Breaking: CAN transfer bonus avios to BAEC!
Jul 29, 2018, 1:13 pm
#46
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: London
Programs: BA, VS, HH, IHG, MB, MR
Posts: 26,871
Iberia said in writing all along that your IB account will go negative 90k on 1st December if you move them to BA. What the consequences are we don ‘t know.
Jul 29, 2018, 1:13 pm
#47
Join Date: Jul 2018
Location: Brazil
Programs: Everything I know I register myself in
Posts: 28
Do we have any data around if the transfer of the promotional miles from IB to BA circumvents the December 1 expiration policy? The whole "what happens to the miles on Dec 1" feels a bit nebulous still. I don't know if it's possible for them to submit a negative 90k transfer to BA through the Avios program or if by getting them out the miles have effectively been sequestered at that point.
Jul 29, 2018, 1:17 pm
#48
Join Date: Jul 2018
Location: Brazil
Programs: Everything I know I register myself in
Posts: 28
I don't understand. If now the authorized to transfer avios to BAEC, then this action might not sound good or actually make not sense at all. This is confuse. How can they permit Avios transfer as it was not in the T&C, but later negative an account?
Jul 29, 2018, 1:34 pm
#49
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: GIG
Programs: AAdvantage ExP 1MM, Smiles/GOL Diamond, TudoAzul/AZUL Diamond, HHonors Gold, Accor Platinum
Posts: 190
It is very clear from the overall T&Cs of Iberia Plus and British Airways Executive Club that "Combine Your Avios" is not a qualifying activity and is not "spending Avios". The fact that the promotional T&Cs may or may not have excluded CMA, doesn't mean by omission that CMA is now considered a qualifying use of Avios. .
The other issue is transfering to BAEC, which was not forbidden in the T&Cs.
So if I transfer my 90k avios to BAEC and redeem them there until Dec 1st that should not pose any problem or risk to any of my accounts (IP or BAEC).
Jul 29, 2018, 1:39 pm
#50
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Barcelona, London, on a plane
Programs: BA Silver, TK E+, AA PP, Hyatt Globalist, Marriott LT Plat, Hilton Diamond
Posts: 13,043
I think you're confusing 2 different issues: 1 is transfering avios, the other is using avios. The T&Cs allowed the USE of avios (redeeming - be it on tickets or hotels or whatever partner IP has) until the 1st of Deceber, after which they will expire whether they're in my IP account or transfered to my BAEC account.
The other issue is transfering to BAEC, which was not forbidden in the T&Cs.
So if I transfer my 90k avios to BAEC and redeem them there until Dec 1st that should not pose any problem or risk to any of my accounts (IP or BAEC).
The other issue is transfering to BAEC, which was not forbidden in the T&Cs.
So if I transfer my 90k avios to BAEC and redeem them there until Dec 1st that should not pose any problem or risk to any of my accounts (IP or BAEC).
If you believe that redeeming Avios via BAEC is 100% exactly the same thing as redeeming Avios via Iberia Plus under the T&Cs of an Iberia Plus promotion, even though the two programmes are completely separate and are only linked by CMA, then I look forward to hearing back in December about how that went for you...
Jul 29, 2018, 4:46 pm
#51
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: SNA/LAX
Programs: Hertz PC, Hilton DMD, IHG Spire Amb, Bonvoy Titanium Elite & WoH Globalist
Posts: 8,076
One Mile at a Time pointed out that the restriction appeared to be lifted. Raffles says this is Iberia getting out ahead of a story coming out in Sunday’s edition of The Mail in the U.K.
https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/30018476-post2380.html
https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/30018476-post2380.html
Jul 29, 2018, 5:00 pm
#52
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: BOS/ORH
Programs: AS 75K
Posts: 18,323
The only upside for me would be one way redemptions. However the awards i'm looking at are a better value in IB Avios so the only transfer I did was BA to IB.
Jul 29, 2018, 5:40 pm
#53
Join Date: Dec 2014
Posts: 48
I’d be incredibly surprised if Iberia’s systems are able to support negative Avios balances. Especially given how generally flakey they appear to be. I’m also intrigued whether you could “insulate” yourself by using other programmes as a proxy. I’m already having to go through avios.com because I have a household BAEC account but what if I also went through AerClub and Vuelling, for example?
The other question is whether you’re able to close your account before Dec 1st but after transferring your Avios out. Under GDPR you have the “Right to Erasure” of your personal data and if you have no upcoming flights, and didn’t take any flights (so Iberia had no compelling reason to hold data on you for compliance reasons) you may be able to close your account and request your data be deleted. You would then, no doubt, enter in to a discussion with their data controller about whether this was appropriate or not. I don’t know if you would win that discussion, but I’d love to hear the results of anyone who tries. Companies are very twitchy when it comes to GDPR.
These are hypotheticals, obviously, and against the spirit of the offer if not the explicit terms. I’m happy that I can now transfer to BAEC as I believed I could when I booked the flights.
The other question is whether you’re able to close your account before Dec 1st but after transferring your Avios out. Under GDPR you have the “Right to Erasure” of your personal data and if you have no upcoming flights, and didn’t take any flights (so Iberia had no compelling reason to hold data on you for compliance reasons) you may be able to close your account and request your data be deleted. You would then, no doubt, enter in to a discussion with their data controller about whether this was appropriate or not. I don’t know if you would win that discussion, but I’d love to hear the results of anyone who tries. Companies are very twitchy when it comes to GDPR.
These are hypotheticals, obviously, and against the spirit of the offer if not the explicit terms. I’m happy that I can now transfer to BAEC as I believed I could when I booked the flights.
Jul 29, 2018, 5:53 pm
#54
Suspended
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Kan@da
Programs: Anything with sweet spots
Posts: 1,790
I am not confusing anything. You are now able to move your 90k avios to BAEC. Enjoy.
If you believe that redeeming Avios via BAEC is 100% exactly the same thing as redeeming Avios via Iberia Plus under the T&Cs of an Iberia Plus promotion, even though the two programmes are completely separate and are only linked by CMA, then I look forward to hearing back in December about how that went for you...
If you believe that redeeming Avios via BAEC is 100% exactly the same thing as redeeming Avios via Iberia Plus under the T&Cs of an Iberia Plus promotion, even though the two programmes are completely separate and are only linked by CMA, then I look forward to hearing back in December about how that went for you...
Jul 29, 2018, 5:59 pm
#55
Suspended
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Kan@da
Programs: Anything with sweet spots
Posts: 1,790
There was no mention, in the terms of the promo page of Iberia website, of balances going negative if the points are not used by December
Jul 30, 2018, 3:17 am
#56
Join Date: Jul 2018
Posts: 9
The original T&Cs had no reference to transfers out. I had planned all along to use the points before Dec, and to either use them on Iberia flights or move them to BA. It now seems that the IB website is pants and I’m not going to get anything usable there, so I will move them to BA, where I’ll still be spending them before Dec.
Because the original T&Cs only said they had to be spent by Dec, then I don’t think I’d be breaching those by spending them on BAEC before Dec. I don’t really use Twitter so nothing said there can be deemed to have been added, and all the blogs I saw had different bits of information - there’s no way they can day they notified a change in T&Cs via blogs when their own web page still showed the original info.
Because the original T&Cs only said they had to be spent by Dec, then I don’t think I’d be breaching those by spending them on BAEC before Dec. I don’t really use Twitter so nothing said there can be deemed to have been added, and all the blogs I saw had different bits of information - there’s no way they can day they notified a change in T&Cs via blogs when their own web page still showed the original info.
Jul 30, 2018, 4:57 am
#57
Join Date: Sep 2017
Location: LHR
Programs: BA Silver, IHG Gold Amb.
Posts: 159
The original T&Cs had no reference to transfers out. I had planned all along to use the points before Dec, and to either use them on Iberia flights or move them to BA. It now seems that the IB website is pants and I’m not going to get anything usable there, so I will move them to BA, where I’ll still be spending them before Dec.
Because the original T&Cs only said they had to be spent by Dec, then I don’t think I’d be breaching those by spending them on BAEC before Dec. I don’t really use Twitter so nothing said there can be deemed to have been added, and all the blogs I saw had different bits of information - there’s no way they can day they notified a change in T&Cs via blogs when their own web page still showed the original info.
Because the original T&Cs only said they had to be spent by Dec, then I don’t think I’d be breaching those by spending them on BAEC before Dec. I don’t really use Twitter so nothing said there can be deemed to have been added, and all the blogs I saw had different bits of information - there’s no way they can day they notified a change in T&Cs via blogs when their own web page still showed the original info.
These T&C's state that transferring to a BAEC does not count as spending them.
and spending them on BA is not spending them on Iberia.
Jul 30, 2018, 5:07 am
#58
Join Date: Jul 2018
Location: Brazil
Programs: Everything I know I register myself in
Posts: 28
If I transfer avios to BAEC won't it be bound to BAEC T&C's? Can Iberia request BAEC to "expire" avios even though the BAEC avios does not expire if you movement it? How can they say that from now we can transfer avios to BAEC but we will be penalized with negative avios by December 1st? Then we are not authorized to do it.
Jul 30, 2018, 5:27 am
#59
Join Date: Jul 2018
Posts: 9
Jul 30, 2018, 6:07 am
#60
Join Date: Mar 2016
Programs: BAEC, Ib+, Accor, HHonors
Posts: 609
On a related not, Iberia Plus does indeed contemplate negative balances. Normally that's not the case, only if you are Platino and have borrowed some Avios from Iberia Plus for a redemption. The problem will be once there is a big sum of accounts with negative balances - god knows how IbPus will react to that. Time to stocking up some popcorn.