Ski-in/out resort
#76
Join Date: Sep 2009
Posts: 1,468
Can you get a car? I don't bother treating the Hakuba resorts as individual as they each have barely enough terrain for a couple of laps on each and you could be done by midday on the first skiing day.
What about Myoko? Similarly, 3 resorts but the shuttles are better than hakuba so you probably don't even need a car.
I think the Tribute is often more expensive than the Sheraton at Kiroro, and that place is sooo flat! Kiroro is for the BC access I reckon.
Last year we went to Shokanbetsu and camped in the backcountry hut there. That's probably not an option :P but we then based out of Furano. I really like furano as a little resort and there are lots of BC day trips you could take to start to get away from expensive and crowded resorts!
What about Myoko? Similarly, 3 resorts but the shuttles are better than hakuba so you probably don't even need a car.
I think the Tribute is often more expensive than the Sheraton at Kiroro, and that place is sooo flat! Kiroro is for the BC access I reckon.
Last year we went to Shokanbetsu and camped in the backcountry hut there. That's probably not an option :P but we then based out of Furano. I really like furano as a little resort and there are lots of BC day trips you could take to start to get away from expensive and crowded resorts!
#77
Original Poster
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: Hilton, Hyatt House, Del Taco
Posts: 5,369
Can you get a car? I don't bother treating the Hakuba resorts as individual as they each have barely enough terrain for a couple of laps on each and you could be done by midday on the first skiing day.
What about Myoko? Similarly, 3 resorts but the shuttles are better than hakuba so you probably don't even need a car.
I think the Tribute is often more expensive than the Sheraton at Kiroro, and that place is sooo flat! Kiroro is for the BC access I reckon.
Last year we went to Shokanbetsu and camped in the backcountry hut there. That's probably not an option :P but we then based out of Furano. I really like furano as a little resort and there are lots of BC day trips you could take to start to get away from expensive and crowded resorts!
What about Myoko? Similarly, 3 resorts but the shuttles are better than hakuba so you probably don't even need a car.
I think the Tribute is often more expensive than the Sheraton at Kiroro, and that place is sooo flat! Kiroro is for the BC access I reckon.
Last year we went to Shokanbetsu and camped in the backcountry hut there. That's probably not an option :P but we then based out of Furano. I really like furano as a little resort and there are lots of BC day trips you could take to start to get away from expensive and crowded resorts!
I only have secondhand knowledge of ski places in Jpn without much firsthand experience, so we very much appreciate your advice throughout this ski season.
Since shuigao is upper-novice/low-intermediate, I don't think he's looking for back country experience. I'm certainly not into that myself.
Have you skiied Cortina and Norikura? If so, can you provide feedback as far as crowd, whether they tend to keep all lifts open, having to go between the two areas, etc?
With regards to Kiroro, my experience has been that Tribute is more often the cheaper of the two hotels during ski seasons. Hence I've booked Tribute for this winter.
You are right that Kiroro has a lot of almost-flat areas. However, it is not completely flat like some runs at Whistler. When Kiroro is fully open like it was when I skiied there this past March, it is easy to avoid those near-flat terrains. The flat terrain is really just the lower half of the left side of the resort, plus the lower half of the run that comes down from the top of the right side of the mountain. I tried to avoid that area by doing all my skiing in the upper half of the left side of the resort (three great long runs up there) and the lower right part of the resort (few long runs down there). I had a blast skiing those runs over the course of two days. I do think Kiroro would really suck if they closed down the summits, as that would severely limit options for anyone who's above beginner level. Wonder how often that happens.
#78
Join Date: Sep 2009
Posts: 1,468
Probably will be mostly us 3!
I try to only comment on resorts I've skiied, and will always mention if what I'm posting is hearsay.
The BC in Japan is so good that I highly recommend it to novices looking for a different experience, and if you get the bug you'll thank me later. It's very different to USA/Canada/others spring skiing. You generally end up with fields of untouched deep powder with not tonnes of effort.
Regardless:
Cortina thoughts.
It's set up so that most people funnel back to the middle, making it feel crowded until you get out to the sides. Lifts can close to the summit relatively easily due to snow load AND wind load issues. It gets hit very hard on powder days and isn't too much fun after as it's mogul-y and skiied out. They tend to open it in stages it seems, so the middle opens then the rest, but maybe those were just the cloudy days I rode or something. Didn't go to Norikura, from the map it looks quite small.
I try to only comment on resorts I've skiied, and will always mention if what I'm posting is hearsay.
The BC in Japan is so good that I highly recommend it to novices looking for a different experience, and if you get the bug you'll thank me later. It's very different to USA/Canada/others spring skiing. You generally end up with fields of untouched deep powder with not tonnes of effort.
Regardless:
Cortina thoughts.
It's set up so that most people funnel back to the middle, making it feel crowded until you get out to the sides. Lifts can close to the summit relatively easily due to snow load AND wind load issues. It gets hit very hard on powder days and isn't too much fun after as it's mogul-y and skiied out. They tend to open it in stages it seems, so the middle opens then the rest, but maybe those were just the cloudy days I rode or something. Didn't go to Norikura, from the map it looks quite small.
#79
Original Poster
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: Hilton, Hyatt House, Del Taco
Posts: 5,369
Thanks for the feedback on Cortina. That really helps. Based on your comments, I'm inclined to scratch Cortina off my list for this winter. It would probably be back to NASPA or Kiroro then... more likely NASPA.
Have you been to Aomori Spring, by chance?
Tell me if I'm wrong, but wouldn't Dec have higher chances of blizzard and heavy snowfall than mid-late Feb (which is when we're going back for another ski trip)?
For ski resorts that have tendency to close lifts readily and have terrain that gets severely compromised by summit lift closures, do you think you're better off going in Feb than Dec?
Kiroro seems to close their summit lifts (inc gondola) often, so maybe you're taking bigger risk if you were to go there in Dec?
On the other hand, I was at NASPA last Dec where the snow was coming down hard and the wind was howling. But surprisingly they kept the lifts going (only a few diehards kept skiing).
If you think an intermediate (at best) skier can handle backcountry skiing in Jpn, I'll have to look into it.
Have you been to Aomori Spring, by chance?
Tell me if I'm wrong, but wouldn't Dec have higher chances of blizzard and heavy snowfall than mid-late Feb (which is when we're going back for another ski trip)?
For ski resorts that have tendency to close lifts readily and have terrain that gets severely compromised by summit lift closures, do you think you're better off going in Feb than Dec?
Kiroro seems to close their summit lifts (inc gondola) often, so maybe you're taking bigger risk if you were to go there in Dec?
On the other hand, I was at NASPA last Dec where the snow was coming down hard and the wind was howling. But surprisingly they kept the lifts going (only a few diehards kept skiing).
If you think an intermediate (at best) skier can handle backcountry skiing in Jpn, I'll have to look into it.
#80
Join Date: Mar 2015
Programs: HH Diamond, GHA Titanium
Posts: 1,955
@Cynicor @evergrn thanks!
I probably can go in March instead of Feb so I'll go check out prices of the Hokkaido resorts then (also will look at Furano). Otherwise Myoko Kogen looks interesting too.
I've got 1/4 a mind to do a full ski trip this time - something like 2-3 days each in 2-3 locations. But I'm not sure if my legs would be able to take it -- problem of having only one ski week a year
I probably can go in March instead of Feb so I'll go check out prices of the Hokkaido resorts then (also will look at Furano). Otherwise Myoko Kogen looks interesting too.
I've got 1/4 a mind to do a full ski trip this time - something like 2-3 days each in 2-3 locations. But I'm not sure if my legs would be able to take it -- problem of having only one ski week a year
#81
Original Poster
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: Hilton, Hyatt House, Del Taco
Posts: 5,369
this winter Im taking my own boots everywhere. Im done renting boots. I think that will help my feet some.
#82
Join Date: Sep 2009
Posts: 1,468
Have not been to Aomori springs, sorry.
December is a poor month where you are at the mercy of snow cover more than anything. Look at the 2015 and 2016 Dec figures for Hakuba and you'll see even past Christmas they were sometimes skiing on rock and grass! Hokkaido is the only place for Dec skiing if you need to book in advance, and they charge like wounded bulls at that time.
i agree late feb is preferable, though weather is as likely to shut things down at either time I feel. Late feb has possibility of rain which solidifies and makes the runs bulletproof. No one wants to fall on sheet ice.
I do truly believe that the backcountry is much more accessible in Japan than anywhere. It's harder on skis so you'd want powder skiing experience from the resort, but I know 2 guides (one is a local, Japanese lady) who would be excellent for beginners if interested.
This year the big snow trip for me is Kyrgyzstan but I will be in Niseko region late Feb, too.
December is a poor month where you are at the mercy of snow cover more than anything. Look at the 2015 and 2016 Dec figures for Hakuba and you'll see even past Christmas they were sometimes skiing on rock and grass! Hokkaido is the only place for Dec skiing if you need to book in advance, and they charge like wounded bulls at that time.
i agree late feb is preferable, though weather is as likely to shut things down at either time I feel. Late feb has possibility of rain which solidifies and makes the runs bulletproof. No one wants to fall on sheet ice.
I do truly believe that the backcountry is much more accessible in Japan than anywhere. It's harder on skis so you'd want powder skiing experience from the resort, but I know 2 guides (one is a local, Japanese lady) who would be excellent for beginners if interested.
This year the big snow trip for me is Kyrgyzstan but I will be in Niseko region late Feb, too.
#83
Join Date: Sep 2009
Posts: 1,468
And your own gear helps a lot. Esp with boots for skiers. If you can justify the whole kit, get a decent set of powder skis, bindings and boots and start hitting the fresh stuff on the side/invetween pistes.
i did my first bc (on board, though) in Niseko, and my second in Myoko on snowshoes.
i did my first bc (on board, though) in Niseko, and my second in Myoko on snowshoes.
#84
Join Date: Sep 2009
Programs: UA GS>1K>Nothing; DL PM 2MM; AS 75K>Nothing>MVP
Posts: 9,334
Thanks for the feedback on Cortina. That really helps. Based on your comments, I'm inclined to scratch Cortina off my list for this winter. It would probably be back to NASPA or Kiroro then... more likely NASPA.
Have you been to Aomori Spring, by chance?
Tell me if I'm wrong, but wouldn't Dec have higher chances of blizzard and heavy snowfall than mid-late Feb (which is when we're going back for another ski trip)?
For ski resorts that have tendency to close lifts readily and have terrain that gets severely compromised by summit lift closures, do you think you're better off going in Feb than Dec?
Kiroro seems to close their summit lifts (inc gondola) often, so maybe you're taking bigger risk if you were to go there in Dec?
On the other hand, I was at NASPA last Dec where the snow was coming down hard and the wind was howling. But surprisingly they kept the lifts going (only a few diehards kept skiing).
If you think an intermediate (at best) skier can handle backcountry skiing in Jpn, I'll have to look into it.
Have you been to Aomori Spring, by chance?
Tell me if I'm wrong, but wouldn't Dec have higher chances of blizzard and heavy snowfall than mid-late Feb (which is when we're going back for another ski trip)?
For ski resorts that have tendency to close lifts readily and have terrain that gets severely compromised by summit lift closures, do you think you're better off going in Feb than Dec?
Kiroro seems to close their summit lifts (inc gondola) often, so maybe you're taking bigger risk if you were to go there in Dec?
On the other hand, I was at NASPA last Dec where the snow was coming down hard and the wind was howling. But surprisingly they kept the lifts going (only a few diehards kept skiing).
If you think an intermediate (at best) skier can handle backcountry skiing in Jpn, I'll have to look into it.
#85
Original Poster
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: Hilton, Hyatt House, Del Taco
Posts: 5,369
December is a poor month where you are at the mercy of snow cover more than anything. Look at the 2015 and 2016 Dec figures for Hakuba and you'll see even past Christmas they were sometimes skiing on rock and grass! Hokkaido is the only place for Dec skiing if you need to book in advance, and they charge like wounded bulls at that time.
i agree late feb is preferable, though weather is as likely to shut things down at either time I feel. Late feb has possibility of rain which solidifies and makes the runs bulletproof. No one wants to fall on sheet ice.
I do truly believe that the backcountry is much more accessible in Japan than anywhere. It's harder on skis so you'd want powder skiing experience from the resort, but I know 2 guides (one is a local, Japanese lady) who would be excellent for beginners if interested.
This year the big snow trip for me is Kyrgyzstan but I will be in Niseko region late Feb, too.
i agree late feb is preferable, though weather is as likely to shut things down at either time I feel. Late feb has possibility of rain which solidifies and makes the runs bulletproof. No one wants to fall on sheet ice.
I do truly believe that the backcountry is much more accessible in Japan than anywhere. It's harder on skis so you'd want powder skiing experience from the resort, but I know 2 guides (one is a local, Japanese lady) who would be excellent for beginners if interested.
This year the big snow trip for me is Kyrgyzstan but I will be in Niseko region late Feb, too.
Kyrgyzstan?! Wow! That'll be an adventure.
I've definitely kept an eye on Madarao. Looks like a terrific mountain. Unfortunately the lodging situation isn't going to work out. We really need ski-in/out. Tokyu Harvest is really the only hotel I'd feel enthusiastic about staying at, but I guess the hotel is membership-based. Tangram Hotel would be acceptable, but their rates are astronomical (65,000yen/night, no meals included!). Madarao Kogen Hotel is cheap but sorry it's out of question for us (old, communal toilet).
#86
Join Date: Mar 2015
Programs: HH Diamond, GHA Titanium
Posts: 1,955
If I only get 1 or max 2 ski trips a year would you guys still say its better to (at least) buy my own boots and only rent skis and poles at destination? I've only ever used rental gear but as my wife has also picked up the ski bug, it's a lot easier to get her agreement for more frequent ski trips 😂
#87
Join Date: Sep 2009
Posts: 1,468
It's all about $ for comfort. I couldn't say if it's a good idea for you or not. The cost saving isn't huge, but I have had my own gear since my 3rd trip, just because it's more comfortable and I knew I loved it. This was when I was still only having 1 1-2 week trip a year, too.
#88
Original Poster
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: Hilton, Hyatt House, Del Taco
Posts: 5,369
If I only get 1 or max 2 ski trips a year would you guys still say its better to (at least) buy my own boots and only rent skis and poles at destination? I've only ever used rental gear but as my wife has also picked up the ski bug, it's a lot easier to get her agreement for more frequent ski trips
I probably only ski max 9 days per season. But your own boots are definitely a must imho. After I turned ~35, my threshold for getting hurt and developing pain got much lower. I always rented everything and nothing bothered me. But since then, skiing became progressively more taxing to my feet and knees. So I got my own pair of boots. And I think I'm going to take my boots with me everywhere, even when going abroad to ski.
#89
Join Date: Sep 2009
Programs: UA GS>1K>Nothing; DL PM 2MM; AS 75K>Nothing>MVP
Posts: 9,334
#90
Original Poster
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: Hilton, Hyatt House, Del Taco
Posts: 5,369
Maybe my priorities are a bit wacky, but a clean full-service hotel is a requisite for us. Also, for our dates and occupancy (2adults+2kids), the only room types offered as available are ones without toilet. Nonetheless Madarao Kogen and Tangram combined make for a sizeable mountain with attractive-looking layout, and it's definitely a place I'd like to try out eventually.