Oops (A)I did it again...
 

Summarising here : Shanghai flight turbulence... Passengers injured... Supposedly plane damaged too... instead of reporting it, pilots decided to keep quiet... then decided to ask the crew to keep shut too.

Evidently he forgot there are other people on board - people who he can't boss over. People who revealed things like :

"One of the passengers who did not listen to the crew and decided to use the lavatory could not come out for half an hour because of the upheaval. When he emerged, he was bleeding profusely. The toilet where he was stuck was badly damaged. At least 18 travellers were bleeding, but nobody could help them as the seatbelt sign was still on. Passengers were requesting the crew to pass on a message to the pilot to land somewhere so the injured could be treated. But the pilot did not listen and decided to go ahead. He could have easily landed at Kolkata or somewhere as we were in Indian airspace,” the crewmember added.

The first aid to injured passengers was finally administered only an hour before landing. “Usko bolo waapas jaao... usko bolo waapas jaao.. Captain ko bol do..ek din late hoga to chalega (Tell the pilot to return. We won’t mind if we are delayed by one day),” passengers asked the crew to tell the pilot. The pilot did not listen. "

Wow. Just wow.

By the way was this pilot from the same gang that is/was on strike?

Wow.

Why did the pilot feel he had to hide, unless it was his fault somehow?

Under the influence?

I don't see that as a possibility as none of the other flights I have taken this year (75+ and counting) have had that.

That was conjecture. What makes you think no AI pilot is ever drunk?

Well, what was it?
First of all credibility of MidDay is unknown.
Somebody is hiding something or MidDay is blowing things out of proportion.
If somebody is hiding something, who?
Does AI have any SOP's?
Did the pilot follow standard operating procedures?
Did the pilot think it was prudent to continue rather then divert to safer ground?
How badly were the people injured?
Were the passengers warned?
Did the passengers follow crew instructions?

All sorts of questions arise.

Also wonder why it took so long (almost 20 days) - to come out, as it happened on July 5. How come all the passengers kept mum all this while?

Wirelessly posted (BlackBerry9000/5.0.0.822 Profile/MIDP-2.1 Configuration/CLDC-1.1 VendorID/102)

That's true. Maybe it took them that long to recover from the bleeding :)

I suspect there likely was a serious violation, but possibly not as sensational as the article describes it.

But then that's AI : their PR spends all its time (not really) controlling the damage AI have caused to themselves. A proactive statement, even if half true, would have helped immensely. Even the likes of Jet are quick to do that.

I wish I could answer all these questions. I think I need to change my user name!!

shocking....:eek:

a MidDay report, like JustiCe Arnab is mostly 90% conjecture and 10% fact. So take any "news" with truck of salt.

this used to be a 77E operation, but now becoz of strike reasons, is operated by 332 so it would be an ICPA pilot at the helm. 332 fleet have the seniormost and best captains in IC, so i am very surprised at the negative comments.

that said the pilot is in charge: he takes the final call on what to do, not passengers. and what was the passenger doing goin to the toilet when the seat belt sign was on?

Oh do tell!

Yes it's Mid Day (though the Trash of India has managed to out-sensationalise Mid Day for a long time now) bot other publications also carried a variation of the story.

But I think you're missing the point : the problem isn't with the passenger getting up or the crew failing to prevent the injuries, or the pilot's experience or expertise. It's about the pilot's alleged failure to report the incident and his attempt to cover it up.

In all likelihood, if reported appropriately, the incident wouldn't have created all this drama. The cover-up is the contention, not the incident itself.

That said, bleeding and covering-up aside, it should have been a serious incident for AI to decide to ground the plane to check and fix it.

By the way, the plane has around 60 passengers. So there was no need for a 777 or a 330, strike or no strike. An ATR could have done the job! :p

Really. By stopping at 10 points en route.

Wirelessly posted (BlackBerry9000/5.0.0.822 Profile/MIDP-2.1 Configuration/CLDC-1.1 VendorID/102)

Haha. They might manage with three.

A vintage AI "scenic" route!

are these the same guys who run the LHR hotel hoppa service? ;)

Hehe!

Come to think of it, even a 2-stop might be possible with an ATR : Dilly - Lhasa - Chongqing - Shanghai.

i dont there has been a coverup on airlines side mr.jasepl.

i saw a press release mailer on the incident from the airline a week ago. but i dont cover the aviation beat, plus ours is a monthly. and MidDay loves stories like these.

Air India has uncles doing their PR who dont know a bloody thing about the business or media handling. Jet and Kingfisher (and Indigo) have middle-aged M I L F types doing the same job. You will be surprised how much the reporting improves when the pallus drop. :) AI PR uncles stand little chance.

there is a lot of uncertainty about the flights because of strike situation and the A332 is very coveted in operations these days. so they are going all over: the China flights are not being sold as properly: i am surprised they are even getting these loads!

i have been on these China flights in normal times and the regularly scheduled 777 is usually full in economy and quite ok loads in Business (16-20 out of 35).

lots of Gujarati businessmen going on bi-annual shopping trips buying up cheapo chinese maal in bulk which will later be sold in Mumbai and Gujarat. route could be a gold mine, certainly higher yielding than the Gulf routes.

ToI, The Hindu, etc. are all citing MiD Day.

Captain SPS Suri (also GM of ops) claims that he did file a report. CMD and (new) DGCA both gave the usual "I'm completely clueless about my organization" quote.

I have no clue whether the captain did or did not report the incident. If he didn't, it's obviously not acceptable - passengers were injured and the aircraft reportedly had some damage, so a report is in order.

However, I would take this with lots of salt, and not jump to conclusions...

Wirelessly posted (BlackBerry9000/5.0.0.822 Profile/MIDP-2.1 Configuration/CLDC-1.1 VendorID/102)

No ones jumped to any conclusions. Not yet anyway.

And where is the "captain suri said" from ?

The original report which everyone is citing...

Link: http://www.mid-day.com/news/2012/jul...turbulence.htm

It seems like a lot of sensationalizing, along with some clear facts (the plane flew through turbulence, one person was bleeding). The problem is that it's very hard to see whether the claim that the pilot did not report the incident is sensationalist or not...

Quite honestly, the rest of the "incident" is a non-story - aircraft go through turbulence, and if people ignore seat belt signs during severe turbulence, they might get hurt.

Swaminathan and Shobha Nimbalkar both are actually reasonably competent - however, they 1) have their hands tied with all the red tape that surrounds AI, and 2) are probably are more interested in taking chai breaks than actually managing the situation.

Agreed. Hence why, as was said above : "the problem isn't with the passenger getting up or the crew failing to prevent the injuries, or the pilot's experience or expertise. It's about the pilot's alleged failure to report the incident and his attempt to cover it up."

And order is restored again, name-dropping and all.

Personal childhood friends, are they?

It's a double whammy, considering the two sources involved. :D

Why should facts come in the way of a good sling fest. :p

MAA HKG I can find L fares on CXKA 2 days in advance (did a search in April)
As of today 7:49
CX 632 MAAHKG all fare classes=9

I think you should be a little careful and not name people involved on the net: just some friendly advice.

well the point i was making is that PR is more than just sending out media briefings. The KF, 6E and 9W PR people are on first name terms with the person doing the aviation stories at my media-dukaan and vice-versa. The people at Jet counter seem to know these journos on first name basis as well result of which, they get phookat upgrades all the time at counter when going on holiday. Even in December, when KF was already bankrupt, they arranged a pool party in a resort outside Delhi for Media people where daaru flowed like water. All this matters as it results in journos helping to create positive vibe.

AI PR uncles dont come close to the private airlines people in this game and this shows in the perceptions.

in this specific case, most mags and newspapers just ignored the story even though AI sent out press notes. Unfortunately, Mid-day picked up the story. And not surprisingly its a journo with a repuation for ambulane chasing.





as a market, PVG is a lot diff from HKG in terms of commercials.

given their current state, they will pick up passengers at any fare A-Z. Talk to any ex-IC manager now with AI, and these fellows are effectively taking over AI, and the obsession is with generating cash. "Cash Positive hai kya?" is a common refrain you hear around those parts: reflection on Sunil Arora and his leadership. Fellow is there long after Patel-saaheb sent him packing.

Not worth a new thread and wasn't sure where to put this, but where does AI get its exchange rates from? Was looking at a BOM-DEL r/t fare and the INR fare converted to AUD is expensive than converted to USD,while AUD has been stronger than USD for most of the last month.

Lets not even bring up the less than ideal exchange rate. 9W's site seems to be converting to AUD/USD almost at interbank rate for the day.

:confused:

IATA rate of exchange from the GDS

WOW 60 pax and crew of 11, talk about personel service!!!!