crowds. Kiyomizu-dera is a must see, but it is absolutely packed with people during peak visiting hours.
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Old Dec 10, 2018, 6:52 pm
  #23  
 
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If your folks managed in Italy fine, then I think Jpn should be more than doable. Getting around should be easier in Jpn, although handicap access is still not at the level of US or HKG.

I agree with someone who said to just go straight to NRT from Kyoto on the last day, as opposed to bothering to spend one night in Tokyo before the flight. Change from bullet train to NEx at Shinagawa instead of Tokyo station, though. Even though one could theoretically make this transfer in a few minutes, I'd recommend allowing at least 25min just because you're not familiar, your mom's mobility issues and possibility that train could run late.

Grand Via Hotel in Kyoto is a very nice hotel indeed. But it looks like you're more into budget lodging. Grand Via in Kyoto is quite expensive. Kintetsu is right at the station, but it's only slightly cheaper than Grand Via. Keihan Grande Hotel is across the street from the station so quite convenient and cheaper than Grand Via or Kintetsu usually, with rooms that have ability to accommodate 3 adults. It's still not a budget hotel but perhaps worth looking into.

That place you want to stay in Ikebukuro doesn't look that great. Looks more like a hostal than a hotel. Ikebukuro itself is a location that gets dumped on in this forum, although I personally have a lot of affection for Ikebukuro, there's amazing variety of food/shopping and energy there, and I think it's a fine place to base yourself in Tokyo. Nonetheless your place is in a sort of a weird location that's a good 15min walk from the station entrance, 20min really to get to JR platform. What's your hotel budget?
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Old Dec 10, 2018, 7:25 pm
  #24  
 
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While Ikebukuro is a fine location for younger, more active visitors, I'd suggest reconsidering for older, mobility-impaired folks. One of the more centrally located areas, near at least one station would make more sense.
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Old Dec 10, 2018, 7:58 pm
  #25  
 
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Originally Posted by abmj-jr
While Ikebukuro is a fine location for younger, more active visitors, I'd suggest reconsidering for older, mobility-impaired folks. One of the more centrally located areas, near at least one station would make more sense.
Also, Ikebukuro Station is one of the more chaotic stations in Tokyo. Its layout leaves a lot to be desired, and it leads to people walking in all sorts of directions in the concourse. It's so common for people to bump into one another that they don't bother apologizing when it happens. From many places, the most feasible way to get down to the basement concourse without stairs is to actually enter the department store and take its escalator. That's confusing if you're not familiar with the station. Shinjuku Station gets much more traffic, but Ikebukuro Station is definitely more chaotic and probably more difficult for handicapped people.

If you're trying to save money, perhaps compromise on the location a bit by going a bit further out (like Kawasaki). But I wouldn't compromise on the ease of access to a train station or, to an extent, the quality of accommodation.
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Old Dec 10, 2018, 10:12 pm
  #26  
 
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Even though Tsukiji has closed - that is the auction part AFAIK the little shops and restaurants are mostly still open and are a lot of fun.
If you don't already know Japan is a surprisingly cash oriented society - most of the smaller local restaurants only take cash. As for your question about cc - it depends - in the US there are many cc that do not charge foreign exchange fees. If you have one of those and want to charge something in Japan DO NOT say yes when they ask if you want to charge in your home currency - there is a DCC (dynamic currency conversion) scam operated by many banks which means if you chose the non country currency you pay a 3-10% extra fee b/c the exchange rate they use is so bad.
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Old Dec 11, 2018, 12:20 am
  #27  
tt7
 
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Originally Posted by hanajiro
Just a couple of things to add...
  • ​​​​​​The JR Rail Pass includes the Narita Express (NEX) train so you might as well take advantage of it. Just remember to activate your passes at the JR office as soon as you're done with customs.
You may well want to exchange your voucher for the JR Pass as soon as you arrive ("done with customs") but that's not necessarily the same as activating it. If you're in Japan for 9 days and you have a 7 day JR pass, you'll have two days not covered by the pass. Depending on what you decide to do about returning to Tokyo for a night (or two) before you depart or going direct to Narita from Kyoto, you may want to activate the pass on day one (in which case it will expire after day 7) or activate it on day 3 (in which case it will get you back to Narita). Either way, you will have to pay separately for one trip from/to Narita, either when you arrive or when you leave.

When you buy the JR Pass (before you leave home), what you will receive is a voucher which you then take to the ticket office to exchange for the actual pass. When you do that (which you can do on arrival) make sure to tell them what day you want it to start (either day one or day three, depending on what you decide about Kyoto/Tokyo/Narita).
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Old Dec 11, 2018, 12:31 am
  #28  
 
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The key to best use of the JR Rail Pass is to make sure it is active for the longest, most expensive travel days - travel on the shinkansen and other longer trips. If you do adopt the idea of going straight from Kyoto to NRT, that will be your most expensive day. Make sure it is covered by the Pass for both the shinkansen to Shinagawa Station and the Narita Express from Shinagawa to NRT. That would mean using cash, credit card or IC card for the first trip into the city from NRT. Depending on where you are staying that first night, you may be traveling on the Narita Express, the limo-bus or even the Keisei Skyliner or Access Express.
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Old Dec 11, 2018, 4:25 am
  #29  
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Originally Posted by abmj-jr
While Ikebukuro is a fine location for younger, more active visitors, I'd suggest reconsidering for older, mobility-impaired folks. One of the more centrally located areas, near at least one station would make more sense.
I agree.
I have visited Japan as a wheelchair user and as a convalescent and, although Tokyo as a whole is much easier to navigate when mobility impaired than many people seem to think it is, Ikebukuro was one of the few areas that I found challenging.

Going further out (eg Kawasaki) I would say was a really, really bad idea as it will force your group to repeatedly confront very heavy congestion on the trains and subways. (Sorry evergrn, not one of your finest ideas)
From personal experience coming from the perspective of a wheelchair user and as someone who has taken my own parents to Japan (and who regularly stays with and travels around Tokyo and beyond with my Japanese father-in-law who is also in his 70s), I recommend a hotel in the Shinagawa area. For value for money and good quality I particularly recommend the Grand Prince Takanawa and the New Grand Prince Takanawa Hotels. If you are using points then the ANA IC Strings and the Marriott Sakura Tower are also fine bases.
I haven’t stayed at the Keikyu Ex Hotel Shinagawa EkiMae since it was a Grand Pacific and part of Sheraton group. If you can find a competitive price the location itself is excellent and may well serve your needs. Many forum regulars will know it as the unfortunately named “Hotel Goos’.
Edit to add - All of these hotels have good size rooms and bathrooms that are not a squeeze.

Last edited by LapLap; Dec 11, 2018 at 8:59 am
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Old Dec 11, 2018, 8:21 am
  #30  
 
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This is not Japan specific, but experience from traveling with my elderly folks. All my suggestions will cost more…

Traveling with elderly would you entertain making use of taxi to get around Tokyo? Not all stairs on stations do have escalators in Tokyo, most stations do have elevators these days at Tokyo but usually there is only one at a station and can get you out at the wrong side of the station. Some subway stations have very long walk and subway stations usually require multipole elevators to get to the station platform. We always used public transportation, was not much of taxi people. But when my folks started to require little longer time to navigate around stations or difficulty walking that is when we started to make use of taxi.

Regarding staying at budget hotels. Room and bath facilities at those budget hotels and business hotels are typically very small. My elderly folks could not use those small baths in a business hotel comfortably, some baths in those budget hotels can be quite cramped. That’s when I started to put my folks at Hilton Tokyo or Conrad Tokyo, not because we always had a taste for upper scale hotels.

Also, we tried not to plan thing a lot when we traveled with our elderly folks. Some time we even had a day without any plan. There were times we could not do everything we planned, things can take a lot longer than we planned with elderly due to lack of escalators or such at stations. Having one blank day to catch up with schedule was something good to have.
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