ozflier

I read recently that AY had cancelled one of their 2 daily HKG-HEL flights - the only one now AY 100 departing 0045 hrs .
I am flying on it on the 10th march and I see, on Expert Flyer, that the usual appearance of the flight is not there - there are not numerals following the alphabetical lettering.
Are they no longer selling seats on this a/c or are they holding them for transferees from other airlines who have lost their connections ?
Or is the flight just cancelled?
Should I be worried about this ?
AY 1000HKG
10/03/20 0:45HEL
10/03/20 5:25359
Daily
93% / 10mJ C D I F U Y B H K M P T L V S N Q O Z R G W X E A

youthagainsttt

I've just been on the phone to Finnair, 00.45 daily is the only flight still running

My guess is the latter, but it's strange as it's just a few days away

Antx

Use UK point of sales when checking availability in EF.

intuition

I'm on one of the cancelled AY102 in april. The info-page says one can opt to cancel from MMB, but I have no cancellation option there. I do have my original AY102, with the red "change" marker because of the earlier re-timing of that flight, a change I have not approved.
Does others have the cancellation option on MMB?

Also, does anyone have experience of offer to postpone the flight until june 30? I am primarily interested if postponed flights must match original fare rules, like minimum stay.

warakorn

Please be aware that AY is cancelling the flights out of commercial reasons.
If the cancellation is less then 2 weeks out, please check the delay at your ultimate destination. Depending on that you are entitled to EC261/2004 article 7 compensation.
And no -> there is no extraordinary circumstance in place. HKG has no government restrictions regarding flying there from Finland.

Ed Size

Really? I don t know if I should call this approach greed or just a little too eager. AY won t pay, and then a judge has to decide if you can call this extraordinary circumstances - good luck

intuition

The cancellation of AY101/102 was announced march 4, with a general waiver until end of april.
With AY 99/100 flying and current situation already likely has resulted in lower loads I would assume that those in the small-ish T-2 weeks window, who opt to keep the flight (ie do not opt to cancel or postpone) will fit on the "same day" AY99/100.
Meaning few passengers will suffer a moderate delay (albeit above the limits leading to compensation). Even fewer will bother asking for this compensation. Just like Ed said, AY will have no issues with claiming extraordinary circumstances and I am sure no one can be very certain how this scenario will play out in a court.

Karl

I am booked for April 12th HEL-HKG on AY-101 (RT April 28 AY-102) and today I received an email asking me to agree to change to AY-99 which departs at 2355. I have not accepted that yet. Would prefer to try to change it to HEL-BKK as they are showing their schedule HEL-BKK-HKG. I can't seem to find out on their site whether to cancel my trip or have the opportunely to reroute the ticket. I was on their web site trying to find out cancellation fees or rerouting fees. Has anyone successfully been able to get out of HEL-HKG flights to another asian city like BKK with out loosing the entire cost of the ticket?

Often1

The notion that the worldwide contraction of air travel due to COVID is anything but an "extraordinary circumstance" is ludicrous. The suggestion that a cancellation becomes "extraordinary" only when ordered by a government authority is also contrary to precedent.

Don't spend now in the belief that there will be an extra EUR 600 in your bank account anytime soon.

youthagainsttt

If they cancel your flight, you can change it only ONCE, alternatively you can cancel it and get a full refund.

I have called and use live chat (as well as saving the live chat) to confirm this several times. But once you agree to change it once, then you are bound by that unless anything else happens ie. If they cancel the 2nd flight. Then you cannot refund also when you confirm that 1 change. But if you leave it as it is, you still have the option. Hope this makes sense

intuition

A side note is that if your flight first had a schedule change and later was cancelled (applies to a lot of HKG-HEL flights) then you can't see their proposed rebook unless you accept that first schedule change. You can't do the online cancel either.

I take it that advice is to not accept the schedule change online and instead call to CS to have them do the needed action (cancel/refund or rebook)

youthagainsttt

You just need to call them or use Live Chat, preferably both at the same time. Sometimes the Live chat connects very quickly, last time it took 45 mins. My call connected in 10 mins, then I just used the Live Chat just to cross-check what the CS person told me

deissi

In today's Helsingin Sanomat (Finnish newspaper), AY's Head of Communications states that the cancellations announced yesterday (i.e. not specifically the second HKG flight) have been made because it's not profitable for them to operate the flights. While there is admittedly no precedent comparable to the coronavirus, the reason for enacting EC261 was to stop airlines from cancelling half-empty flights that are not profitable for them to fly.

Even the wording of EC261 itself provides that compensation is not due if "the cancellation is caused by extraordinary circumstances which could not have been avoided even if all reasonable measures had been taken." There is certainly an argument to be made that AY, which boasts that its EUR 1 billion cash reserve is more than sufficient to carry it through the epidemic, could have avoided cancelling flights because they were near-empty.

Anyways, there are arguments to be made both ways. I am sure someone will take this into court somewhere in the EU, so we will likely find out the correct interpretation in a few years.

R2

The cancellations announced on Friday were for the period 20-28.3 i.e. at least two weeks in advance hence EC261 stipulated compensations would not apply to these. I expect there to be further similar announcements every week now until demand picks up again.

intuition

I am reading that as to cover things that naturally and reasonably is or should be a part of an airline's planning in order to avoid cancellations and delays. Like having spare crews, do schedule maintenance, keep spare parts and so on. Virus causing demand to dwindle is not likely something that could be avoided.

I am sure there will be arguments made in different courts and with time we'll all know, but the "hey, don't forget to collect your €600" type of post OP made above is a bit optimistic.

I have no insight into the creation of EC261, but I don't think it was enacted in order to stop cancellations of flights on commercial reasons. I'd say it was done to make sure airlines don't take shortcuts in their entire planning - one can easily see some types of airlines having too tight schedules, saving money from operating crews as tightly to the legal limit as possible and so on, where delays/cancellations at some point in inevitable. EC261 stipulates penalties for such operators when they fail, levelling the playfield for airlines that does plan.