ma_zeoli

Hi -
Anyone have any opinions on the use of 15K per night for the IC Real Santo Domingo ? Thanks in advance.

craigthemif

Compare to cash rate for dates of stay. Consider personal valuation of IHG points to calculate "cost". Consider your overall points balance. (i.e. do you have 1 million or 30K points?) Compare to usual points cost if you get excited about notional % discounts. Compare to alternative hotels in area or alternative holiday ideas.

Opinions made in a vacuum are relatively useless.

Reborn58

I am looking to book the CP Hiroshima and it no longer shows on the PB list. I also see availability but it shows at 30k for the night. Any idea why they would have removed a hotel from the PB list?

MaxVO

The number of reservations allocated to PB rates is always limited. Once the allocation is exhausted, which can occasionally be within minutes, the hotel gets off the list. Cancelled PB reservations do not become available for the PB rates.

scubaccr

UPDATE 8th/Mar (Thought worth a review of availability 5 weeks after release !)

Originally Allocated(Remaining) PB Totals
Cost........ 5k ........ 10k .........15k ........... r/totals
USA..... 11 (06).....76 (47) .... 20 (14)..... = 107 (67)
RoW..... 22 (14).....40 (23)..... 34 (21)......= 96 (58)
=============================================
Totals.... 33 (20)... 116 (70) ...54(35)..... = 203 (125)
=============================================

Exhausted PBs between 36hours and 5weeks from release
Cost........ 5k ........ 10k .........15k ........... r/totals
USA..... .. (-2)....... (-25) .... .. (-6)..... = (-33)
RoW..... .. (-3)....... (-12)..... .. (-7)......= (-22)
=============================================
Totals.... .. (-5)... ...(-37) ......(-13)..... = (-55)
=============================================

Conclusion:- the increase has on balance, seems to have prevented the previous speculative booking for the 10k/15k PB bands as quite a few of the 10k/15k hotels would have been exhausted with 2days and and others within 7days, and are stil bookable to some extent on PB rates.

lf tom

Scubaccr:
I appreciate your tabulation of the results of the new program, and I don't take exception with your stated conclusion.

But for me, the more obvious reason that so many properties are still available is that the new redemption levels make the program much less attractive. For the first time in memory, I have not booked a single PB property this quarter.

To reflect on two personal experiences, I have stayed at the HIE-Munich Messe and the CP-Venice East several days each for 5000 points per night. In each case I took a commuter train to the city center, leaving my rental car in the hotel parking lot. These were great experiences, and considering the value I received from PB, worth the inconvenience of the remote locations, the time and money spent commuting and paying for a rental car that I wasn't using. But at 15000 points a night, I'd consider other options

FlyerTalker688786

The problem is you do not speak for me. It is less attractive for you but a long waited welcome for me. I prefer some half decent properties at higher rate rather than repeating roadside motels all the time that I do not need. And I do not want to fight with internet bot when a good property comes along.

And I welcome the change that some people did not book PB this quarter. PB should be for everyone, not programmer who use bot to block scarce resources, or those book all the room at the minutes when PB is alive and cancel later when they know they can not use it or sell it online.

Frankly if there is someone whose whole purpose is to use the very few IHG rewards points he/she has on PB, he/she shall not be missed when he/she gives up on the programme. So the real loyal fans like me can enjoy the programme a little bit longer.

lf tom

Chongcao, I don't want to speak for you. Frankly it's hard enough to even acknowledge you. HIE Munich Messe and CP Venice East are precisely the same properties I used at 5000 points in the not too distant past. How is it a better deal that they are now offered at 15000? No wonder that five weeks into the quarter they are still available.

At the risk of wasting a little more time in trying to explain my use of PB, try this. At 5000 points, I was willing to accept a less convenient location or a somewhat more circuitous route for the amusement that an almost free room provided. And my experiences have been very fulfilling--riding local trains, visiting national parks, eating in some wonderful restaurants. The old PB program presented these opportunities, and there was a certain joy that resulted.

The joy far outweighs getting immersed in the new program where my decisions are less consequential and purely economic; i.e. is it worth riding a commuter train for 45 minutes to save $25?

I have taken spur-of-the-moment 200 mile golf trips on the occasion of a 5000 point Staybridge or HIE PB, but I doubt the opportunity will present itself again. But enjoy those $25 off PB's.

And as information, I have about 800,000 IHG points, but my next two stays will use my similar number of Marriott points.

winkny

If you need a hotel so badly for particular night you will pay whatever the price ( in points or money ) they offer you based on your preference ( close to city center , hotel brand , quality of the room etc.)
I think one of the goal of pointbreaks ( or any promotion ) is to make you book a room in hotel you would not book otherwise ( because of the price, location or whatever )
And the other reason is to make you want to collect an IHG points and for this reason you will choose IHG hotel instead of some other hotels that will suit you better,
but you will choose IHG hotel , because of the points from which you think you will get some value in the future.
If you dont think you will get some value from IHG points in the future , you will not have a desire to collect them ( and i am not talking of getting some exceptional value , just the possibility of getting it )

Now they destroyed one of the reason you want to collect their points and they make the price in points not attractive for the hotels that otherwise you will not consider at the current prices.

So i am not sure,that they make the right decision, but i am sure we will soon find out.
But when you have 10 000 , 15 000 pts hotels still available after one, two months, this is not a sign of increased demand ( and let not forget that many of the 10 000 and 15 000 pts rooms booked and not available now still can be canceled )
For me will be very interested the statistic of how many 5 000, 10 000 and 15 000 pts rooms are actually consumed.

FlyerTalker688786

That shows why it is necessary PB should be raised to 10K and 15K: more people could make use of it when needed.

With the point balance of your account, I would assume you will take a taxi or at least Uber. I am surprised you take the cheapest way of taking commuter train. But what you said is exactly what the hotel and IHG wants to get rid of: hoard all the points just for 5K PB rooms.

At the beginning of PB, IHG indeed wants to simulate the demands due to the long term affect of financial crisis as well as to compensate the raising of redemption rate. Now, the affect of last financial crisis is long gone. All IHG hotels has no demand issue as the occupancy rate is always high according to financial report. And the redemption rate is keeping rising but not much complaints around. IHG could cancel PB any time. The fact that IHG kept PB running is a great decision. But something has to give in. With all the problems happened during 2015-2017, where internet hackers used bot to block rooms, IHG virtually cancelled PB in China for 2 years. Internet bot block PB rooms is still happening, as long as IHG have great properties and not so great properties on PB list. The only way to solve the problem temporarily is to raise the point requirement for some of the properties.

Let me do the math right. You have 800K points. You only wish to redeem them on 5K properties. That is 160 nights you can redeem. HIX Munich Messe ADR is around €65-70, so let us call it €60. CP Venice East ADR is around €75-80 in winter, So let us call it €80 due to much higher ADR in summer. With 5K points value at USD$15-25 depends the way you accumulate or redeem, so let us say $20 (or €15).

At normal redemption, IHG needs to pay HIX Munich Messe $25 and CP Venice East $30 for your redemption.
If both hotel has over 95% occupancy rate, the minimum IHG has to pay HIX Munich €60 and CP Venice East €80.

Not only that, your 800K points will create a $2000-3000 liabilities entry on their financial reports. From IHG's point of view, the less customers like you the better: IHG will loose money on every redemption you make (Here I discounted how you get the points at the first place, but it is irrelevant).

So I doubt very much if IHG will miss you. The problem is, will you get 5K or 10K redemption with Marriott in Munich and Venice? Ah let us see, MOXY messe is around 15K but the rest Marriott hotels is around 30K outside airport. The comparable Courtyard in Venice wants 35K unless you go much further into Padova and Vicenza which you can get for 15K and 10K respectively (which is 20miles and 40 miles away and CP is only 9 miles away.).

Let me reiterate, no one should be criticised for their plan of taking advantage of the loyalty programme as long as all their action is legal. I certainly could not criticise you. But loyalty goes both ways. Occasionally you have to ask the questions, are you really loyal to IHG? Is it worth to be loyal to IHG? If you ask these question and think it is natural to ask these questions. I think IHG has the same right to ask the questions: are you really loyal to the company? Is it worth to keep you as a loyal customer?

Company is not charity. Unfortunately sometimes decisions are made based on historical trend and current customer practises. I don't speak for IHG, but from a cost and profit perspective, I can only see more evidence that why IHG had needed to introduce 10K and 15K categories. And from your own examples, it only further affirm my opinion on this matter.

lf tom

Chongcao,

I can see that further discussion is pointless, and you seem to be obsessed with just the latest frequent flyer/ frequent guest program to be trashed by the provider. I can remember when 8 domestic segments earned me a round trip ticket; now you need to be a mathematician to play the mileage game.

The moral of the story is to use your miles and points, because every year brings a new devaluation--this year brought both a devaluation and a gutting of PB by IHG. Again, I enjoyed using IHG points on PB's, generally on itineraries that I would not otherwise take--for my amusement. I don't know or care what a bot is or how it affects your participation in the program. As you seem to suggest, the difference between paying cash and using a new program PB is negligible, which exactly what I was trying to say in the first place.

Travel safe.

FFlash

I went now to check the list and there are quite many properties still up compared to what would be expected wtih the old rules. Take this as a glass-half-full (but then the glass maybe half-full with bad value, harharhar...)

scubaccr

Very few 5k hotels on DAY1, just 33 out of 203 , which was very disappointing. 116/203 at 10k the majority so 149/203 if 5k/10k insead of zero 5k choices. If you look at the 54/203 15k set with the view that they would not have been included at 5k PB levels, then I'd rather have a choice.

One does need to first remember that PB's have been around quite some years, without IHG increasing 5k upwards to account for inflation like with standard awards, as IHG have to pay hotels a little more/night than 10years ago.
Personally I would have been happy to see 10k PB across the board as I don't see even poorest hotels costing less than $60/night. Plus of course PB's are flex bookings so should be compared with higher flex rates not the cheaper ADR rates. Whilst I would maybe have grabbed if retired a 30nighter at an IC for 150k, I would not do so at new rate if 450k points so more IHGers get chance to book such nicer hotels.

PB idea is that IHG encourage (steer) bookings to IHG hotels with low room take up, either the poorer hotels by stanfard/location/revenue, and occasionally new hotels, for sure IHG will tr to avoid hotels that will trugger >95% higher rate costs to IHG themselves. We all note the usual regularly repeating hotels eg Brno, CZ.

When Dominican Republic IC opened in last 12months it came on as 5k/night and went in hours, this time it hung around longer. As probably expected IC Kiev at 15k with daily rates 200euro upwards did exhaust almost immediately. HIE Dartford UK was 5k last year, and went quickly at 5k, but still bookable this time around with rooms usually ranging gbp80-120 ($115-160)

For some properties total loss of value is probably very true. With new lower p+c rates I'd now reduce value of 10k from us$70 to $60 (and yes if one tries maybe as low as us$50). So using 1k/$6 ratio then to be worthwhile booking aPB hotel the nightly rate needs for 5/10/15k PB's to not exceed us$30/60/90 respectively. Of course for IHGers who are either points rich, or replace foc (company funded stays) one may set an even lower value on points.

For those with points galore, there is a benefit of spending 10k PB versus 20-30k full points or 15k PB versus 25-40k instead of spending actual monies.

SEAfarer

I just canceled the last of my speculative PB bookings I made in January. It was toward the end of April, and it turns out I would only use the first 1/3 of the days I booked. I'm still struggling with the same hotel over my stay there in February, when I checked out early and should get refunded about half of the nights I booked on that reservation. Just don't trust their record-keeping system, but it usually works out after a chat with the right person.
The other interesting reason for canceling April was that when I clicked into the Stay details, it showed my res as paying double the points of the PB offer, and a humongous point refund if I were to cancel. Weighing the potential hassles ahead for staying and trying to alter the res, and the possibility of gain ("these guys owe me for the ongoing hassle") I hit the Cancel button, but alas, you know the rest. The hotel's system and integration with IHG IT may be flaky, but IHG had my points expenditure correct.
No worries, I've got enough points for travels ahead, especially some long stays at a normal 10k rate later in the year.
The points + cash has gone truly flaky on some locations, where if you book 4 days instead of 3, IHG sells you the points at + $60 instead of + $75 for 10k. Why this should matter, I don't know, but at least it saves me shopping around for tricks that of course none of us know anything about.

lf tom

Solid analysis, scubaccr. I think the 30/60/90 is a useful rule of thumb. I also don't take exception to your comments about point inflation.

As a retiree, I can relate to your comments about 30 nights at an IC for 150K points. I've never done that but I did alter vacation plans to work in a side trip from Sofia to Kiev to spend four nights at the IC at 5000 per night. With cheap transportation on Wizz Air, it was a most satisfying and memorable experience.