SEA to HKG route - smooth ride?
 

Hi all, I'm new on here and I'm quite the nervous flyer. By that I mean I have a fear of it and panic at the sign of any turbulence. I'm basically terrified getting on an int'l flight from SEA to HKG soon, as the last time I flew this route was 8-9 years ago. My fear of flying really came on in the last 5 years or so with all of the plane crashes/turbulence incidents on the news. I know flying is one of the safest routes of transportation, but even so I can't help but thinking of the worst and get scared.

My question is, for those who frequent asia from the west coast or do the SEA to HKG route, how is it? I know it's a hard question to answer and really depends on timing....but looking for some reassurance/comfort from experienced flyers and what I can expect? I'm hoping for a smooth ride of course....

Thanks in advance!

While I have a private pilot license, I'm not knowledgeable enough to answer this kind of question. You will experience bumps, there's no way around that. Tropical areas during summer time can be bad and flying thru the jet stream can be bumpy. Don't forget you're going into a hurricane zone which spans pretty wide in the west Pacific. So here are some tips from a former frequent flyer: buckle up all the time! Even if you're just sitting there reading a book or watching the IFE. The stories you hear about turbulence injuries all comes from people not buckled in. Yes, Clear Air Turbulence can't be detected and if you are up and about to use the washroom, you're out of luck. It won't probably won't crash during turbulence incidents, is there a chance of being mishandled, yes, but the chances are pretty low. Look at the crashes in the last 5 years and see which operators are involved. How often you see the US big 3, CX, JAL, ANA, CI, and EVA having a major incident? Look up safety ratings online if you need a piece of mind. Finally, read the safety instructions a few times, memorize how many rows you are from the exit, ware pants and shoes (not shorts, skirts, crocs, sandals, high heels).

Three things I can never understand people do on planes:

1. Not wearing seat belts at all times
2.Wearing shorts on flights. Why you ask? If you have to slide down Emerg. exit you will get a friction burn. not pretty and hurts like hell!
3. Going to washroom barefeet, (YUCK)

Seat belts are restricting and uncomfortable, especially in a seat will poor range of adjustment. Planes are stuffy and hot, especially the Asian lines that have the temps turned way up. Yes, I don't understand why people go to the washroom in the socks and step in people's pee. If men have a problem aiming (guilty of that myself) on land, think about how bad it is on a bumpy plane ride.

My fear of bumpy ride somewhat went away when I started flight training. Turbulence in a small Piper or Cessna can feel way worst than riding in an airliner. Plus learning to recover from stalls and spins kind of make minor turbulence a cake walk.

Lol, not a super reassuring response with "it probably won't crash, but if mishandled, yes"...yikes. I've done some research, as I figured millions fly every year and knowledge is power. You never know what pilot you're going to get....the last several severe turbulence was just that, but all flights were able to land safely. As you said, there are injuries, but for those not buckled. I stay buckled the entire time I fly unless I absolutely have to go to the restroom, even then I avoid doing so.

We will be flying Cathay Pacific and they are well rated. I'm hoping to learn on here from experienced flyers what it's been like, why they are not nervous about it, and hopefully learn more about how safe flying is by understanding that turbulence essentially can't bring a plane down....unfortunately your post didn't make me feel any better about that...

If you're flying CX then you shouldn't have to worry about the pilots mishandling the situation. I'm not going to sugar coat the situation because pilots have mishandle poor weather situation before either by mistake or by cowboy attitude. This is simply a chance you're taking every time you decide to fly. It is out of your control much like how temperature and air circulation works. If you are in the Seattle area, it appears there is a clinic to address the fear of flying, "Fear of Flying Clinic Seattle". They may be better at easing your concern than me. As I said previously, I got less nervous when I started flight training but I wasn't scared to start with. It's not just the sensation of flying a small plane in choppy and hot conditions but also attending ground school to learn about basic theory of aerodynamics and weather conditions that helped.

Here are the reasons why I don't think turbulence will end up in the worst case:
1. Airplane designs have come a long way, it takes a lot to break things.
2. Pilots at the safer airlines generally have better training, they know the limits of the airplane, the limits are well published by manufacturers, for example, the max speed the plane should fly at during gusty conditions (Va & Vb).
3. Those squeaking sound during turbulence most likely come from the interior fittings. Think about how your car squeaks when it goes over bumps. Is your engine going to drop out from under your car? No. It is the door panels and seats that are making that squeaking sound as they rub against each other and the metal structure.
4. Airliners usually have at least 1 backup to all critical system.
5. The sensation of having your seat drop out of you / the plane fell like 3000 ft a second comes from the spike in vertical acceleration. You are not glue to the seat but the seat is bolted to the plane. So when the plane drops a bit, your body isn't for a brief moment which gives you the sensation of falling like 3000 ft in a second.

This article seem interesting, Point #4 , pick a flight earlier in the day during summer time to avoid thermal related turbulence. If I recall correctly, the new CX SEA->HKG flight leaves around 1AM and arrives around 5AM in HKG. So in theory, it should be a bit calmer than the afternoon flights we get in Vancouver.

https://www.usatoday.com/story/trave...ence/12301043/

Thanks for your detailed reply, I appreciate it. My anxiety really began about 5 or so years ago and progressively got worse as the media makes it easy to hear about the severe turbulence incidents or plane crashes. Especially recently there's been a few planes with incidents of hitting severe turbulence. So trying to educate myself and understand flying better in hopes that it will reset my thinking. And also hearing the experiences of frequent flyers helps as well....Many thanks

I don't know if this will help you or scare you, but this video of the Boeing 777 wing test shows you just how much stress the wings can take.

People constantly exaggerate things, but if you are truly terrified of flying, then don't. It's not worth risking your mental health.
I assume you would be flying round trip, so...yeah. You would have to do it twice.

I would probably talk to your current mental health specialist about this. They can prescribe you medicine if you must take this trip.

If we're at the point where I'm having to exit the aircraft via an emergency slide, I think the friction burn is going to be a pretty minor worry of mine. I'll continue to wear shorts on long haul flights instead of sticking with jeans in case we have an emergency event.

OP - my advice is to take UA instead of CX.

Weather condition is something we can never change. When it happens, it happens. However, the airline's policy actually impacts how good or bad the flight can be. Specifically, not all airlines deviate the designated flight paths to avoid weather.

Why I would say UA? I frequently fly to the area where typhoons are originated (SFO-HNL-GUM-HKG). Still I was able to enjoy a smooth ride with limited impact by the weather. Also, I took off twice from HKG under severe weather. Despite the wind and rain, they were still relatively smooth.

Although old, I do believe OP you are trying to avoid something like this:

https://globalnews.ca/video/1158700/...pacific-flight

Then I won't take CX.

No one tells you to make it as tight as possible.

Also - even you loose up the seat belt a little, but still buckled up, the seat belt can still give you some protections.

It's interesting you point out UA vs CX. I did fly UA once upon a time very long ago. I don't believe they are the best. CX has been ranked as top safest airline and run many asia runs. I don't think airlines matter too much as long as both have well trained pilots. Emirates is ranked high but recently ran into a severe turbulence event...same with Air Canada. I can only wish for good luck. The peace of mind is....all those flights appeared to have landed safely.

But good to know you have had smooth flights while frequently flying to that region even with typhoons and such. That is reassuring.

I generally avoid flying and haven't flown internationally since I became unfortunately, so yes I do avoid it. However I am making this trip to attend a funeral as my grandma passed away and it is important to me and the family that I am there, so it is out of necessity.

I don't have a current mental health specialist as I don't have a mental condition simply because I have a fear of flying. I usually just don't fly and I'm fine. I've already talked to my GP and they have prescribed something to help with anxiety.

Right??? Lol

OP - seriously, are you looking for a smooth ride or service? FWIW - things don't always add up.

First, the top safest airline for this year is QF. CX is 9th and UA is 19th. Second, in determinating the safety ranking, past incidents are considered. With the case of UA, that include UA 93 and 175, i.e. 9/11.

The ranking is really an insult to UA and many others.

Pilot training is never the question. As I have said again - the airline's policy determines how flexible the pilots can operate the aircraft. If you still are not sure why it makes a difference, try taking SEA-SFO on both WN and UA, you will know the difference.

The poster appears to be American. For some reason most Americans seem feel it is essential to keep an army of medical specialists employed. As a Brit I haven't visited any doctor for over 30 years, so I don't even "have" a GP. I guess we can all choose where to spend our money!

Yes, you have invoked both extreme stereotypes!

That should help.

I think that's your best option. You can't rationalize the irrational. If you've got a phobia, no amount of common sense is going to eliminate it. There's no way to guarantee a smooth ride on such a long flight. Even the polar route can get a bumpy once in a while, although usually it's smooth as glass. I don't think I've been on a TPAC flight that where the pilot didn't need to turn on the seatbelt sign at least once.

Just pop a xanax or whatever is prescribed to you and get through it. I would also recommend telling the flight crew that you're a little nervous about flying. I've seen FAs comforting fearful pax in J a few times, if you're traveling in Y not sure you'd get the same treatment but it couldn't hurt to give a heads up. Good luck, you'll be fine and maybe when your flight is over you'll think it wasn't so bad after all.

+1

One more tip. Try the prescribed drug once or twice BEFORE your trip. Don't try a brand new (to you) drug as you sit down for the flight. Drug reactions are rare - very rare. But it is only prudent to discover your reaction (or lack of) to a brand new medication in the comfort and safety of your own home.

Also if you need to take one give it time to work. I had a moron friend take 5 Xanax 0.5 mg because it wasn't working fast enough she claims. then she drinks wine with it too (do not mix anti-anxiety pills with alcohol either). Ended up comatose on the plane and the flight attendant thought she was dead because she was not responsive. they took her off on a stretcher. Good thing it was only a two hours flight and wasn't a trans pacific flight.

[QUOTE=garykung;31315975]OP - seriously, are you looking for a smooth ride or service? FWIW - things don't always add up.

Look, I'm not here looking for an argument or a 'smooth ride' - I was asking for others experience what they typically have seen from SEA -> HKG as I'm not an experience int'l flyer and just want to have the right expectations. And I'm hoping to gain more knowledge in regards to flying in hopes that by understanding how safe it is, it will make me less nervous.

I've done some research and have asked others, and while CX is not ranked the best, they have a very good reputation for safety and service. I know Quantas #1 but that's irrelevant as they are not available for my flight route. You clearly have a preference with United, which is fine, everyone has their preferred airline. But I already said I was flying CX and I'm not going to cancel it at this point just to find a UA flight. They don't offer direct either.

I've flown plenty of times from SEA-SFO as my company headquarters is down there, and my preferred airline is Alaska. Sorry, I'm just not a UA fan.

Thanks, and you're right about it - I realize it's an irrational fear but hey it's hard to rationalize the irrational. I am trying hard to get more comfortable with the idea and by talking to many people who have experienced flying int'l has helped made me feel a bit better. Part of my fear stems from not knowing what is normal on a flight, so I figured it might help if I know that the bumps are normal, the noises are normal, etc. Because I have a tendency to start thinking crazy in the air and wonder 'what if'.....

Got the xanax and will be using it. Thanks for the tip on notifying the FAs.

That's a good tip. I've taken both scopolamine and xanax before for long haul flights, but that was 8-9 years ago. At the time, other than some mild side effects I was. So assuming i won't react differently to it now, I should know what to expect.

OP - Some good advice on here already, but my penny's worth;
Turbulence.
1. The crew may well know it's approaching, and will take action to avoid it as far as possible.
2. If it comes without warning they will, where possible, take similar action as 1 above, just a few seconds later than they would have liked to.
3. They do this to keep the ride as comfortable as they can for passengers, not necessarily for safety, the aeroplane is more than strong enough to handle it.
I would say try to relax and enjoy your trip, but having just seen the reason for your journey that would be inappropriate. I hope that you are able to approach your flight with a little more confidence.

Actually, not really the case.

There are 5 carriers offering USA-HKG nonstop - AA, CX, HX, SQ and UA. I have tried CX, SQ, and UA.

UA is my go-to airline because I am SFO based. But my preference is SQ whenever feasible.

You did not actually say it. It was guessed out.

Hi there, many thanks for your reply and advice. It is reassuring to know....I've been talking with people and learning what can be expected and I think that is helpful. Odd thing is, I remember when I was a kid I actually like turbulence, because it made for a more interesting ride, like a rollercoaster. Of course I didn't understand what flying was or was aware of accidents occuring....it was a much simpler time for me. Even now, I just have to keep reminding myself that flying is the safest mode of transportation and majority of the population doesn't think twice about it. I have found that as I've aged, I've become a bit more paranoid and worrying about things I don't necessarily have control over.....

I did, in my July 15th post I said we are flying Cathay Pacific. And I assume you read that when you decided to join this thread and replied with: OP - my advice is to take UA instead of CX.
Which to me was odd advice seeing as I already said I was flying CX....lol. Anyway, this is becoming irrelevant to the original point of my post.....

Thank you to everyone who's responded.

[QUOTE=prezapwr03;31321700]Qantas might be 'number 1' but they have a tiny fleet and with the exception of Tokyo and Hong Kong, their flying conditions are hardly the equivalent of the Asian carriers that are flying around, daily, in some quite severe weather conditions including tropical storms and hot, humid conditions. I'd argue the Asian carriers probably have more experience in that respect. Whether that translates to a 'safer ride', who knows.

Qantas has also had some major incidents. Just no fatalities.

The damage to turbulence is when passengers aren't wearing their seat belts and end up hitting the ceiling or other parts of the cabin. If you have your seatbelt loosely fastened at all times you will protect yourslef.

The plane is not going to break apart. It's been tested to within an inch of it's capability, and then some.

How do the rest of us deal with it? Just relaxing, knowing the plane is strong and more than capable of coping with anything that's thrown at it. As long as you keep yourself secure inside (seat belt), you'll be fine.

This is the second time I saw a post from you stereotyping Americans. (The other was deleted along with my response to you). What is your problem? Perhaps it's time to see a doctor ; )

Just think of turbulence like driving along a gravel road, or a road with some potholes. However, if you're in the car on that road, and you lose your grip on the steering wheel, you could end up in a ditch or wrapped around a tree. At 35,000 feet...well...there's nothing there.

Most turbulence is light-to-moderate, like a mildly bumpy road. Heavy turbulence is when your drink may spill or splash if you're not careful. None of this is really of any concern to the pilots, and even a crewmember or passenger walking around is very unlikely to be injured. (But out of caution, crew will usually buckle in for this). On a North Pacific routing, I would certainly expect some amount of heavy turbulence. Again, nothing more than a bumpy road. It may be uncomfortable and annoying, but it's not unsafe, especially if you're in your seat.

The real severe turbulence, where stuff hits the ceiling because the plane may drop a few hundred feet or more from hitting an air pocket, is rather uncommon (I'm sure it happens somewhere once a week or more, but with thousands and thousands of flights, the odds it happens to you are very very low. But still, if you're belted in, the chances of injury are minimal (only thing that could really happen is your neighbors laptop flies in the air and lands on your head...). I think it would be very unusual to be cruising along and then immediately encounter severe turbulence where things go flying. Usually it would be preceded with moderate to heavy turbulence, at which point the captain will tell everyone to return to their seats. It's more a preventative measure in case of severe turbulence, not because there's any serious risk with moderate or even heavy turbulence.

With 1.5million miles on UA, mostly across the Atlantic, and many flights on other airlines, I have never experienced severe turbulence and only rarely experienced moderate turbulence. Mostly, the worst it is is like driving on a bumpy road.

My one point is that, the larger the plane, the more it seems to be damped.

Big difference, unfortunately, between TATL and TPAC when it comes to the risk of severe turbulance :(