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Finnair Plus to go spend-based and Avios [Implemented 9 march 2024]

Old Aug 18, 2023, 4:44 am
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The real Q&A

Please note that this wiki may have outdated and incorrect info. It was created in a time when official and reliable information was scarce. Now there are a lot more info at https://www.finnair.com/fi-en/finnai...r-plus-changes which is where you should be looking.


What is spend actually?
Fare-component
Travel-extras*

*) Finnair.com says all add-ons are considered spend and linked listing includes hotels, cab and rentalcars. This is likely not true, but clarification is needed.


What is not spend?
"Taxes, fees and other airport- and servicefees"
On 2023-09-20 Finnair webpages changed to specify that everything under "Taxes, fees and charges" is considered not spend, expect something called "Extra fee". What this is and when it will be charged is unknown.



Award flights, regardless of how much you spend on add-ons, will give you zero spend and thus zero Avios and zero tierpoints.

Any spend onboard (eg food and drink items) are not considered spend with Finnair and earns zero.


Currency
Will spend be converted to EUR (or will there be earning tables in each currency)?
If you buy your flight tickets and travel extras in other currency than euro (for example, in USD, GBP or SEK), the total amount of your purchase (excluding taxes, other fees except for possible Extra fee, and other airport and service charges) will be first converted to euros and then multiplied with your tiers multiplier.

How will currency conversion be done (official exchange rates, IATA, Finnair internal?)
Needs clarification

When will currency conversion take place (time of purchase, time of point crediting, time of bookkeping)?
Needs clarification


Tiers

Tiers will have earning multipliers for AY spend - what are they?
Avios = spend x tier multiplier but the multiplying factor needs clarification
Basic 6x
Silver 7x
Gold 8x
Platinum 9x
Lumo 10x

Tiers will have multipliers for partner earnings tables - what are they?
They are said to be between 1,10 and 1,25 depending on tier. The exact multipliers are not disclosed, but likely they will continue as of today (silver 1,1, gold 1,15 and Platinum & lumo 1,25)
The wording on ay.com has changed. There is no longer a mention of tier multipliers for partners. Earning tables are still unknown, but wording on site now is
Tier point qualification and collecting loyalty currency on flights that are marketed or operated* by a partner airline, including Finnair codeshare flights, will continue to be based on the travel class, booking class and distance flown, but the distance flown will be changed from kilometres to miles.

Tiers will have new thresholds - what will they be?
Same TP requirement for reaching a tier and for renewing a tier.

Finnair Plus Silver 15 000
Finnair Plus Gold 45 000
Finnair Plus Platinum 80 000
Finnair Plus Platinum Lumo 300 000 (of which 250 000 collected from Finnair)

Lifetime tiers - what are their thresholds, how will previous lifetime tier points be accounted for?
Previuis lifetime total will be converted as 3:2.
New tiers are
Gold 2 000 000
Platinum 3 300 000


Tier points
TP is said to be 1:1 with Avios. Will this be true for avios/tp earned on all partner airlines?
Needs clarification

The change-over

When is the change-over done?
Needs clarification
Finnair has communicated different vague things, "early 2024" and "first half of 2024". They have said dates will be anounced "later in 2023".
Finnair have now said end of January as a change over date (also indicating change-over will take several days of processing). The final announcement is said to be 1 month in advance. At this point, we are looking at committing announcement during Christmas break.
Now the fixed date for the changeover is 9 March 2024

What will happen at change-over?
All existing AP and TP at that point will be reduced as 3:2 (-33%).
Tickets booked before change-over will earn according to old rules but with reduction 3:2 (-33%) - a table has been published with values seemingly rounded to nearest 10 avios.

Segment counter will be set to zero and disappear. Regardless of exact change-over date, this text from finnair.com indicates last evaluation will be held 31 January 2024:
In late January 2024, Finnair Plus program will become spend-based. Starting from 1 February 2024 it is not possible to reach tiers based on the number of flights only. At the same time, we will remove the number of flights from members Finnair Plus profile.Until then, we will count all the scheduled Finnair or other oneworld airlines flights that you have flown. If you have flown enough qualified flights or collected enough tier points by 31 January 2024 to renew your current tier, you will maintain your tier. Or, if you have flown enough qualified flights or collected enough tier points by 31 January 2024 to qualify for a higher tier, you will move up to a higher tier.
What will awards cost?
Needs clarification
Award charts are vaguely said to be reduced by 3:2 on average, but unclear if this Finnair charts or partner charts or a combination. Some charts are not easily reduced 3:2











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Finnair Plus to go spend-based and Avios [Implemented 9 march 2024]

Old Aug 16, 2023, 10:02 am
  #91  
a_k
 
Join Date: Mar 2022
Programs: AY+ Plat
Posts: 536
Why are partner/codeshare flights being calculated as miles and not kms or money spent?
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Old Aug 16, 2023, 10:04 am
  #92  
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: try to stay home
Programs: AY, M&M, BAEC ...and don t care of status anymore
Posts: 2,067
It's amazing what AY has to offer for its 100th anniversary. Are Finns all masochists? Or does that apply to air travellers in general? But we still have four months to celebrate, I would introduce negative points next, then your account gets smaller the longer you fly, and only for the anniversary once -100,000 status points for every Lumo or Platinum. You simply have to make the whole thing much more difficult, otherwise the masochists won't be happy. It has to really hurt without suffering, flying is no fun, especially the passengers in business class have to be tortured. Those in Eco are already doing it voluntarily,
Ed Size is offline  
Old Aug 16, 2023, 10:22 am
  #93  
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Programs: oneworld, * Alliance, Marriott Bonvoy, HHonors, WoH
Posts: 2,157
Originally Posted by juhanh
The only downside is that OWE is a _very_ nice status to have in Australia.
From my pov my 700k+ AY+ points will probably become more useful once converted to Avios and moved to somewhere else for redemptions.
The ens*ittification of AY+ continues.
If AY+ still allows points transfer between accounts after changes, you could look into Coupons Connection and get gifted BAEC Gold(OWE) in leu of AY+ points which could be transferred then to other Avios airline account.
juhanh likes this.
Jaenks is offline  
Old Aug 16, 2023, 10:24 am
  #94  
 
Join Date: May 2014
Location: HEL
Programs: AY+Plat, ALL Plat
Posts: 3,630
Originally Posted by a_k
Why are partner/codeshare flights being calculated as miles and not kms or money spent?
Same as with other airlines with spend-based programs: the loyalty program has no access to fare information, and even if they did, the marketing airline will credit based on distance rather than spend (as per alliance agreements, presumably).
Courmisch is offline  
Old Aug 16, 2023, 10:31 am
  #95  
 
Join Date: Jun 2020
Programs: AY Platinum
Posts: 58
New era begins? For one moment I hoped they were going to change the school like food in the lounge, put a smile on their personnel's face, stop offering veggy only food, have a selection of soft drinks on flights apart from only Coke & Coke Zero, ... the question is why do we still bother? They are a sh*t company. I just got word from my accountant that I have spend +12K last year on this joke. This makes me feel even worst. Like Linus told Nvidea, same message to Finnair. Finnair: F... You!
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WiVM is offline  
Old Aug 16, 2023, 10:44 am
  #96  
 
Join Date: Jun 2015
Programs: AY+, SK EB
Posts: 3,014
Originally Posted by a_k
Why are partner/codeshare flights being calculated as miles and not kms or money spent?
We are going miles and money-based. 1 mile is around 1,5km (yes, 1,6) which aligns with the 3:2 conversion rate change.
Jainzar is offline  
Old Aug 16, 2023, 10:52 am
  #97  
 
Join Date: Jun 2015
Programs: AY+, SK EB
Posts: 3,014
Originally Posted by SuloL


Have to admire the AY "spin and propaganda" department. Plat milestone benefits have been there for ages (although I guess it's good if it now become "official") but that's not really an improvement at all.
The Gold email emphazised also milestones, so they seem not to be limited to Plats in future.
mondostic likes this.
Jainzar is offline  
Old Aug 16, 2023, 11:24 am
  #98  
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: HEL
Programs: AY Platinum, TK Elite, BT VIP, AA, BA, SK, DL, NT, WB + hotels
Posts: 8,899
Originally Posted by Compliment
I wouldn't be surprised that they already cancelled the soft landing that was kind of a hidden benefit. Straight to basic that is!​​​
What do you mean? Do we have any proof that soft landings have been cancelled?
ffay005 is online now  
Old Aug 16, 2023, 11:40 am
  #99  
FlyerTalk Evangelist
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: HEL
Programs: lots of shiny metal cards
Posts: 14,186
There's an article already on HfP, obviously from the UK point of view.

Interesting point:


Originally Posted by HfP
The way it works (as I understand it) is that Finnair will not pay IAG for the Avios it issues to its members as long as they are earned and redeemed within the Finnair ecosystem. If members transfer Avios to British Airways Executive Club to redeem, money changes hands.

For the same reason, it appears that ‘Combine My Avios’ will be restricted to moving to/from British Airways to ensure an income flow into IAG. Letting members move Avios directly from Finnair to Qatar Airways, or vice versa, wouldn’t generate any cash for IAG, although you will be able to do ‘Finnair to British Airways to Qatar Airways’ (or vice versa) if you wish.
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WilcoRoger is offline  
Old Aug 16, 2023, 11:41 am
  #100  
 
Join Date: Jun 2015
Programs: AY+, SK EB
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Originally Posted by ffay005
What do you mean? Do we have any proof that soft landings have been cancelled?
You should know by now that for this topic no proof is needed here.
SPBanker, lkrt, Steve_Hun and 2 others like this.
Jainzar is offline  
Old Aug 16, 2023, 11:43 am
  #101  
 
Join Date: May 2014
Location: HEL
Programs: AY+Plat, ALL Plat
Posts: 3,630
I wonder why Finnair switched to revenue-based status qualification though? Do they want so badly to keep identity between award and tier points? It will be interesting to see if other European carriers follow.
Ed Size likes this.
Courmisch is offline  
Old Aug 16, 2023, 12:20 pm
  #102  
 
Join Date: Jun 2020
Programs: AY Platinum
Posts: 58
Originally Posted by cheesyfeet
How much do you think one needs to spend per year to remain Platinum? Damn this is crap!
This 100 anniversary year has been nothing but a huge disappointment. Is Topi trolling us?
I don't understand who came up with the idea to announce something but not announce it. I think we should be careful with our guessing as the only reason I can think of that they announced it like they did is because they want to see the response from the market. And second to make it less of a surprise. They are putting too much "false positive" non-sense in the message so you can be sure most of us are screwed. They have sent us mailing for way less important stuff in the past without polishing it so hard with additional announcements. Like Ole saying that they would improve customer service and it not being the first of April, remember?

I also read with other airlines that this spending is without the taxes. If this is true this is kinda a big deal. Taxes can be a huge portion of the ticket price depending on where you fly from and to. The class is also important. Now I kind of understand why they did the class change as they did. They wanted to make the normal economy more expensive without improving the product by giving a "cheap" option as a click bait price. But now they really make it clear to FF that this is not the ticket you want to be flying on. All through the price is not light at all with Finnair, I nearly always use those "light" tickets as I travel with only a laptop. And the times I have had the comment from various Finnair staff: yes but you are traveling on a light ticket what do you expect? As I should be ashamed for it. Light means: no service, no expectations, be happy to be allowed on board.

Finnair really knows how to make their loyal customers "happy". At least they are good at something.
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WiVM is offline  
Old Aug 16, 2023, 12:21 pm
  #103  
 
Join Date: Jan 2014
Posts: 2,685
Originally Posted by Courmisch
I wonder why Finnair switched to revenue-based status qualification though? Do they want so badly to keep identity between award and tier points? It will be interesting to see if other European carriers follow.
The more logical question is why didn't other Europeans also go all the way, ie why would you offer benefits based on anything other than customer value
mpkz is offline  
Old Aug 16, 2023, 12:30 pm
  #104  
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Stockholm
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Originally Posted by mpkz
The more logical question is why didn't other Europeans also go all the way, ie why would you offer benefits based on anything other than customer value
Because as of today LH, AFKL and BA all have this hybrid. If status quo was to be changed it would have been now when BA changed their system. They stopped short though and just changed for award points/miles.

Interestingly all three airline groups are awful with earning but easy to gain status at(from 2024 with Lufty)
Fredrik74 is offline  
Old Aug 16, 2023, 12:50 pm
  #105  
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
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Posts: 2,067
Originally Posted by mpkz
The more logical question is why didn't other Europeans also go all the way, ie why would you offer benefits based on anything other than customer value
Because the benefits make a consumer more loyal then points for upgrades or awards if the flights been paid by a thrid party.

It s the person sitting in the lounge, not the company.
Flightson likes this.
Ed Size is offline  

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