FrankMS

To fill the request, what are you sending as "tickets?" Are you just sending the confirmation number or a pdf of the whole email confirmation?

ChocolateFactory

ChocolateFactory

avs92

catharsis

I do so love the Iberia avios booking website ....

LHR-EDI or LHR-BFS or LHR-DUB .....

"We regret to inform you that there are no connecting flights between the cities selected."

Really ?????!

rabbits5

Tommys888

I am sort of predicting what is going to happen - for people like me who got Avios but did not book award flights yet, Avios will be taken away shortly and all 10 booked flights will be refunded automatedly (no trigger necessary from ourselves); for people who got Avios and booked their award flights already, all (10 flights and award booking) will be cancelled and refunded automatedly (no trigger necessary from ourselves); and for people who do not get Avios yet, you either get nothing or you get emails asking for ID verification and under the latter case, you get an reply of inconsistencies, and all 10 booked flights will be refunded with an email of request by latest July.

This will potentially become the largest joke of the year... Is Iberia trying to keep all their staff busy or what?

Hope my prediction is wrong.

gnomey

I also think so. I wouldnt be surprised if clawbacks report becoming prevalent if what avs92 reported is not an isolated incident

So even with Avios in account, and already redeeming it, one is still not "safe"

Unless you fly your award flight tomorrow, that's it

Indeed that's the case.

At this point, I think I would be more concerned abt getting the $$ refund (without penalty) in a timely manner.

I hope they would be timely and on point on that and not let me wait for the next X months and with multiple chaser emails before the refund would show up in my CC statement.

Adam1222

I didnt "show up" on the thread. I've been here since the beginning. And theres a difference between being "supreme arbiter" and sharing information you dont want to hear.
And yes, under the current state of the law, there pretty much is unbridled discretion as to whether to award miles and/or terminate a members account. But even if it isnt, buying tickets with no intention to fly them is pretty clearly within the grounds of an airlines ability to terminate under the T&C of the airline program. (The language here that you may quibble with, but is pretty broad, is " The Programme reserves the right to recall your card, cancel your account and hold you responsible if you make improper or fraudulent use of the Programme or do not comply with the rules and procedures contained in these General Conditions.") Again, I'm not saying this is right- I'm saying this is what it is.

We've been through this before many times over the past decade. Most of us realize theres a risk a promo that sounds too good to be true won't be honored. If it is, great. If it's not, and we have no out of pocket loss (or even a small one), we move on and wait for the next one. Invariably, someone rants about a class action or chargeback and moral superiority. The cycle happens quite often.

Oh, and I have read far more than a court case or two. (I cited the most on point recent Supreme Court case about ADA preemption and mileage programs.) Perhaps instead of being dismissive, maybe recognize that some people actually do have greater knowledge of the law.

I'd be curious to see if the people who are having problems are those who simply bought 10 one-ways with the same origin and destination, which seems far more irregular than had you say, bought a variety of tickets. If you actually planned on flying some of them, I think that puts you in a different scenario than others--- which is one reason class action treatment wouldn't be appropriate.

Finally, I never said that Iberia shouldnt honor the offer. I simply pointed out why neither a chargeback nor a class action is an appropriate remedy. And that buying tickets with no intent to fly them raises some unclean hands issues. As to endearing Iberia to the public, I don't think the vast majority of the "public" is going to have their travel preferences impacted by a couple dozen people who wanted a windfall and didn't get it. When I talked to non-points people about the promo, they actually seem to think that people like us are schemers.

I've gotten millions of miles over the years. I've never threatened a lawsuit, never initiated a chargeback. I dont think it's because I'm lucky. Sometimes it's a game, and sometimes you win, sometimes you lose.

C17PSGR

You may be right but ... if you've read a court opinion or two, you'd catch that the Ginsberg decision didn't deal with breach of contract, only breach of the implied covenant of good faith and fair dealing which sought to expand the contract. And, of course, the previous ADA case permitted a breach of contract case. So, while they might have the right to cancel an account, they would otherwise be obligated to comply with the express terms and conditions of a promotion. Isn't that a fair reading of the cases?

avs92

Yes I tried inputting the PNR directly. So after about an hour of trying to login, the award booking did finally show up, but is really glitchy. I assume its an IT glitch, but one minute the booking exists and the next its gone.

rabbits5

Adam1222

It could, if the promotion was the contract. But you'd have to argue that the T&C of this particular provision were incorporated into the contract to purchase a specific ticket. I think the better argument is the contract was for the ticket, which they are refunding. And since miles don't become your property anyway, it's a bit of a stretch to argue you contracted to buy miles. The Iberia Plus program is an entirely separate program/contract, governed by its own T&Cs, separate from the contract of carriage.
I think the better claim on the merits would be some sort of consumer fraud/deceptive practices claim, which is where promotional offers usually can better be challenged. But such claims are clearly preempted. And courts more recently have rejected attempts to repackage such claims as breach of contract claims. See, e.g., Lagen v. United Continental Holdings
Most of it is probably moot, though, since there would be problems with jurisdiction in the United States for many folks at issue here, who bought tickets that don't touch the US (and many aren't US-based either).

C17PSGR

Certainly they would have serious problems with consumer fraud claims but agree its probably preempted. On the other hand, if I was a California class action plaintiffs attorney (I'm not), I'd probably try a 17200 claim and argue that Ginsberg didn't address the argument that everything with a frequent flyer program and that a promotion award points before flying (and arguably with no requirement to fly) isn't covered by the ADA. Additionally, since many of these purchases were for internal Spanish flights marketed on a US website, I'm not sure whether the ADA applies at all. All in all, not a bad class case. Also, as an edit, Hickcox-Huffman v. US Airways is a pretty helpful case with such claims as the 9th Circuit held that the ADA doesn't preempt claims for breach of contract of a voluntary undertaking in connection with baggage fees.

As for me, if I get the inconsistencies email that everyone else is getting, I might go the simple breach of contract route in small claims court. Since Iberia doesn't fly from my state and I need to think through the state jurisdictional issues, it might be easier to file a small claims case in Illinois or California since they fly there. Of course, there is the value of time fighting this but while I understand your unclean hands argument, here it appears they are denying to anyone with a new account without any explanation.

Also, the cost of buying 90,000 is 1647 euro so if one had 200-300 US purchasers in the class, I'd be shocked if this didn't result in a 2-3 million settlement.

frenchft