May 2, 2013, 11:30 am
Last edit by: AlohaDaveKennedy
Frontier has announced upcoming charge changes:
. . . ● Flyers who purchase Basic fares from third party suppliers will pay $25 for carry-on baggage and up to $100 at the gate. (Items fitting under the seat in front of you do not count.)
. . . ● Checked first bag fee will increase to $25 for many.
. . . ● Beverages for some (e.g. Basic buyers) will cost $1.99.
See fare options and perquisites here
. . . ● Flyers who purchase Basic fares from third party suppliers will pay $25 for carry-on baggage and up to $100 at the gate. (Items fitting under the seat in front of you do not count.)
. . . ● Checked first bag fee will increase to $25 for many.
. . . ● Beverages for some (e.g. Basic buyers) will cost $1.99.
See fare options and perquisites here
Frontier to charge for carry on luggage
May 3, 2013, 8:17 pm
#61
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: DEN
Programs: United Premier 1K, Marriott Platinum, Frontier, Delta, Hertz Gold, National Emerald Club
Posts: 928
These changes don't give me confidence in their business plan (nickel and diming) and isn't going to increase my chances of flying them. I had hoped to based out of DEN and somewhat unimpressed with UA this year.
Oh well, I guess. Looks like the SW cattle call may be the best alternative now. We'll see.
"They need to strive to be more like Jet Blue than Spirit." is also something I agree with here.
May 3, 2013, 9:51 pm
#62
Join Date: Sep 2000
Location: Denver, Colorado
Programs: DEN: WN or UA, AA LT Gold, VIA Preference Preferred
Posts: 1,550
They have managed to get all the bad publicity while the bad news only applies to some.....in a way it's just making it so that status flyers have it good, and anyone else gets nickel and dimed into the ground, which is like the legacy carriers and the way status flyers want it.
BUT, F9 has fewer status flyers than kettles, and they're not a legacy carrier....hmmmm. All the negatives of the legacy carriers with all the negatives of a LCC.....how will that work?
Is F9 getting on the bandwagon with $200 change fees too?
Another thing that F9 didn't do well with the last round of "improvements" to move more traffic to their website was the murkiness surrounding bookings by corporate booking tools. While it was ultimately decided that those bookings would continue to get 100% miles, they have again failed to address this issue in the latest announcement. Some have no choice to book their business travel through corporate booking tools......what will F9 do this time?
This is definitely a "bet the company" type of move.........
Daze
Last edited by Daze; May 3, 2013 at 9:53 pm Reason: spelling
May 5, 2013, 6:22 pm
#63
Join Date: May 2011
Location: AUS
Programs: DL GM, F9 50K, NK Gold...AS MVP 50K soon?
Posts: 213
Crucify me if you will, but this isn't the end of the world. I still have a few flights worth of WN points to burn through, but after they're gone I certainly won't book away from Frontier "on principle" even with these changes. I book on their website, so my carry-on will continue to be free, and if Frontier's fare is $5 less than Southwest's, I can pay for a soda and still come out ahead. If it's $25 cheaper, I can get a full-on Classic fare, with no change fee and two checked bags, and come out either even or ahead (I prefer F9's aircraft to WN's).
Yes, Frontier is charging for more things, but when your drink offerings become a revenue center instead of a cost center, you can justify putting better product onboard (case in point: WN peanuts...better food doesn't exist on their 737s...vs. F9 sandwiches). And, unlike other airlines (WN excluded), their change fee on their lowest-tier fare is reasonable. Again, it's not like Frontier is adding another row of seats to their aircraft, removing better-than-coach seating up front or jacking up prices sky-high to pay for their labor force.
Yes, Frontier is charging for more things, but when your drink offerings become a revenue center instead of a cost center, you can justify putting better product onboard (case in point: WN peanuts...better food doesn't exist on their 737s...vs. F9 sandwiches). And, unlike other airlines (WN excluded), their change fee on their lowest-tier fare is reasonable. Again, it's not like Frontier is adding another row of seats to their aircraft, removing better-than-coach seating up front or jacking up prices sky-high to pay for their labor force.
May 5, 2013, 8:35 pm
#64
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Denver, CO, USA
Programs: Sometimes known as [ARG:6 UNDEFINED]
Posts: 26,685
Crucify me if you will, but this isn't the end of the world. I still have a few flights worth of WN points to burn through, but after they're gone I certainly won't book away from Frontier "on principle" even with these changes. I book on their website, so my carry-on will continue to be free, and if Frontier's fare is $5 less than Southwest's, I can pay for a soda and still come out ahead. If it's $25 cheaper, I can get a full-on Classic fare, with no change fee and two checked bags, and come out either even or ahead (I prefer F9's aircraft to WN's).
Yes, Frontier is charging for more things, but when your drink offerings become a revenue center instead of a cost center, you can justify putting better product onboard (case in point: WN peanuts...better food doesn't exist on their 737s...vs. F9 sandwiches). And, unlike other airlines (WN excluded), their change fee on their lowest-tier fare is reasonable. Again, it's not like Frontier is adding another row of seats to their aircraft, removing better-than-coach seating up front or jacking up prices sky-high to pay for their labor force.
Yes, Frontier is charging for more things, but when your drink offerings become a revenue center instead of a cost center, you can justify putting better product onboard (case in point: WN peanuts...better food doesn't exist on their 737s...vs. F9 sandwiches). And, unlike other airlines (WN excluded), their change fee on their lowest-tier fare is reasonable. Again, it's not like Frontier is adding another row of seats to their aircraft, removing better-than-coach seating up front or jacking up prices sky-high to pay for their labor force.
May 5, 2013, 10:01 pm
#66
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: new zealand
Posts: 530
So true - and now that the knee-jerk hoo-haa is dying down, some reasonable voices are coming forward, as this in the Denver Post:
http://www.denverpost.com/business/c...dustrys-future
"Frontier's fees are a forecast for the industry's future
Frontier is not the first to add fees, but is pioneering the fight against OTAs. "It is probably not any fun to be a Frontier salesperson this week, but all that will settle at some point. If you are a very savvy traveler, you get the hint," Mann said.
If you're a forward-thinking carrier, you spend plenty of money to revamp your website, you give them perks for booking through them directly and penalize those who use other channels," Mann said.
The point of this is to drive passengers to the website, away from the OTAs. Frontier has already dropped Expedia and I would not fall over in shock if it dropped the others when their various contracts come up for renewal.
http://articles.marketwatch.com/2013...te-fee-waivers
"Airlines want you off Expedia, Orbitz - Carriers lure travelers away from travel sites with new perks
Getting the best deal on the price of a plane ticket increasingly comes down to where you book.
Travelers who do buy tickets through the (Frontier) site are exempt from the forthcoming changes, the airline says: They’ll pay nothing for a carry-on, and receive full miles for flights taken."
It isn't rocket science.
http://www.denverpost.com/business/c...dustrys-future
"Frontier's fees are a forecast for the industry's future
Frontier is not the first to add fees, but is pioneering the fight against OTAs. "It is probably not any fun to be a Frontier salesperson this week, but all that will settle at some point. If you are a very savvy traveler, you get the hint," Mann said.
If you're a forward-thinking carrier, you spend plenty of money to revamp your website, you give them perks for booking through them directly and penalize those who use other channels," Mann said.
The point of this is to drive passengers to the website, away from the OTAs. Frontier has already dropped Expedia and I would not fall over in shock if it dropped the others when their various contracts come up for renewal.
http://articles.marketwatch.com/2013...te-fee-waivers
"Airlines want you off Expedia, Orbitz - Carriers lure travelers away from travel sites with new perks
Getting the best deal on the price of a plane ticket increasingly comes down to where you book.
Travelers who do buy tickets through the (Frontier) site are exempt from the forthcoming changes, the airline says: They’ll pay nothing for a carry-on, and receive full miles for flights taken."
It isn't rocket science.
May 6, 2013, 2:59 pm
#68
Join Date: Apr 2007
Programs: BAEC Silver, WN CP, Marriott Gold
Posts: 424
My prediction is that the "book through the website and your carry-on bag is still free" lasts about long enough for people to get use to booking through their website... then in the next 12 months is becomes "New Enhancement': book a Classic or Classic Plus ticket through our website and your carry-on bag is free! [subtitle: Economy tix pay $25 even when booked on flyfrontier.com]).
They'll still be my airline of choice as SW is more expensive and their boarding process stinks, but if the next announcement is about adding more rows of seats (again, using Spirit as the ULCC model with their industry-worst legroom), I may seriously reconsider trying to keep my status.
They'll still be my airline of choice as SW is more expensive and their boarding process stinks, but if the next announcement is about adding more rows of seats (again, using Spirit as the ULCC model with their industry-worst legroom), I may seriously reconsider trying to keep my status.
May 7, 2013, 3:51 pm
#69
Join Date: Apr 2010
Programs: HGP/SPG: Apprentice Kettle; UA/AA/DL: Journeyman Kettle
Posts: 866
Anyway, a flight of 2-3 hours and I can do without a drink. Longer than that and I guess I could fill an empty bottle with water before getting on the plane. I, for one, will not be paying $1.99 per can of soda [or whatever] on an airplane. Of course, as pointed out one could simple book on the airline's website to avoid this charge. On the other hand, I haven't flown on Frontier so it is all a moot point for me in any case.
May 7, 2013, 8:14 pm
#70
Join Date: Oct 2010
Programs: My opinions are my own and not that of my employer(s)
Posts: 1,411
A key for any business venture's success is getting first time Customers to become repeat Customers... and get word of mouth business in the process.
These days with all the internet booking options most of their first timers will face sticker shock at the airport. Stuck there they pay-up but vow to never fly Frontier again. And of course share their experience all over social media sites.
Perhaps the only way to avoid that is charge higher fares to avoid even being anywhere near the top of online TAs search engines. Short term it would affect loads but might increase yields. Longer term and well I think they used to refer to something like that as the Cadillac syndrome.. You don't get new Customers as fast as you lose them.
These days with all the internet booking options most of their first timers will face sticker shock at the airport. Stuck there they pay-up but vow to never fly Frontier again. And of course share their experience all over social media sites.
Perhaps the only way to avoid that is charge higher fares to avoid even being anywhere near the top of online TAs search engines. Short term it would affect loads but might increase yields. Longer term and well I think they used to refer to something like that as the Cadillac syndrome.. You don't get new Customers as fast as you lose them.
May 7, 2013, 8:47 pm
#71
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: new zealand
Posts: 530
A key for any business venture's success is getting first time Customers to become repeat Customers... and get word of mouth business in the process.
These days with all the internet booking options most of their first timers will face sticker shock at the airport. Stuck there they pay-up but vow to never fly Frontier again. And of course share their experience all over social media sites.
Perhaps the only way to avoid that is charge higher fares to avoid even being anywhere near the top of online TAs search engines. Short term it would affect loads but might increase yields. Longer term and well I think they used to refer to something like that as the Cadillac syndrome.. You don't get new Customers as fast as you lose them.
These days with all the internet booking options most of their first timers will face sticker shock at the airport. Stuck there they pay-up but vow to never fly Frontier again. And of course share their experience all over social media sites.
Perhaps the only way to avoid that is charge higher fares to avoid even being anywhere near the top of online TAs search engines. Short term it would affect loads but might increase yields. Longer term and well I think they used to refer to something like that as the Cadillac syndrome.. You don't get new Customers as fast as you lose them.
May 7, 2013, 9:35 pm
#72
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Have Amex, will travel...
Programs: HHonors Gold
Posts: 91
At first I was irritated by the idea of the carry-on fee, but then I really started thinking about it. One of the things that has bothered me while flying F9 the last couple of years is how many people get away with not paying to check their luggage. I can't tell you how many flights I've been on where the gate agent offered to check baggage for free prior to loading because the flight was expected to be full. I've seen people with bags that were obviously too large to ever fit in ANY overhead - they were obviously gaming the system by checking it at the gate.
That's all going to stop now. If people know in advance they may be charged a ridiculous fee to check at the gate then I bet they'll be much more prone to check their luggage when they check in, even if they have to pay $25 ($20 - $25 is pretty standard with many airlines). The key factor here will be to make sure passengers know about it, so they don't get nasty surprises at the gate!
The drink price changes irk me, though.
That's all going to stop now. If people know in advance they may be charged a ridiculous fee to check at the gate then I bet they'll be much more prone to check their luggage when they check in, even if they have to pay $25 ($20 - $25 is pretty standard with many airlines). The key factor here will be to make sure passengers know about it, so they don't get nasty surprises at the gate!
The drink price changes irk me, though.
May 7, 2013, 9:42 pm
#73
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Have Amex, will travel...
Programs: HHonors Gold
Posts: 91
Generally speaking, with Frontier I tend to find the same itinerary for the same price, but with other airlines, I can't seem to find the same itinerary for even close to the same price, or even the same itinerary at all! I've flown several Delta flights in the last year where the flights and times I found on Orbitz weren't available on delta.com or were, but for several hundred dollars more.
May 7, 2013, 10:02 pm
#74
Join Date: May 2004
Location: HYI/AUS/SAT originally TTN/EWR/PHL
Programs: Southwest Rapid Rewards, Jetblue TrueBlue, American Advantage
Posts: 1,190
If you are checking baggage in most cases purchasing a classic fare will get you 2 checked bags for around the price of 1. Most times its a difference of $25-30 to upgrade, you also get a $0 change fee, select seating (towards the front of the plane) and I believe free basic non-alcoholic drinks when they start that. Even if you don't change your ticket, that will help with getting travel credits if the price goes down.
May 7, 2013, 10:02 pm
#75
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: new zealand
Posts: 530
Sometimes that's just not possible or feasible. I tend to use Orbitz to compare fares and flight times, in general, when I first start to book a trip. It's great for that. I'll then attempt to use the official website of whatever airline I choose, especially since some airlines offer extra points for booking through them directly.
Generally speaking, with Frontier I tend to find the same itinerary for the same price, but with other airlines, I can't seem to find the same itinerary for even close to the same price, or even the same itinerary at all! I've flown several Delta flights in the last year where the flights and times I found on Orbitz weren't available on delta.com or were, but for several hundred dollars more.
Generally speaking, with Frontier I tend to find the same itinerary for the same price, but with other airlines, I can't seem to find the same itinerary for even close to the same price, or even the same itinerary at all! I've flown several Delta flights in the last year where the flights and times I found on Orbitz weren't available on delta.com or were, but for several hundred dollars more.
Frontier has already dropped Expedia, when the contract came up for renewal, and I think it is entirely possible they may drop the others for the same reason.
Southwest manages just fine without using the OTA's.