What To Do If You Get Sick in Italy
#76
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: PHL / NYC / PSA-BLQ
Programs: AA PPRO, Marriott/Hilton Gold, AMX-Plat, Global Entry
Posts: 3,107
1.Cystitis is not a kidney stone. Different things. Might not be easy to tell the two apart, unless there was back/flank pain.
2. That's what anyone would do, unless there was pain in the back or flank.
3. Sonogram is the next step,
4. CT without contrast, mistake, unless she is diabetic and had signs of kidney failure. Otherwise, you could not see a stone. Perhaps they were just trying to make sure it wasn't something else. Without the details, cannot say. If she is diabetic and/or had an elevated creatinine (sign of early kidney trouble), then what they did was correct.
5. Women who have had a baby, and who also later had a kidney stone, generally say that the pain from a kidney stone was worse.
6. All you can do is wait on a kidney stone, except in rare circumstances. If the test doesn't change the treatment, it wasn't beneficial.
7.?
I'll bet that in Versilia they are going to tell you to wait it out, unless she has a fever. Wishing the best, and believe me, the care wouldn't have been any better back in the USA.
2. That's what anyone would do, unless there was pain in the back or flank.
3. Sonogram is the next step,
4. CT without contrast, mistake, unless she is diabetic and had signs of kidney failure. Otherwise, you could not see a stone. Perhaps they were just trying to make sure it wasn't something else. Without the details, cannot say. If she is diabetic and/or had an elevated creatinine (sign of early kidney trouble), then what they did was correct.
5. Women who have had a baby, and who also later had a kidney stone, generally say that the pain from a kidney stone was worse.
6. All you can do is wait on a kidney stone, except in rare circumstances. If the test doesn't change the treatment, it wasn't beneficial.
7.?
I'll bet that in Versilia they are going to tell you to wait it out, unless she has a fever. Wishing the best, and believe me, the care wouldn't have been any better back in the USA.
We;re seeing the top urologist in Massa Carrara - as we don't have Italian medical insurance, it'll be libero professione and we'll see what he has to say tomorrow. My wife is hesitant to get on a 10 hour flight with the chance of the pain returning. The normal way is certainly to let the stone pass but that can take weeks. We'll see if we have any proactive options that can resolve more quickly. I don't know if they do ESWL but that might be an option for example.
#77
Original Poster
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: SFO, VCE
Programs: AA EXP >4 MM, Lifetime Plat
Posts: 2,881
Initial diagnosis was acute cystitis - after 3 days of Cipro doctor referred her to Pronto Soccorso for a sonogram - they decided to do a CT scan first. They were worried about an allergic reaction, hence no contrast. They wanted to know if she had had a CT with contrast before and she wasn't sure - she was a little frazzled. I confirmed within 30 minutes that she had with her MD in Manhattan and told them that. But, by then, they were dug in on her prepping with Prednisone, etc - the people on duty that day were pretty difficult and I think it was an excuse to punt the contrast to another crew Went back Monday after prep and had the contrast - the crew on duty then were pleasant and good. Sent the contents of the disk to a Dutch friend who is a top radiologist in Amsterdam - he viewed the CT Scan and said it was pretty good - just a little quick in a couple of spots. Scan showed stone.
We;re seeing the top urologist in Massa Carrara - as we don't have Italian medical insurance, it'll be libero professione and we'll see what he has to say tomorrow. My wife is hesitant to get on a 10 hour flight with the chance of the pain returning. The normal way is certainly to let the stone pass but that can take weeks. We'll see if we have any proactive options that can resolve more quickly. I don't know if they do ESWL but that might be an option for example.
We;re seeing the top urologist in Massa Carrara - as we don't have Italian medical insurance, it'll be libero professione and we'll see what he has to say tomorrow. My wife is hesitant to get on a 10 hour flight with the chance of the pain returning. The normal way is certainly to let the stone pass but that can take weeks. We'll see if we have any proactive options that can resolve more quickly. I don't know if they do ESWL but that might be an option for example.
#78
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: PHL / NYC / PSA-BLQ
Programs: AA PPRO, Marriott/Hilton Gold, AMX-Plat, Global Entry
Posts: 3,107
We're at FCO Hilton right now and flying back today. Saw the urologist and he wasn't sure it was a stone or perhaps a growth that was narrowing the ureter. He gave my wife meds for the pain if there is an onset so we could travel. He suggested a ureteroscopy followed by surgery as he thinks there may need to be a ureter resection. I'm not convinced so another opinion is in order. Our radiologist friend in Amsterdam (who I trust a lot - he's a top radiologist) is pretty sure its a stone.
Net/net - since we don't have Italian medical insurance, it would be €8000 to deal with it here and we'd be in hotels for a couple of weeks. Better to deal with it in the US where we have insurance, can be at our home and have doctors at PennMed which is pretty highly rated.
My wife's bummed that we going to miss Semiramide with Javier Camarena at the Metropolitan Opera tomorrow night.
Net/net - since we don't have Italian medical insurance, it would be €8000 to deal with it here and we'd be in hotels for a couple of weeks. Better to deal with it in the US where we have insurance, can be at our home and have doctors at PennMed which is pretty highly rated.
My wife's bummed that we going to miss Semiramide with Javier Camarena at the Metropolitan Opera tomorrow night.
#79
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Heraklion, Greece
Posts: 7,563
* not offering any advice: I've only dealt with nasty tropical diseases over the last ~30 years...
#80
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: PHL / NYC / PSA-BLQ
Programs: AA PPRO, Marriott/Hilton Gold, AMX-Plat, Global Entry
Posts: 3,107
Thanks - we're back in the States now and my wife weathered the TATL flight without any complications. In fact, she's toying with the idea that we should go to the Met tomorrow. We'll sleep on it and see how she's feeling.
Next week, we've got to line up a good urologist so we can put this thing (whatever it is) to bed.
#81
Moderator: Delta SkyMiles, Luxury Hotels, TravelBuzz! and Italy
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: Los Angeles
Posts: 26,539
Thanks - we're back in the States now and my wife weathered the TATL flight without any complications. In fact, she's toying with the idea that we should go to the Met tomorrow. We'll sleep on it and see how she's feeling.
Next week, we've got to line up a good urologist so we can put this thing (whatever it is) to bed.
Next week, we've got to line up a good urologist so we can put this thing (whatever it is) to bed.
#82
Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: SEA
Posts: 3,951
Don't worry, I take all of your posts as medical advice. For some reason there's a slice of pizza stuck in my ear.
#84
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Sydney, Australia and Stockholm, Sweden
Programs: VA Platinum, SQ Silver, TK Gold, Hhonors Gold, Accor Plus Gold, Bonvoy Gold, Radisson Premium
Posts: 1,022
Pardon me for a personal question which may be of little interest to others ...
I'm a dual Australian / Italian citizen but I don't live in Italy, have no Codice Fiscale or Tessera Sanitaria. I need to monitor a condition I have that requires a blood count. (I send the results to my Australian specialist who adjusts my medications if necessary). What is the best way of getting such a blood test in Italy?
Thanks in advance.
I'm a dual Australian / Italian citizen but I don't live in Italy, have no Codice Fiscale or Tessera Sanitaria. I need to monitor a condition I have that requires a blood count. (I send the results to my Australian specialist who adjusts my medications if necessary). What is the best way of getting such a blood test in Italy?
Thanks in advance.
#85
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Heraklion, Greece
Posts: 7,563
Two possibilities: 1) Find a medical "biochemical" lab in the city you're in and have your blood drawn and analysed there. It will cost you something but not too much. 2) Go to the emergency room of the next hospital where they may do the same thing (it's not an emergency!) and if they do, it may even be for free!
#86
Original Poster
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: SFO, VCE
Programs: AA EXP >4 MM, Lifetime Plat
Posts: 2,881
Pardon me for a personal question which may be of little interest to others ...
I'm a dual Australian / Italian citizen but I don't live in Italy, have no Codice Fiscale or Tessera Sanitaria. I need to monitor a condition I have that requires a blood count. (I send the results to my Australian specialist who adjusts my medications if necessary). What is the best way of getting such a blood test in Italy?
Thanks in advance.
I'm a dual Australian / Italian citizen but I don't live in Italy, have no Codice Fiscale or Tessera Sanitaria. I need to monitor a condition I have that requires a blood count. (I send the results to my Australian specialist who adjusts my medications if necessary). What is the best way of getting such a blood test in Italy?
Thanks in advance.
For example, a year and a half ago I slipped down some mossy, slipper stairs in pitch black darkness, and broke six ribs. That carries a 20% risk of splenic bleeding requiring surgery, and the risk drops daily, but continues for about a month. Since the average cost of a day in a hospital in the USA is about $42,000, and I was in the process of switching insurance carriers, I had no coverage for a few weeks. I asked a friend to stay with me for two days to make sure I wasn't bleeding to death. When I was still OK after two days I bought a business class ticket to Rome for $800 using an upgrade, and went straight from the airport to the hospital. I saved over $100,000. The bill? Zero. 68% of bankruptcies in the USA are due to someone getting sick and needing medical care.
Although the health care in Australia is not ranked as highly as Italy, it is still considered the 7th best in the world.
I agree with KLouis, and everything he said. I will add this. You can probably go to the ER and claim it is an emergency. A couple of years ago I went kayaking all around the Venetian lagoon, from San Marco, all the way out to the airport, and around all of the abandoned little islands, Torcello, San Erasmo, Burano, etc.
It was too much. I woke up with a swollen wrist. That's not really an emergency. The next day I went to the hospital in San Giovanni Paolo (Zanipolo) and they took x-rays, consulted an orthopedist, put my wrist in a brace, and sent me outside to what looks like a parking meter, to pay 25 euro co-pay.
If you go to the ER and tell them you have a condition and symptoms are acting up and tell them what blood test you need, you probably won't have to pay anything,
#87
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Hawai'i Nei
Programs: Au: UA, Marriott, Hilton; GE
Posts: 7,125
Getting Sick in Italy Caused a Friendship
Thank you @Perche for starting this thread. My wife and I have an interesting story pertaining to Italian medicine:
My wife got sick in France, but we continued to Italy (Rome), where I contacted the US embassy for a referral to an ENT. He actually answered his cellphone, and gave instructions to meet him at his hospital office outside Rome. So we took a train and followed his directions, and ended up in this tiny hospital. We are wondering what kind of Third World Medicine awaits.
We find the ENT offices and meet Dr. P. What a fine gentleman, who actually did some post-doctoral training in our hometown. He inspired confidence, and gave a series of recommendations for how to treat my wife's sinus condition, including using a nasal spray right before takeoff on our journey home.
At the conclusion of the appointment, we asked where we paid the bill, and the doctor and nurse said there would be no need for payment. My wife, who does not like receiving favors, insisted on paying until she finally got the message that payment was not possible. We thanked the doctor, gave him our business cards in case he ever gets to Hawaii, and returned to our vacation.
Upon boarding our first flight on our journey home, we are seated in business class and my wife is in the process of using her nasal spray as instructed by Dr. P. Just at that moment, into the plane walks Dr. P. (I'm really thinking this is great follow-up medicine !) We learn that he is on his way to meet his wife at a vacation destination. In chatting with him, I learn the resort at which they are staying.
Upon returning home, I call the resort and have room service send a bottle of champagne to Dr. P's room, with a note of thanks from us.
Dr. P and his wife end up sending a note of thanks and we make plans to meet again, this time in Hawaii. For the past 15 years, we have each hosted great sightseeing tours and dinners for one-another in our respective countries and our families have become very close.
We love Italian medicine!
My wife got sick in France, but we continued to Italy (Rome), where I contacted the US embassy for a referral to an ENT. He actually answered his cellphone, and gave instructions to meet him at his hospital office outside Rome. So we took a train and followed his directions, and ended up in this tiny hospital. We are wondering what kind of Third World Medicine awaits.
We find the ENT offices and meet Dr. P. What a fine gentleman, who actually did some post-doctoral training in our hometown. He inspired confidence, and gave a series of recommendations for how to treat my wife's sinus condition, including using a nasal spray right before takeoff on our journey home.
At the conclusion of the appointment, we asked where we paid the bill, and the doctor and nurse said there would be no need for payment. My wife, who does not like receiving favors, insisted on paying until she finally got the message that payment was not possible. We thanked the doctor, gave him our business cards in case he ever gets to Hawaii, and returned to our vacation.
Upon boarding our first flight on our journey home, we are seated in business class and my wife is in the process of using her nasal spray as instructed by Dr. P. Just at that moment, into the plane walks Dr. P. (I'm really thinking this is great follow-up medicine !) We learn that he is on his way to meet his wife at a vacation destination. In chatting with him, I learn the resort at which they are staying.
Upon returning home, I call the resort and have room service send a bottle of champagne to Dr. P's room, with a note of thanks from us.
Dr. P and his wife end up sending a note of thanks and we make plans to meet again, this time in Hawaii. For the past 15 years, we have each hosted great sightseeing tours and dinners for one-another in our respective countries and our families have become very close.
We love Italian medicine!
Last edited by 747FC; May 11, 2019 at 12:40 am Reason: spelling error/grammar
#89
Join Date: Jun 2019
Posts: 3
We do have a centralized number. It is 118. But do not call it unless extreme emergencies. They will only help you if you are seconds away from dying, otherwise, they will just say “rest for a bit” or “take some paracetamol”. There are private doctors, but they work only silly amounts of hours a week. From this point of view, Rome, as all of Italy, is completely f***ing f***ed, big time. If it isn’t anything serious, you look up on google maps or ask a receptionist where is the closest 24h(if it’s at night) pharmacy, you go there and ask the pharmacist, she will help if it’s something minor.
#90
Original Poster
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: SFO, VCE
Programs: AA EXP >4 MM, Lifetime Plat
Posts: 2,881
We do have a centralized number. It is 118. But do not call it unless extreme emergencies. They will only help you if you are seconds away from dying, otherwise, they will just say “rest for a bit” or “take some paracetamol”. There are private doctors, but they work only silly amounts of hours a week. From this point of view, Rome, as all of Italy, is completely f***ing f***ed, big time. If it isn’t anything serious, you look up on google maps or ask a receptionist where is the closest 24h(if it’s at night) pharmacy, you go there and ask the pharmacist, she will help if it’s something minor.
My home was under reconstruction a year ago, and really had no stairs. I fell and broke multiple ribs on my left side, which translates into a 20% risk of ruptured spleen that can kill you. The risk goes down daily, but persists for a month. I stayed at home for 2 days, by which time most of the risk would have passed. I was in transition period between insurance, and was without coverage, and I knew that it would be cheaper to fly first class to Italy, and do the same bed rest there. So I bought a business class ticket to Rome, and and took a cab straight to the hospital. Health care is free, and not because I'm an Italian citizen. It's just free. And it's better. It's ranked, depending on the study, between 2-8 in the world. The USA is ranked generally between 39th and 59th. The latest study has it just below Cuba, where health care is also free.
Health care in the USA is consistently ranked last in the industrialized world, and even lower than many non-industrialized countries.
Few will be able to get through the statistics, but the World Health Organization (WHO) just released another study in 2019 that mirrors their study some years ago. Spain, Iceland and Sweden were in the top 3. Towards the bottom of the list was Kysygastan, Madagascar, the Democratic Republic of Korea, Lesotho, Sierra Leone, all were in the top 20.
The USA never makes the list of the top 20 countries for quality of health care. I think once it came close, at 29th.
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/artic...ngapore-at-top
We are so low on the rankings that we don't even make the list (lower than Burundai and Vanuata, per the WHO: https://www.who.int/healthinfo/paper30.pdf
According to another study, while France and Italy generally ranked numbers one and two, another recently released ranking is;
1. Luxembourg
2. Singapore
3. Switzerland
4. Japan
5. Austria
6. Sweden
7. Norway
8. Netherlands
9. Hong Kong
10. Australia
11. Belgium
12. Germany
13. Qatar
14. Finland
15. South Korea
16. Spain
17. New Zealand
18. France
19. United Kingdom
20. Iceland
21. Denmark
22. Israel
23. Malta
24. Canada
25. United Arab Emirates
Infant mortality, is considered a very good metric of health care quality because it measures a lot of things related to health care. The USA is ranked 39th, tied with the Slovak Republic, although we spend about 10 times the amount per person than they do. Ranked well above us are India, South Africa, Britain, Slovenia, etc.
If you call the hotel doctor, be prepared to get milked for a lot of money, and you will receive care equivalent to a pharmacist. When you are sick, just go to the ER. My bill for treatment of multiple broken ribs was zero. Since I took a cab from the airport, I didn't even have to pay for parking.