Tokyo Station help (time require for transit)
 

I have been working on a trip toward end of the year but getting those overnight sleepers from Osaka or Tokyo to Hokkaido really seems like mission impossible from my research...
So as a back up plan... I will start in Beppu, thinking getting the Green Class ticket cos there is so much traveling involved if I fail to get on the overnighters from Ueno.. Don't really want to waste time in Tokyo as I personally don't fancy the city...

LTD. EXP SONIC 4
BEPPU 05:31
KOKURA 06:48

SHINKANSEN SAKURA 540
KOKURA 07:17
SHIN-OSAKA 09:44

SHINKANSEN HIKARI 516
SHIN-OSAKA 10:16
TOKYO 13:10 Track 15

SHINKANSEN HAYABUSA 21
TOKYO 13:20 Track 21
SHIN-AOMORI 16:43

LTD. EXP SUPER HAKUCHO 21
SHIN-AOMORI 16:53
HAKODATE 19:08

Can anyone confirm with me that 10min is enough to change to platform at Tokyo (with 1 hand carry trolly) as last time and only time I been there it seems quite a big station...
As the Shin-Aomori station change over, there is no need to change platforms?
Thanks in advance as always.

Should be fine in Tokyo, the Shinkansen platforms are located together; would only make me mildly anxious;)

Cheers Hubbabridge

Mental log
Walk out of Shinkansen 30 second
Walk/find a way down stairs 2 mins
Walk/find correct platform 2 mins
Rampage up the correct platform 1.30 mins
Grab a cam to take photo of self and inbound train 1 min
Dragging self and luggage on Shinkansen 1 min
Telling myself that was close shave 2 mins

Now have to sell this idea with other travelers in the party. 2 months:D

Hyperdia seems to think that a 10-minute Shinkansen-Shinkansen connection at Tokyo Station is valid, so I'd go with that.

Just don't dawdle. That connection would make me nervous but I think it can be done if you hurry.

Your train from Shin Osaka runs on the Tokaido Shinkansen　（platforms 14-19)
Your train to Shin Aomori runs on the Tohoku Shinkansen (platforms 20-23)

Now ... These two lines are managed by different companies, so you need to go through the transfer ticket gate. Follow the signs that indicate transfers to the Tohoku, Yamagata, Akita, Joetsu Shinkansen. It's a very quick transfer.

(If you do make a mistake and end up exiting the Shinkansen area just walk around to the Tohoku, Yamagata, Akita, Joetsu Shinkansen and enter there).

Thanks guys... sounds like even experience bunch will be nervous, guess better to be safe then sorry.
As my folks can't run... hyperdia doesn't like this arrangement. Always spitting out transit at Hachinohe.
So make 1 hour layover at Tokyo and 1 hour 20min at Shini-Aomori would be safe bet plus it is lunch and dinner time for the transit.

SHINKANSEN HAYABUSA 23
TOKYO 14:20
SHIN-AOMORI 17:29

LTD. EXP SUPER HAKUCHO 25
SHIN-AOMORI 18:53
HAKODATE 20:56

Next question is decent station food! Shin-Aomori seem to have good food waiting, my quick look at Tokyo seems to be all Bento boxes food.

I love trains in Japan, but that is one heck of a lot of train travel for one day. NO thoughts as to flying, say with an ANA Experience Japan fare? It would be cheaper than train travel (if you are buying tickets as opposed to JR pass)

Here is my traveling plan... ended like this.. Places to go to visit already fixed
From Beppu to Hakodate will be just as demanding as doing red eyes. :D
My folks also asked me to same why not fly, my answer seems to be... why pay when you don't have to. :rolleyes:

Kansai Wide Pass
Saturday 15 Katsuura 勝浦市
Sunday 16 Katsuura 勝浦市
Monday 17 Osaka 大阪
Tuesday 18 Osaka 岡山

No Pass
Wednesday 19 Osaka

JR Green Pass 7 Days
Thursday 20 Fukuoka 福岡
Friday 21 Beppu 別府
Saturday 22 Beppu 別府
Sunday 23 Hakodate 函館
Monday 24 Hakodate 函館
Tuesday 25 Noboribetsu 登別
Wednesday 26 Sapporo 札幌市

Sapporo-Otaru Welcome Pass
Thursday 27 Sapporo 小樽市

No Pass
Friday 28 Sapporo 札幌市
Saturday 29 Sapporo Depart

Hyperdia also thinks you can transfer from Seibu to Marunouchi line in 4min at Ikebukuro, and from Toyoko to Shonan-Shinjuku Line in 11min at Musashi Kosugi. Those are really minimum transfer times for folks who know their way around and assume you don't get lost or need elevators, etc. So I would not just assume that Hyperdia's connection times will work for everyone, especially if it's a big station and you're not used to the station or if you've got luggage.

That said, I think 10min will work for the OP's transfer.

If I could visualise the Tokyo Station map then I think I have that confidence to do it without problem, the map its just hopeless.
Personal travel at this station equate to 1 and found myself walking quite a bit of distance from where all the food were sold.

I think it is a wise choice to change your trains to give a more comfortable connection.

On the other hand, that is a LONG day on trains. If at all possible, I'd suggest stealing a day from your itinerary somewhere to build in an overnight stop somewhere along the way. I have been on almost every mile of your proposed route but never all in one day. I get cramps in my legs just thinking about it. If you are traveling with older folks, they would undoubtedly appreciate a break to stretch out along the way. I know i would.

In truth I think it is mentally draining to do all at one go...
My folks... rather spend the night at Hakodate then Tokyo... We live in HK so Tokyo is too much like in a way (busy city/loads of people) ...
If JR pass allow us to use Nozumi train then it will looks a lot less taxing on the body... If I was traveling by myself I will assure you I would have no problem at all.
My folks can do HKG-JFK so I am sure they will be fine... but I think breaking the Tokyo down an extra hour allow comfort if we become lost in station.
As long as there is

1. Food and drinks to buy
2. Power plug on Shinkansen
3. Decent turn around time to look for platforms
4. Internet

Should keep the party happy.;)
I am sure the ticketing officer thinks I am nuts and really want to milk in the JR pass to the bone.

No - you can't use the Nozomi with the JR pass.

There are lots of food options at Tokyo Station. Ranging from sit down restaurants (some clustered in "food courts" like Ramen Street - http://www.seriouseats.com/2012/05/n...okurinsha.html) to places that sell bento boxes (for example http://www.timeout.jp/en/tokyo/venue/23174).

FWIW - Tokyo Station is very BIG. And it can be difficult to get from "here" to "there" - especially if you/your folks need to find elevators (it can be hard for people to handle luggage on escalators). So I would have a "Plan A" in terms of food before I got there - what you want to do. Also a "Plan B" (some places can have pretty long lines at various times of day). Robyn

You are not going to save money by doing this.

You are essentially traveling Kyushu to Hakodate for the cost of a 7 day JR pass. In green car it appears to cost nearly USD 400 per person. Traveling around Hokkaido is not going to cost you very much by train and I would strongly suggest driving on Hokkaido.

I suggest flying to Hakodate (or Chitose) and getting a rental car or taking trains on Hokkaido.

Even if you are insistent on travelling Beppu to Hakpdate all by rail, at least build in an overnight stop.


Sendai or Morioka would be my suggestions.

I have taken long trips like this and really at the end they are not fun at all. Green car or regular, it doesn't matter--Just fly from Kyushu to Hokkaido as others have stated.

Why is that? According to hyperdia, you get an itinerary where you leave Beppu at 11.20a (via comfortable transfers at Kokura, Himeji and Tokyo, taking shinkansens that are not Nozomi or Mizuho) and arrive Fukushima at 22.16p where you can transfer to a sleeper train that gets into Hakodate the next day at 6.35a.

I am glad you and others have said this. I was - as a relative novice in Japan - afraid to. But it sounds like the rail trip from he** to me. The OP's parents - who seem to be traveling with him - are probably about my age (late 60's) or younger - and I don't reckon it will be great fun for them either.

Also - this is pretty much a 2 week trip. I don't know how light or heavy OP and folks will pack - but carrying large luggage on Japanese trains isn't my idea of a swell time.

And FWIW to OP - my husband and I are close to 70. Flying from where we live to Asia is no big deal for us. Except in terms of jet lag. But train stations in Japan are something else (no people in golf carts who pick us up at gates and get us to other terminals). They're much more geared to younger people - especially people traveling on business best I've observed. They're certainly not impossible or super difficult - but 10 minute connections for us older folk - forget about it. Robyn

Why is it? Because sleepers can have be booked out solid. Some are extremely hard to buy tickets for

Okay, as long as the OP said what he said because the seats are sold out and not because he didn't think the schedule would work out...

Thanks or the large amount of input from everyone... Had been busy in the weekend.
robyng You are pretty right on about my folks ages... We will be sending luggage to Hokkaido as it is a shopping trip as well. Only light luggage will be carried.
evergrn Maybe I will take your suggestion for stopping at Sendai, what is your recommended timetable so it makes the travel less from hell... Assuming we can start later and have a nice break at Sendai? By the time the train get to Morioka it would have been night time already.
gnaget My driving is terrible, never bother to get full license once I got the restricted...

Another +1 to flying instead of sitting on the train all day. If you even don't have a JR Pass, there's really no reason to do this.

What kind of price am I looking at? Need something cheap...

Using one of the special fares or airpasses reserved for foreign visitors, you can fly on domestic routes for 10,000–13,000 JPY per sector.

So to go from Kyushu to Hokkaido, you could fly FUK-CTS non stop (JL3513/3515 or NH289) for around 10k. Or if you prefer flying from somewhere close to Beppu to somewhere close to Hakodate, you could book the 2-sector itinerary OIT-HND-HKD for twice that.

I actually wasn't the one who suggested the stop in Sendai. But since you ask, here it is...

Sat 11/22
Beppu 10.53a-(Sonic)-12.03p Kokura 12.26p-(Sakura)-2.44p ShinOsaka 3.16p-(Hikari)-6.10p Tokyo
At Tokyo, your options would be 6.20p Komachi (arrives Sendai at 7.52p), 6.36p Yamabiko (arrives Sendai at 8.49p) or 7.20p Komachi (arrives Sendai at Sendai at 8.53p). The first option's a tight transfer as you know, but you can do it. The second one's very slow, but it saves you from having to stand around at the station. The third option allows you time to explore Tokyo Sta complex if you're so inclined.

Sun 11/23
Sendai 10.42a-(Hayabusa)-12.29p ShinAomori 12.45p-(SuperHakucho)-2.58p Hakodate

If you're going to break up the trip, then I'd cut into the time in Beppu rather than Hakodate if it were me.

Well, you are prepared to pay USD 379 for a train ticket. I can tell you that it will be less than that. There are also LCCs operating in Japan. Skymark, Starflyer, etc. Many fly to Chitose on Hokkaido.

Skymark flies FUK-CTS non-stop. Also Air Do flies to Hakodate but you would connect at HND. You can fly from a large number of airports on Kyushu to Haneda on ANA. And this would be an ANA ticket since they have part ownership of Air DO.

Ok, Skymark ranges from JPY 12.9k to 18.9k for FUK-CTS depending on advance purchase and availability. The full fare is 24.9k.

Note that domestic tickets in Japan go on sale 60 days in advance and the cheapest advance purchase is 28 days. If you have *A or Oneworld miles then domestic Japan travel is good value on ANA and JAL, respectively.

I like the ANA Experience Japan fare. You can book on line right now for trips up until next March. No blackout periods either and I see you mentioned towards the end of the year..If by that you mean around the NY period, I would book those flights ASAP.



https://www.ana.co.jp/wws/us/e/wws_c...experience_jp/

I feel sorry for your folks ... if they were to endure this epic train journey.

Experience Japan fare 10000 one way, can only be booked online by you.

JAL/ANA air pass 10000 - 13000 one way. I know travel agents in HKG are reluctant to book these, claiming they don't exist. These can't be booked online.

Don't they require that you fly ANA to Japan? It doesn't state this but I think it would be implied.

Hang on guys, I am listening, the locations that I we are going is fixed, only can really twist the traveling time and what to travel. I am trying to work out the best plan for my folks and myself.
After learning the 10800 yen fare, I am looking for tuning this part of my trip which had been the sticking point from the day of planning.

robyng, if I was your kid would the below itinerary still be too hectic? Have to as you cos you would really have closer thinking channel as my folks would... (Thanks in advance for your opinion)
As the guys that really want me to change my traveling by air, this one below I think is the best I can work on for my folks, instead of traveling ahead to Hakodate/New Chitose, will think of a night at Sendai and Morioka (recommendation?)
This one involve getting up early. But we will make up time going to Sendai by air on ANA. Plus its easy on the budget, swapping the Green Seat to Normal and using that money to fly instead and we are able to make up alot of time.

04:53
BEPPU
[77 Min]
LTD. EXP SONIC 2
06:10

06:36
KOKURA
[17 Min]
SHINKANSEN KODAMA 851
06:53


07:08
HAKATA
[5 Min]
Fukuoka City Subway Kuko Line
07:13
FUKUOKA AIRPORT

Then
11/23
(SU) NH1275
Fukuoka Sendai
Operated by ANA WINGS
Dep 08:00
Arrive 09:40
Travel time 01:40
Economy
735

My suggestion: Skip Sendai.

Bus from Beppu Station to Oita airport - Dep: 8:52AM Arr: 9:43AM
NH 194 Oita to Tokyo (Haneda) - Dep: 10:45AM Arr: 12:20PM
NH 555 Tokyo (Haneda) to Hakodate - Dep: 1:25PM Arr: 2:45PM

Nope. ANA experience fare has no inbound/outbound carrier requirement. ANA used to sell (maybe still do?) a Star Alliance domestic air pass, that did require Japan arrival/departure flights on Star Alliance. There is also a similar Oneworld pass for JAL domestic flights.

Agree with this. If you're flying, it's not really worth the stop for an afternoon in Sendai and having to get the trains later anyway. The bus ride to Oita airport is a pain (there used to be a hovercraft which was faster and more fun), but it's a lot easier than the trek up to FUK with a 4am start. The only advantage going from FUK would be if you decide to fly direct to Hokkaido - saving half the airfare, but meaning a 3 hour backtrack from CTS to Hakodate on the train.

Just trying to pick the best solution in 1 sector.
I don't want to fly to Hokkaido direct as I will be going there as my final leg, ex-SDJ requires an extra sector to anywhere CTS, HKD or SDJ.

Another option would be Oita -> Nagoya -> Hakodate. NGO is a bit easier to navigate for transfers, and by leaving OIT at 10:00 you can get into HKD by 13:55. The 80 minutes you have at NGO would allow for a leisurely lunch. Tabiwari 75 is pricing out as 23,220 JPY, so the Experience Japan fare would be slightly cheaper.

There is no solution for getting from Beppu to Hakodate in a single sector -- you will have to connect somewhere.

Correct. AFAIK ANA offers:

Star Alliance Japan Airpass - 10,800 yen per segment requiring arrival/departure on *A flights.
Visit Japan Fare - 28,080 yen per two segments (minimum) not requiring arrival/departure on *A flights.
Experience Japan Fare - 10,800 yen per segment not requiring arrival/departure on *A flights but more restrictive.

JAL also offers similar discounted fares.

A train leaving at 4:53 am is just a bit early for my taste ;).

I'm not familiar with these train stations. Is 15 minutes enough time to transfer from the shinkansen to the subway (I don't know)?

Also - how far in advance do you have to arrive at the airport to get through security and the like (you've allowed a max of 47 minutes)? Is that enough time for a domestic flight in Japan (I don't know)? Robyn

For Japan domestic the cutoff for check-in is something like 15 or 20 min. It's not like the US! If you have a BP then they advise you to go through security something like 15/20 min before departure.

I was in Japan on RTW tickets (often multiple at the same time!) as the point of entry. I wonder if I could have used the airpasses? I think the experience Japan fare said round trip. When I was there you could use UA miles cheaply: only 6000 and no taxes. And as a 1K you could book and cancel last minute. At one point in the winter of 2013 I was rebooking a flight to Asahikawa in order to ski Asahidake. I did it for weeks and could never hit a day where I was free and could hit a sunny day after a big dump. It just snows too much up there.

The UA desk in Tokyo had some policy that you needed 1 weeks notice but I found that you could book by calling the US and then they made it possible online maybe in early 2013.

Looks like I have a compromise with my folks, instead of doing Oita -> Nagoya -> Hakodate all in one day, we decide to take the trip and breaking it up into 2 sectors as we will be charge twice anyway. My folks like Nagoya so this is a place that they could revisit. So a night at Nagoya then explore there while I get to visit a new city.