Frontier - new routes
 

I've checked the various threads and haven't seen this posted anywhere, so here goes. If it is a duplicate, I hope the Mods will delete.

Frontier has two applications in with the DOT for new Mexico scheduled service. Both are "in conjunction" with Apple Vacations, meaning that Apple will purchase capacity on the flights.

The first application is for PHL-CUN, CLE-CUN and RFD-CUN, all to start service early February. The comments period is over (there haven't been any) so it is fair to assume that all three routes will get approval.

The second application is for ORD-SJD, ORD-PVR - and ORD-CUN. The last is likely to be the most contentious. There are only three authorities for the route - United has one, American the second and USA3000 the third. USA3000 is being wound down, and Frontier hopes that the ORD-CUN authority for the route can be transferred directly to it.

I don't think this will happen so easily, if at all. Supposedly, Airtran has filed an objection, saying it wants the authority (as MDW-CUN) so I expect a battle and I don't know which way it will go. There is still time for Spirit to object and apply for the route as well.

I see no problem with the applications for ORD-SJD and ORD-PVR. Frontier is already contracted to fly ORD-HUX and ORD-MBJ for Apple (starting December/January) so this will give the airline a good leg-in at ORD. I guess we can start to think about a possible ORD-DEN, if only for the rotation of aircraft.

There is also a rumor on another forum that Frontier will pick up TYS-MCO, which Airtran is dropping - but it is only a rumor.

Enjoy.

Davy

I like the new direction they are going in conjunction with Apple. Hopefully it will help with Q1 which has been historically some of Frontier's weakest periods.

Regarding ORD-CUN, Airtran initially waived the opportunity to raise an objection until Southwest found out about it, and subsequently sent in an objection on behalf of Airtran. Could be an interesting battle for it, but I think F9 can at least still charter for Apple if they don't get it. Also, it brings up the interesting possibility of if they move from MDW to ORD or fly to both airports.

I'd love to see them pick up TYS-MCO. It would probably be low-yielding but the traffic appears to be there and being a nonstop they should be able to make it profitable. I do like the direction they are going with more P2P routes that they can make work since those routes should have better profit potential than connections.

ORD is the most interesting to me. Assuming - and it is only an assumption - that Frontier picks up most of the USDA3000 flying, then it will have a small but interesting - international - focus city at ORD.

And there are a number of holes to fill. Will Frontier pick up Apple's ORD-LIR, for example, or ORD-PUJ, which are still listed as only USA3000?

There are other holes. I am surprised at the lack of service from ORD to some of the Central American and Caribbean destinations.

I agree. I'd also like to see Frontier pick up CRW-MCO, which Airtran is also dropping, but I suspect Allegiant might get there first.

davy

I wonder if a less than weekly TYS-LAS on an E90 might catch some traffic too?

Hmmmm - maybe. I think it is probably an okay route, but Allegiant has just started it with a fair degree of hoopla - Elvis alive and well at TYS airport.

Can it support two carriers? Not so sure.

davy

Didn't realize Allegiant had already gotten there...

To add to the new routes mix, there is the matter of the SCASD grants for next year, which featured Frontier quite strongly.

South Bend, IN - SBN - Toledo, OH - TOL - and Santa Rosa CA - STS - received grants, with Frontier as the named (but not necessarily committed) airline for flights to DEN - they're all listed here:

http://www.airlineinfo.com/Sites/Dai...t20110119.html

Of these, the money appears to be on SBN, with TOL as a toss of the coin.

My personal favorite is STS, for completely sentimental reasons. I used to live in the Russian River area and thought pretty close to paradise. I'm pretty sure it would do well in summer, I don't how it would be in off-season. The grant and local business support is about $1.5 million, which ain't hay.

However, there has been a question mark about the runway length, which the STS airport people now now addressing, They're also planning an $84 million extension of the airport:

http://www.pressdemocrat.com/article...xpansion&tc=ar

"County planners on Thursday backed a plan to expand Charles M. Schulz-Sonoma County Airport, voting 4-1 for an $84 million project that includes longer runways, more commercial flights and a new passenger terminal."

There are a few other minor contenders which may or may not get service, but there is a half million grant to Cedar Rapids - CID - for service to MKE, on either Southwest/Airtran or Frontier.

I assume any of these could lead to the usual charges of "subsidy chasing" at Frontier, but I fail to see why it is a negative.

Akron/Canton, for example, gets a grant of $350,000 just to make the name Southwest known at CAK:

"To preserve low fares that are so critical for Akron-Canton travelers and businesses, Akron-Canton Airport with the support of Southwest Airlines, is applying for $350,000 that would be used to firmly establish the Southwest brand at the local level over a two year period."

Make of it what you will. :-)

davy

CID has had their bid in the last couple of times but have not been chosen. I would love to see it since I'm from around there (user name). Without the 145's flying I'm not sure we will ever see a flight from there to MKE on Frontier. I know it would do well as a sub-weekly E190 flight since the demand for daily service is probably not there. Alegiant is a decent player there as well but mainly to Vegas. PHX and Florida. To get in on some leisure business traffic, Frontier should give it a shot. Of course I'm biased......

Midwest used to fly to CID and MLI, Knoope wrote about them here post 15:
http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/midwe...codeshare.html

American and United have the biggest market share at CID with 27.6 and 29.3 percent, respectively.
http://business380.com/2011/11/29/no...es-bankruptcy/

I think Shuttle America runs the CID-DEN flights and CID-ORD flights but I'm not 100% certain on that. I'm not sure if CHQ flies the the CID-ORD/DFW flights.

I doubt Airtran is interested since they already announced they are closing MLI and Skywest doesn't fly for them anymore. I doubt Southwest is interested since MLI closing was under them and Southwest's closet station is OMA. I don't think they will want to run a 717 or 737 to MKE or MDW.

Akron/Canton, for example, gets a grant of $350,000 just to make the name Southwest known at CAK:

"To preserve low fares that are so critical for Akron-Canton travelers and businesses, Akron-Canton Airport with the support of Southwest Airlines, is applying for $350,000 that would be used to firmly establish the Southwest brand at the local level over a two year period."[/QUOTE]

Just to keepo the record straight, CAK applied for that grant - but didn't get it. I jumped the gun on that one, sorry.

As to new routes, Frontier has just announced MCI-TPA as winter seasonal, a couple of flights a week.

davy

Actually, G4 has already start a direct flight from LAS-TYS is only for twice weekly service. It operated 757-200 aircraft. I believe those route has done extremely very well.

Yes, they already have a direct flight LAS-TYS.

The DOT has now approved Frontier for scheduled ORD-PVR and ORD-SJD service. Both routes will be flown "in conjunction" with Apple Vacations and Apple will buy capacity on those routes.

Because Southwest has objected to the transfer of the ORD-CUN authority, the DOT has now thrown it open to everyone, and Airtran (Southwest) has filed an application for it.

No word yet on the PHL/CLE/RFD-CUN application.

davy

And while I am at this, there is still the mystery of the 5th SNA slot.

When Orange County Airport allocated slots for 2012, Frontier, which has 4 slots, was awarded a 5th.

There is yet no news on how that slot will be used. I could handle something a little different from another DEN-SNA. :-)

davy

Okay, so Airtran did not object to Frontier's application for ORD-CU - but Southwest did and then (as Airtran) filed a lengthy application for the authority for MDW-CUN (basically saying that Southwest's application craps all over Frontier's).

The DOT sprang into action and granted Frontier ORD-PVR and ORD-SJD - but threw the CHI-CUN authority out into the market.

Frontier has answered Southwest, as here - click on the pdf icon:

http://www.regulations.gov/#!documen...2011-0225-0003

Insisting that ORD is better than MDW for this, that Frontier will provide continuity of service (from USA3000) and also suggesting that Airtran (Southwest?) doesn't understand the market.

I don't know who will get it, but I suspect Southwest will go nuclear (with Frontier) if it doesn't.

Meanwhile, the DOT has still not approved Frontier's earlier application for PHL/CLE/RFD-CUN - a puzzling delay - so Frontier has put "em up for sale "subject to government approval."

Bit it hasn't yet put ORD-PVR and ORD-SJD for sale - although it now has those authorities.

Davy

Thanks for posting the update. Just does not seem to be any love lost between Frontier and WN/FL.

When there are competitive bids for things like this, it sometimes amazes me how snarky the letters are. Although one could view it as entertaining -- which in some regards it is -- I'd like to think that ego and grudges are not primary drivers in decision making.

I should probably have given it context. The Airtran application for the authority is fairly brutal towards Frontier. Click on the pdf icon:

http://www.regulations.gov/#!documen...2011-0214-0004

T'ain't pretty. :-)

davy