svpii

As luck has it, I'm making USAIR Chairman's Preferred and Hilton Diamond in the same time frame - in about 3 weeks.

I'd appreciate hearing from those of you who have gone before me what wonderful things I can expect! More upgrades? (Please say yes!) Better attitudes? (Please say yes!) Stays get posted promptly? (Please say yes!)

Seriously, will I notice a difference?

doc

http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/Forum57/HTML/000160.html
http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/Forum57/HTML/000628.html

tinkybelle

AH THE RESPECT!!!
yes Hilton do treat their Diamonds very well-in asia at least.I have always been upgraded to exec club without asking.In the USA is a little different. several times ive had to ask.

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svpii

Yea, I know, big deal - but it was a goal and I made it Now I'll be interested to see if it's worth anything. I don't read any real differences between Gold and Diamond, other than bonus percentages, so I'm not sure it's worth it to do more than Gold and perhaps get Gold in another chain as well.. sure would make traveling easier. How do the rest of you strategize this?

jetsetter

I've thought of going for Diamond, but see little added benefits at the hotel properties themselves. For example, they do not have a published Diamond Amenity, in the way that SPG and Hyatt do. I wonder despite this if some properties have an unofficial Diamond Amenity? E.g. snack on arrival, extra food/bevarage credit, free local calls, etc. Gold/Diamond seem to get the same upgrade, though I suppose if there were a lot of elites you would be ahead as a Diamond. The only added benefits seem to be the point bonus, the guaranteed reservation, and the Diamond 800 number. However, who knows what changes (if any) will be in 2001? Perhaps a couple of added Dimaond perks?

MisterNice

quote:
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However, who knows what changes (if any) will be in 2001? Perhaps a couple of added Dimaond perks?
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Itsa not what they promise itsa what they deliver. As you might have surmised on this FT board, they promise MUCH but usually DELIVER little. Sad but true! The only thing I can say on their behalf, is that they are for the most part, regrettably, under-whelmingly consistant in this regard.

Hyatt always grants comp club access for their Diamond members (I even received it in Europe too although not it is not officially listed). Many, actually most, Hiltons told me, "WE NEVER UPGRADE, DIAMONDS OR WHATEVER. YOU MUST PAY THE HIGHER RATE!!"

MisterNice

chix

misternice-

I disagree. The Diamond desk will go to great extremes to get you an award stay at a high demand time while others will be shut out.... Big feature. And btw - Thanks Evonne.

As far as upgrades go, sure, many of the properties don't automatically u/g you, but once you point out your Diamond status and ask, they usually will give you a great room.

I would say that if there's anything that HH could do to make themselves shine compared to SPG, it would be to train their hotels to automatically upgrade Diamonds, and give us a special welcome amenity.

Hilton provides Diamonds a free breakfast each day, even at non-towers locations, SPG does not.

I could keep going, but I have to run...

dshafiee

I find Hilton Diamond varies from property to property. Most of the time you can get what you want, but you have to ask.

I have found that some properties will flat out refuse even giving access to the club.

I just made Hilton Diamond, so I am still testing the waters.

As far for Hyatt, I always get club access without asking and a welcome amenity. They are also great about late check out, something Hilton is not. I have been a Diamond at Hyatt for 5 years now. I switched to Hilton this year because Hyatt's points have become almost worthless.

To sum up:

Hyatt Diamond
-----------------------
* 30% Point Bonus
* Always Regency Club Access
* Will upgrade room 50% when asked
* 72hr reservation guarantee
* 60% more points per night if blackout or sold out of free rooms
* Exclusive 800 Res/GP account line
* Welcome amenity (Bev + Food), choose at check in.
* Late check out/early check in (800-check-in)

Hilton Diamond
---------------------------
* 50% point bonus / double dip
* 80% club access
* Free breakfast most of the time
* Room upgrades? Have not had one yet.
* 48hr reservation guarantee
* No blackout dates for diamond
* Late checkout (1pm, if your lucky)
* Diamond Desk for special requests, otherwise general number.

One thing I really like about Hilton is the choices you have in each cit. If not Hilton, Doubletree and Embassy are great.

Also HHonnors hotels have much more reasonable rates then Hyatt overall. Lately, Hyatt has really priced themselves within the upper hotel chains. I feel that their rooms compare with Hilton/Doubletree.

Hope this helps.

[This message has been edited by dshafiee (edited 12-03-2000).]

Butcher Bird

Mister Nice,

Now, that was not very nice! Tasteless jokes aside, I would have to disagree with you also.

While I am merely a gold Hilton swine, the HH folks have always been very nice to me. In addition, their website works well, points always post ASAP, and the double dip program is sweet.

The only part that I would agree with you on is that the upgrades do not occur all that often. Oh, boo-hoo. Somehow this is supposed to mean that you ain't a gettin the props and 'spect that you so richly deserve? Come on, it is a nice benefit to get on occasion. The HH chain (or any other) does not owe it to us every time.

MisterNice

Butcher Bird-

Any time I am not upgraded (or turned for an upgrade after begging), I go to the nearest telephone and call 800-HILTONS. I then politely ask if any exec level are available. They usually say, "sure", then I ask do you have 4 rooms available there? They usually say "sure". My question to you, or the Adam-Guy is why do they basically lie in the HH T&C? Or in their recent 4 page insert ad in USATODAY I read recently after being turned down for a free breakfast. I showed it to the PDX Hilton desk clerk. She sez, itsa wrong, no free breakfast for you. Please read:

The 2000 HH Terms & Conditions are at http://www.hilton.com/hhonors/benefits/levels.html and here is the statement for upgrades for Diamond/Gold elites stays outside the USA (basically the same wording for Gold):
"...At Hilton hotels outside the U.S. with Executive Floors, Diamond VIPs will be provided with a guest room on the Executive Floor, whenever possible. In cases when there are no Executive Floors or where Executive Floor accommodations have been fully booked, Diamond VIP members will be offered a complimentary continental breakfast each morning or an alternative special amenity...

jetsetter

I think it is important for elites to stand up for their rights. You are entitled to that upgrade, or that free breakfast. You paid for it, by paying for all those nights that made you elite. If you do not get the posted benefits, for no apparent reason, you should complain to the hotel property, Hilton Honors, Adam Burke, etc. Not only will you be educating properties on how to treat elite guests, you will likely receive some compensation if the service was actually not delivered to you. I had a problem upgrading at the new Hilton Old Town Alexandria. I know....I know....it's an old story. Others have had trouble upgrading at this property as well. The property often upgrades Gold/Diamond to s suite, but not to the executive level (which they call the soveirgn level). So I argued with them for at least one and one half hours straight, they called managers at home at 2AM, and finally in desperation they gave me the upgrade to the covetted soveirgn level. Given that I should receive upgrades freely and willingly, from the hotels, email I wrote up was forwarded to the front office manager of the given property. They ended up comping my stay, and the manager told me to call him next time I go to the hotel. Unfortunately, from reading threads on this board, it seems that the problem I had getting to the soveirgn level is one that is continuing to happen to other Flyertalkers.

My point is, and I've made it before aqs well, that if the properties are allowed by you and I (the guest) to "get away with" not giving us our benefits, then they might just continue to not provide the published benefits. Further, if they are allowed to slip in this regard, they may then continue to reduce service levels, counting on the fact that the average Honors VIP is going to ask for their upgrade (or whatever benefit), be told "no," frown, and just walk away without proactively challenging the policy or contacting officials of Hilton Honors to correct the properties errors. You are not only doing yourself a disservice by cheating yourself out of a benefit, but your paving the way for your elite brothers and sisters to be similarly deprived out of earned (and paid for) benefits. I read an awful lot of complaints about lack of provisioning of published benefits, both on this board and the SPG board, but those complaints generally do not include action steps (gradually escallating) that the person took in order to:
(A) Obtain personal compensation for the lack of benefit provisioning; and
(B) Address the underlying employee or local management training issues causing the lack of provisioning.

Mr. Nice, I like your idea of calling reservations about the availability of upgraded rooms.

I know it may not be feasible to fight for everything you should be getting, so then set a modest goal like 33% of the time if you do not receive a benefit, and there is no valid reason why, then you will really follow up 33% of the time. That still gives you slack to drop some things, and it empowers you to pick those instances worthy of your added attention. Plus, your story will make sor a good trip report as we track your complaint efforts, compensation, improvements, and then compare that with future guests expereinces at the given property.

Butcher Bird

Two thoughts on that:

1-It could be that a number of the hotels are franchise operations, and that they reserve the right to allocate rooms and other bennies at their discretion.

2-More likely (especially on the rooms) is that the hotels maintain a certain number or percent of the rooms for last minute arrivals, etc. I.e., you would find it much easier to get an upgrade on the weekend or on some other less heavily trafficked time.

As indicated before, I do agree with you a bit on the room upgrade issue. Or, more precisely, that the program implies readily available upgrades when in fact such upgrades are pretty rare in practice. Is this a lie on the part of HH? No, I do not think so. Possibly it represents a bit of misrepresntation. I.e., "when available" is not described in detail and I think that the upgrades are subject to the interpretation of this term.

Still, I think that the HH program is a great program. Personally, the room upgrade does not mean much to me. The miles and points do. I have received the comped breakfasts about half of the time and the upgraded room about a fourth of the time. Sweet deal in my opinion, and I interpret the when available to mean that they maintain a ready reserve of rooms as per numbers one and two above.

svpii

My question always when they don't upgrade me and rooms are available, is "who are they saving them for"? I pay published rates as a rule, only occasionally a special discounted rate (e.g. a client in that city may have a special rate), I'm usually scrubbed up pretty well on arrival, so I can't believe they are worried about me degrading the ambience on the exec floor... so what gives?

I do know as a NONSMOKER (for 19 days !) that I've found it easier.. I have learned that many concierge floors do not have smoking rooms - rather than get into it with smokers, they just say there are no rooms available. So that's part of it.

But on balance, my perception is that desk clerks and managers ALWAYS act like I'm trying to get away with something and that I have great audacity by asking for an upgrade. Yes the bonus points are nice, but the only real benefit I receive in exchange for making the effort to direct by business to Hilton properties is the service and room quality.

It's close to the start of a new year. I'm reevaluating my options. I'd really like Starwood, but I have difficulty lining up their properties in the locations I have to frequent - outskirts of middle tier cities around some business center tends to me my destination. For quality, there's really only Hilton, Marriott, on a consistent basis. I only had about 50 stays this year, so I can't get elite status by using two hotels. It's a head-scratcher!

Adam Burke

MisterNice -- First of all, please accept my sincere apologies for any stays on which you haven't received the benefits you've been promised. As I've said in numerous posts on FlyerTalk, we're committed to delivering the program's benefits in a consistent fashion. While my goal is for us to get it right 100% of the time, I think the reality is -- regrettably -- that mistakes will occasionally occur.

As others in this forum have suggested, the key is -- how well do we learn from those mistakes? As you've undoubtedly seen from my other posts, we truly value your input, and use it as the catalyst for continuous improvement.

In that spirit, I hope you'll take the opportunity to provide me with specifics of the instances you reference. Armed with that information, we can work directly with the hotels in question to ensure that we reiterate the correct program procedures.

You can reach me at [email protected]. And again, my apologies for the difficulties you've encountered to date.

Best regards,

Adam Burke
Senior Director, Marketing
Hilton HHonors Worldwide

svpii

Geez, Adam - you're such a champ! Truth be known you and your staff/colleagues are just about all the reason I need to continue my loyalty to Hilton! I feel really bad discussing any negative experiences I've had - but it's just that we're at such a disadvantage in the hotel area.

On the airlines, we can tell how many FC seats are open, where we are on an upgrade list, etc. - and as top level elite, I get upgraded virtually 100% of the time. In the hotel, I know nothing, and they aren't about to tell me anything, and I rarely get upgraded. It just seems the benefits are more than part crap shoot... when one is bold enough to ask, most typically the clerk tries to pretend he/she didn't hear me, the second tactic is to tell me that "yes, we've given you a very nice (read standard) room" - and when you ask what's really nice about it compared to other rooms and is it a suite or is it on the concierge floor, then you finally get the "we're completely sold out tonight" story - which as other have related - we can verify isn't true. It's just never worth the fight to me to spend that kind of time at the front desk after a long day traveling. So I keep coming back to my original question: why wouldn't they WANT to upgrade me? I'm their best customer! So they have folks coming in who haven't arrived yet... give them the room you're about to give me! They act like they can't give out an upgrade until every last person has arrived for the night.

On both airline and hotel, I frequently have to make real effort to direct my loyalty. Sometimes it means less favorable schedules, less favorable proximity to the client, etc. The points are really nice and I'm sure that someday I'll get to take some time off to use them. But what's meaningful to me tomorrow is to be welcomed sincerely as a loyal user and to perceive that the benefit extended to me at the particular property (when one even is) is given with graciousness and in a manner which made me believe I was valuable to Hilton and to that specific hotel.

This year, I can say that one hotel has done that for me: the Deerfield Beach Hilton. I have received letters of thanks from the manager, the desk staff is always extremely courteous, and I have a fairly good hit rate on upgrades. All the others are perfectly proper - never rude, just very perfunctory and clearly not really interested in my experience - it's a job they have - that's all.

Sorry - I didn't mean to go on and on - I have rather strong feelings as you probably can tell. But last week I made Diamond and I'm not abandoning ship yet!

Thanks again, Adam, for your consistent stellar attitude. If only we could clone you and put you at every hotel!