New HA policy for PPG flights - no advance seat selection
Oct 1, 2016, 8:43 am
#1
Original Poster
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: EYW
Programs: DL GM
Posts: 302
New HA policy for PPG flights - no advance seat selection
Came across this on the Samoa News website:
http://samoanews.com/content/en/comp...seating-policy
"Hawaiian Airlines’ new policy in which passengers can no longer pre-select seats via the airline’s website or kiosk in its Pago Pago flights"
Ugh - could get stuck in a middle seat for that 5+ hour flight purely at the random whim of the airport check-in agent and whatever weight balancing they are doing.
Complaints have been filed with the DOT but doubt anything will come of those since HA will say it is for safety reasons.
Here's the official advisory from HA:
https://www.hawaiianairlines.com/ale...-seat-advisory
"In order to meet aircraft weight and balance limitations, Hawaiian Airlines will be required to limit seats in certain rows on the B767 aircraft that operate flights on our Pago Pago (PPG) route to guests under the age of 13 or block them off entirely. Starting Sept. 22, advance seat selection will not be available for flights departing after Oct. 1. All seat assignments on our PPG flights will be processed by our Customer Service Agents at the airport. Our airport personnel will make every effort to accommodate guests while complying with these new guidelines."
In other words, if we feel like sticking you in the middle seat, you are screwed.
http://samoanews.com/content/en/comp...seating-policy
"Hawaiian Airlines’ new policy in which passengers can no longer pre-select seats via the airline’s website or kiosk in its Pago Pago flights"
Ugh - could get stuck in a middle seat for that 5+ hour flight purely at the random whim of the airport check-in agent and whatever weight balancing they are doing.
Complaints have been filed with the DOT but doubt anything will come of those since HA will say it is for safety reasons.
Here's the official advisory from HA:
https://www.hawaiianairlines.com/ale...-seat-advisory
"In order to meet aircraft weight and balance limitations, Hawaiian Airlines will be required to limit seats in certain rows on the B767 aircraft that operate flights on our Pago Pago (PPG) route to guests under the age of 13 or block them off entirely. Starting Sept. 22, advance seat selection will not be available for flights departing after Oct. 1. All seat assignments on our PPG flights will be processed by our Customer Service Agents at the airport. Our airport personnel will make every effort to accommodate guests while complying with these new guidelines."
In other words, if we feel like sticking you in the middle seat, you are screwed.
Last edited by chrisj85; Oct 1, 2016 at 8:51 am
Oct 1, 2016, 9:03 am
#2
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Jun 2001
Programs: DL 1 million, AA 1 mil, HH lapsed Diamond, Marriott Plat
Posts: 28,190
Oct 1, 2016, 9:21 am
#3
Original Poster
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: EYW
Programs: DL GM
Posts: 302
Not saying that the DOT complaints have merit, but Southwest doesn't operate on monopoly routes with 5+ hour flights. This would be a good route for HA to introduce an additional fee for advance seat selection if they ever wanted to do so - not like folks have any other choice.
I'll be showing up at the airport at the beginning of the check-in window next time I have to go to PPG.
I'll be showing up at the airport at the beginning of the check-in window next time I have to go to PPG.
Oct 1, 2016, 12:44 pm
#4
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Hawai'i Nei
Programs: Au: UA, Marriott, Hilton; GE
Posts: 7,132
Wow. This is interesting. I've never seen a weight restriction on a mainline aircraft, only on commuter props.
While Samoans can be NFL-sized, it is really shocking that the 767 can't accommodate all of them in random seating patterns.
While Samoans can be NFL-sized, it is really shocking that the 767 can't accommodate all of them in random seating patterns.
Oct 1, 2016, 1:52 pm
#5
Join Date: Mar 2002
Posts: 2,575
Some facts...
Airlines use average weights for each adult, child and bag on every flight.
Weight and Balance is performed on every single flight with one generally never noticing any issues. Lighter loads are often more prone to W&B problem. Cargo is loaded strategically as well. Even on widebody planes. Each flight is different, with different fuel, passenger count and cargo lift. Generally the law of averages can be applied and a safe flight will occur.
There are special rules for unique situations, when the laws of averages are not possible. This is true for sports charters and other situations that don't fall into the standard auspices of flight operations, like PPG.
PPG is a unique case and standard policies and procedures are not applied. PPG has its own set of challenges, passenger complement and operational restrictions. Thus, there are PPG specific policies and procedures. There always have been and always will. This is a further tightening of these already set in place procedures, likely in an effort to be more precise, accurate and further ensuring safe flight operations.
It is highly probable the FAA is driving these changes and not allowing advance seat assignments is HA's way of complying in a realistic and efficient manner. Let's say advance seat assignments are allowed... to comply with the changes, HA would likely have to reseat many people anyhow at the airport. Given the individual nature of each flight, performing the seating at the airport, when all the details of that particular flight are known and organized is logical. Why not just do it right the first time?
This is not a personal assault on anyone traveling to and from PPG. Nobody's rights are being infringed upon and HA is certainly not taking advantage of a situation to exploit the territory, race, culture and its people.
Airlines use average weights for each adult, child and bag on every flight.
Weight and Balance is performed on every single flight with one generally never noticing any issues. Lighter loads are often more prone to W&B problem. Cargo is loaded strategically as well. Even on widebody planes. Each flight is different, with different fuel, passenger count and cargo lift. Generally the law of averages can be applied and a safe flight will occur.
There are special rules for unique situations, when the laws of averages are not possible. This is true for sports charters and other situations that don't fall into the standard auspices of flight operations, like PPG.
PPG is a unique case and standard policies and procedures are not applied. PPG has its own set of challenges, passenger complement and operational restrictions. Thus, there are PPG specific policies and procedures. There always have been and always will. This is a further tightening of these already set in place procedures, likely in an effort to be more precise, accurate and further ensuring safe flight operations.
It is highly probable the FAA is driving these changes and not allowing advance seat assignments is HA's way of complying in a realistic and efficient manner. Let's say advance seat assignments are allowed... to comply with the changes, HA would likely have to reseat many people anyhow at the airport. Given the individual nature of each flight, performing the seating at the airport, when all the details of that particular flight are known and organized is logical. Why not just do it right the first time?
This is not a personal assault on anyone traveling to and from PPG. Nobody's rights are being infringed upon and HA is certainly not taking advantage of a situation to exploit the territory, race, culture and its people.
Oct 1, 2016, 2:34 pm
#7
Join Date: Mar 2002
Posts: 2,575
