WoH 2023 Category Changes to Take Effect on Mar 28
Mar 3, 23, 4:50 pm
#122
Ambassador: World of Hyatt
Join Date: Apr 2000
Location: San Diego,CA
Posts: 9,780
Rates have in some markets have come down yet the point rates remain high
I’ve been booking rooms in San Francisco 4 star properties for 150 to 200 on average for the past few years yet a redemption is 23,000 points
That says it all
I’ve been booking rooms in San Francisco 4 star properties for 150 to 200 on average for the past few years yet a redemption is 23,000 points
That says it all
Mar 3, 23, 5:41 pm
#123
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: IAH
Programs: UA 2MM, Hyatt Diamond, SPG Gold
Posts: 2,037
That doesn't say anything. Those same properties will be $600-$800 or more at certain times of the year. It's just like complaining the PH Beaver Creek is moving to Cat 8 when one can book it for under $300 in the off season.
Mar 3, 23, 7:18 pm
#124
Join Date: Dec 2018
Posts: 820
I was thinking about how the devaluation would change my decision making, and had the following that stood out:
Park Hyatt Aviara, Seabird, Mason Pacific going up --> I am more likely to stay at HR Huntington Beach. Had a very nice stay at the PH recently, but was already debating whether I would go back there before Huntington Beach, because Huntington has beach access, more child friendly pools, and bigger standard suite (Huntington Suite). Now the choice is more obvious. Never really considered Alila Marea after reading reviews.
HR Maui --> HRC Maui. Same points now. True, you don't get Globalist benefits, and there's the 10am checkout time, but HRC rooms were already soooo much bigger, pool area less crowded, etc. Finding availability is more difficult though. In Wailea, some of the Destination places are still very attractive.
Squaw Creek -- staying with HR Tahoe. If HR Tahoe undergoes renovation or rebranding, entirely expecting it to go up to Cat 7 too.
Grand Hyatt Kauai -- if going back, probably would still pay points, but only if I have SUA and find availability.
Park Hyatt Vienna --> Andaz Vienaa. Particular to my own traveling situation with family, Andaz was probably going to be the better choice with two kids anyways. Andaz outside of city center being a main detraction, but going forward price difference is simply too large.
The Cape -- love this place, and would pay the higher points amount. However, recently got a Hyatt timeshare offer for Sirena del Mar, which looks basically next door to the Cape. Haven't done a timeshare offer in ages, but would probably consider it if going back to Cabo in conjunction with a stay at the Cape to save some points.
Andaz WeHo and The Shay --> probably just avoiding Hyatt when in LA, or just booking a Hyatt Place. Probably book the HP Pasadena before the price goes up (though Cat 3 to 4 is smallest increase in points).
Hotel Éclat Taipei down to Cat 2 -- might consider this over Grand Hyatt Taipei, depending on whether GH is at normal or peak points.
Park Hyatt Aviara, Seabird, Mason Pacific going up --> I am more likely to stay at HR Huntington Beach. Had a very nice stay at the PH recently, but was already debating whether I would go back there before Huntington Beach, because Huntington has beach access, more child friendly pools, and bigger standard suite (Huntington Suite). Now the choice is more obvious. Never really considered Alila Marea after reading reviews.
HR Maui --> HRC Maui. Same points now. True, you don't get Globalist benefits, and there's the 10am checkout time, but HRC rooms were already soooo much bigger, pool area less crowded, etc. Finding availability is more difficult though. In Wailea, some of the Destination places are still very attractive.
Squaw Creek -- staying with HR Tahoe. If HR Tahoe undergoes renovation or rebranding, entirely expecting it to go up to Cat 7 too.
Grand Hyatt Kauai -- if going back, probably would still pay points, but only if I have SUA and find availability.
Park Hyatt Vienna --> Andaz Vienaa. Particular to my own traveling situation with family, Andaz was probably going to be the better choice with two kids anyways. Andaz outside of city center being a main detraction, but going forward price difference is simply too large.
The Cape -- love this place, and would pay the higher points amount. However, recently got a Hyatt timeshare offer for Sirena del Mar, which looks basically next door to the Cape. Haven't done a timeshare offer in ages, but would probably consider it if going back to Cabo in conjunction with a stay at the Cape to save some points.
Andaz WeHo and The Shay --> probably just avoiding Hyatt when in LA, or just booking a Hyatt Place. Probably book the HP Pasadena before the price goes up (though Cat 3 to 4 is smallest increase in points).
Hotel Éclat Taipei down to Cat 2 -- might consider this over Grand Hyatt Taipei, depending on whether GH is at normal or peak points.
Mar 3, 23, 7:24 pm
#126
Ambassador: World of Hyatt
Join Date: Apr 2000
Location: San Diego,CA
Posts: 9,780
My suggestion is do your research & the math more closely.
Also look at major cities rather than resorts with serious high and low seasons like PH BC
You don’t have to take my word for it you can simply go the points calendar online and see yourself over the next 12 months
if your lucky you’ll find a point redemptions for 17,000.They are there occasionally and it’s no bargain anytime.
That means there is never a night where you won’t spend at least 300 plus dollars a night to redeem your points.
Tonight the cash rate 180 redeem for 23,000 points over double the cash rate @ 400 plus dollars.Fond of Hyatt but it’s not the Park Hyatt or the St Regis at 400 plus dollars
It’s a Centric a tired Hyatt Regency or at best the ok Grand Hyatt from the 70s
Last edited by 777 global mile hound; Mar 3, 23 at 7:35 pm
Mar 3, 23, 7:25 pm
#127
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Pacific Northwest
Programs: UA 1MM, AS MVPG, Bonvoyed Gold, Honors Dia, Hyatt Explorer, IHG Plat, ...
Posts: 14,161
Will report back.
Mar 4, 23, 5:25 am
#128
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Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: Watchlisted by the prejudiced, en route to purgatory
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We know prices are stickier on the way down than on the way up in this space.
Hyatt is not in the business of reducing the point prices as much as the hotel properties may reduce their $ rates. Hyatt is incentivized to increase their margins from the program’s operations — not reduce or even maintain the margins — and that has implications for point price changes. And the hotels have increasingly shifted to preferring to maintain high rates with lower occupancy than lower rates to boost occupancy. And yet Hyatt will still use the published high $ rates as a driver to keep inflated/inflating point price rates for hotel nights even with declining occupancy (and expenses for award nights at the lower-occupancy-but-still-high-rates hotels).
Shouldn’t be a surprise. Being a publicly-traded hotel company and having a bank card operation has consequences for the loyalty program customers/hamsters on the hamster wheel.
The three tier point pricing structure per award category was Hyatt revealing their cards on boosting the devaluations of the points. And now we have these 2023 increases too.
Let’s just wait to see how long it will be until there will be a 100k Hyatt point sign-up offer for the Hyatt bank cards.
Hyatt is not in the business of reducing the point prices as much as the hotel properties may reduce their $ rates. Hyatt is incentivized to increase their margins from the program’s operations — not reduce or even maintain the margins — and that has implications for point price changes. And the hotels have increasingly shifted to preferring to maintain high rates with lower occupancy than lower rates to boost occupancy. And yet Hyatt will still use the published high $ rates as a driver to keep inflated/inflating point price rates for hotel nights even with declining occupancy (and expenses for award nights at the lower-occupancy-but-still-high-rates hotels).
The three tier point pricing structure per award category was Hyatt revealing their cards on boosting the devaluations of the points. And now we have these 2023 increases too.
Let’s just wait to see how long it will be until there will be a 100k Hyatt point sign-up offer for the Hyatt bank cards.
Mar 4, 23, 5:40 am
#129
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Virginia, USA
Posts: 4,461
I would like to see Hyatt offset this devaluation nonsense with a high dollar, high value credit card. Somewhat like the AmEx Hilton Aspire (which I have and like). $500-$600 annual fee with Globalist status. Yes, I can hear the cries of "it will devalue Globalist and open the gates." But someone willing to spend $600 on a Hyatt branded credit card should be the type of Globalist Hyatt would value.
Mar 4, 23, 5:59 am
#130
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Join Date: Jul 2001
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I would like to see Hyatt offset this devaluation nonsense with a high dollar, high value credit card. Somewhat like the AmEx Hilton Aspire (which I have and like). $500-$600 annual fee with Globalist status. Yes, I can hear the cries of "it will devalue Globalist and open the gates." But someone willing to spend $600 on a Hyatt branded credit card should be the type of Globalist Hyatt would value.
At the point when the rebate currency stops being a big draw and becomes closer to being a joke, the Joker card to be played by the loyalty program operators in this space is the draw of elite status. For me, Hyatt is no longer as much the exception and exceptional leader in the space as it used to be.
The combination of lower value to be gotten from redeeming points and the relatively high number of nights required to get valuable elite status benefits makes for a headwind. And while the headwind doesn’t count for as much when the “others are worse”, it’s still a tailwind toward increased free agency and more mercenary approach toward program engagement.
Mar 4, 23, 6:20 am
#131
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Barcelona, London, on a plane
Programs: BA Silver, TK E+, AA PP, Hyatt Globalist, Marriott LT Plat, Hilton Diamond
Posts: 12,278
Marriott "lets" you add points so that they are free to charge more points. Everybody loses out. (except Marriott)
Instead of people complaining about "I can't spend Cat 1-4 certificates usefully", how's about a little perspective. A $95 annual fee shouldn't get you $500 room nights in Manhattan. It does get you hundreds of hotels costing $200-300...
But if Chase want to sell credit cards based on cardholders getting a free night in New York, then they should negotiate that kind of deal with Hyatt...
Mar 4, 23, 6:26 am
#132
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Virginia, USA
Posts: 4,461
As the hotel point devaluations get worse, the major hotel loyalty programs seem to migrate toward getting in the business of selling high elite tier status via higher fee credit card products. Marriott sells Platinum this way; Hilton sells Platinum this way; and IHG sells Platinum (but that’s on a cheaper card and doesn’t provide Marriott Platinum and even Hilton Gold level benefits). I would not be surprised if Hyatt also gets into that high elite status credit card game.
At the point when the rebate currency stops being a big draw and becomes closer to being a joke, the Joker card to be played by the loyalty program operators in this space is the draw of elite status. For me, Hyatt is no longer as much the exception and exceptional leader in the space as it used to be.
The combination of lower value to be gotten from redeeming points and the relatively high number of nights required to get valuable elite status benefits makes for a headwind. And while the headwind doesn’t count for as much when the “others are worse”, it’s still a tailwind toward increased free agency and more mercenary approach toward program engagement.
At the point when the rebate currency stops being a big draw and becomes closer to being a joke, the Joker card to be played by the loyalty program operators in this space is the draw of elite status. For me, Hyatt is no longer as much the exception and exceptional leader in the space as it used to be.
The combination of lower value to be gotten from redeeming points and the relatively high number of nights required to get valuable elite status benefits makes for a headwind. And while the headwind doesn’t count for as much when the “others are worse”, it’s still a tailwind toward increased free agency and more mercenary approach toward program engagement.
Mar 4, 23, 6:47 am
#133
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Join Date: Jul 2001
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Given how the Category 1-4 free night award availability is far more restricted than points availability at such hotels, I’m pretty sure that those hotels where the Cat 1-4 free night award is used aren’t costing $200-300 per night. They are probably costing less than $75 per room night booked with such free night awards.
Mar 4, 23, 8:07 am
#134
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: LGA/JFK/EWR
Programs: UA 1K1.75MM, Hyatt Globalist, abandoned Marriott LTT (RIP SPG), Hertz PC
Posts: 21,135
I would like to see Hyatt offset this devaluation nonsense with a high dollar, high value credit card. Somewhat like the AmEx Hilton Aspire (which I have and like). $500-$600 annual fee with Globalist status. Yes, I can hear the cries of "it will devalue Globalist and open the gates." But someone willing to spend $600 on a Hyatt branded credit card should be the type of Globalist Hyatt would value.
Hyatt already has shortcuts for small biz types by the 2 nights per $5k spend.
Mar 4, 23, 8:09 am
#135
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: LGA/JFK/EWR
Programs: UA 1K1.75MM, Hyatt Globalist, abandoned Marriott LTT (RIP SPG), Hertz PC
Posts: 21,135
Given how the Category 1-4 free night award availability is far more restricted than points availability at such hotels, I’m pretty sure that those hotels where the Cat 1-4 free night award is used aren’t costing $200-300 per night. They are probably costing less than $75 per room night booked with such free night awards.
the whole goal of a 1-4 cert is precisely to redeem for $200+ - not $75.
