murphyUA

Greetings

I'm in the midst of planning a trip to Japan for next year (October). Currently (and I'm thinking this is close to being 'final'), I have the following. In total, a 15 night trip:

Arrive HND 5pm
3 nights Tokyo
1 night at Hakone area Ryokan
3 nights Osaka
3 nights Kyoto
3 nights Kanazawa
KMQ-CTS
2 nights Hokkaido
CTS-NRT

I've been to Japan once before and followed a similar track (replacing Fukuoka with Kanazawa), and stayed mostly in the cities.

My questions are this:

1. I've been to Sapporo and enjoyed it immensely. I'd like to stay in Niseko this time at the Park Hyatt. It will be October (and I don't ski anyway). Is this a good idea for generally exploring both the immediate Niseko area and possibly further out? Hikes, etc? Or would this be better spent in Sapporo proper? Or somewhere else?

2. Any red flags on the itinerary as presented? Other thoughts? I'd like to do more suburban things this time but also stay in the cities listed. Make more excursions during the day outside the cities and return for dinner, for example.

abmj-jr

IMHO there is no need to change hotels between Osaka and Kyoto. Assuming you are traveling on a Japan Rail Pass, the two cities are minutes apart on the shinkansen. Even using local trains, they are close enough to easily do day trips to one or the other.

I think you could enjoyably adjust your city allocation to give a productive day or more to Hokkaido, adding a full day or two to Hakodate which is an historic and interesting stay. I'd also recommend a day into the mountains for some really spectacular fall color in October. https://matcha-jp.com/en/1336

RichardInSF

I am thinking of spending a few nights in Niseko at the PH at around the same time. Clearly one needs to rent a car to/from CTS but that's all I have figured out so far.

If you didn't go to the restored Meiji village outside of Sapporo on your first visit, that is worth a half day trip. It can be reached from central Sapporo by train followed by either walking or taking a local bus. I think it's called Kaitaku-no Mura.

AlwaysAisle

Peak of the foliage around Niseko area is usually beginning of October to mid October. Niseko in October can be busy tourist season due to the foliage, before the ski season starts. If you are imagining Niseko in October as quiet time before the ski season starts, then there can be more tourists that you may think during October at Niseko. Along the same line, if you are thinking you will be visiting Niseko during off season then hotels may not be as cheap as you may think due to tourists by the foliage.

I like nature setting, so if I were you I will plan more time at a place like Niseko. But if you like a city setting then I think your plan will work fine.

shuigao

2 days in Hokkaido during autumn leaves season is really short. I might skip Niseko entirely and do 1 day in Noboribetsu (hiking, visiting hell valley, and sampling the huge onsen at dai ichi takimotokan), and another day at jozankei onsen / hoheikyo dam.

evergrn

I only go to Niseko in summer, but it is beautiful there. The green pastures and Mt.Yotei, rafting, onsen, food... it's all amazing. I don't know what it's like there in autumn, but I'm pretty sure autumn has its own charm.

If you're staying at a place like PH, wouldn't you want to maximize your time there to thoroughly enjoy the luxury and R&R? In that case, if you're only staying 2 nights, maybe just enjoy the resort and Niseko and not do too much touring around. I'm not sure if PH has onsen, but Niseko has pretty good onsen. Keep in mind that you have to figure ~2.5hrs to drive from CTS to Niseko. 2 nights seem really short, although it depends on your flight times. For instance, if your flight out of CTS is at 11am, you'd have to leave PH so early. I think that, if you're going to go all the way up to Hokkaido, you could consider shifting some of your 9 nights from Kansai/Kanazawa to Hokkaido. If you move 3 more nights over to Hokkaido, then that'll open up a lot more options for you up there. You could then also check out places like Hakodate and Onuma (in which case you'd probably want to fly into Hakodate).

fimo

Another vote for 2 nights in Hokkaido being way short. As evergrn suggests, you can consider flying into one airport and out another so save driving time. Hakodate is a popular gateway. I would suggest 3-4 nights at least in Hokkaido, perhaps take a night each from Kanazawa and Kansai (and collapse Kyoto and Osaka into a single hotel in Osaka).

murphyUA

Thanks everyone for all the suggestions! It's much appreciated!

Concerto

I didn't find fhe eating choices in the Niseko area massively good, in fact they were downright disappointing. Lonely Planet's recommendations were just, well, underwhelming. I ended up in a bar that served ramen both nights (Otsukisama and Bar Moon) and it was pretty good...but not mind blowing.

EDIT - I have to add that the Hilton Niseko resort offered such a good and bountiful breakfast that I didn't need anything all day until the evening. The cluster of eating establishments in the ski resort style shopping area behind the Hilton hotel did not get good reviews online, so I didn't try them.

murphyUA

I think I've decided against Niseko. I'll probably either spend the 2 nights in Sapporo, or perhaps forget about Hokkaido and add nights earlier in the trip.

Kannai

A couple thoughts:

I highly recommend Hakodate somewhat near Sapporo. It's a charming small city with a lovely port.

Do you have concrete plans for things to do in Osaka? I never understand why people go there. It's got slightly different food and a rather different accent from Tokyo but unless you reeeeally know Japanese food and speak the accent, it'll be lost on you. Aside from that, it's just a large city that's less organized and has less to do than Tokyo. I'd opt for the more beautiful nearby city of Kobe. Either way, I'd definitely pop down and see Himeji Castle.

FWIW, Kobe and Hakodate are a couple of the cities that had early foreign settlements in the mid to late 19th century and have little architectural remnants of those communities. (Nagasaki is famous for it's tiny Dutch settlement throughout the so-called "closed country" period, while Yokohama was the first port to open up and is possibly worth a day-trip from Tokyo if you've already done lots of things there as it has a very different vibe.)

gengar

If you need to free up nights, I'd merge Kyoto and Osaka, stay solely in one or the other (based on personal preference, though I personally would choose Kyoto), and drop that portion of the itinerary to 3-4 nights especially since you've been there before. I honestly don't find Osaka interesting. In any case, Kyoto, Osaka, and Kobe are all easy day trips from one another.

evergrn

I've only been to Niseko in summer, but we've been 5+ times and I agree with the dining comment.
The few places that are good in Niseko tend to be packed. I was told Niseko is good for soba. Went to a place called Ichimura which was very busy, good but not great, and overpriced. I read that Ishimame is the crown-jewel of soba places in the area, but we gave up because of the long wait.
I guess the best thing about Niseko food-wise are the bakeries and sweets. Milk Kobo continues to be very special, and the new bakery Haru is really excellent.

That little artificial village in the back of Hilton is so dead, I can't believe they bother to keep places open. The place is like a ghost town except there's music playing and the establishments are actually open. Actually this past summer I think they may have decided to keep some places closed. I hope that place is rocking in the winter time to make up for the summer lull.

I think you're on the right track there.

murphyUA

I understand the love for Kyoto, which I agree with, but I also hold the unpopular opinion of a love for Osaka. Yes, I love the food, but the people and culture of Osaka is unlike any other city in Japan, and I don't think I'd have as rich of a trip if I "merged" Kyoto and Osaka.

Again, I understand the love for Kyoto, but don't be hatin' on Osaka. It's weird and different, but the people are beyond awesome and I can't wait to return.

evergrn

I think the recommendation to "merge" Kyoto and Osaka (which I concur with) was to allow you to maintain a single base from which to explore both Kyoto and Osaka, so as not to have to switch hotels which is always a real pain. If you stay in Umeda, it's only 30min by JR to Kyoto station, 40min by Hankyu to Kawaramachi (which is Kyoto's center).

Also, I don't think there was intention to hate on Osaka, and you're certainly not the only foreign visitor to have a unique affinity for Osaka as opposed to Tokyo. Osaka certainly is different than Tokyo. However, I do think the concensus is that, for most visitors who've only been to Jpn once or twice before, Osaka may feel like just another metropolis similar to Tokyo (only Osaka feels more chaotic yet Tokyo area offers more in terms of food and things to see/do). So that may be where that advice to sway you away from Osaka was coming from.