Finnair, stop waitlisted upgrades!
#1
Original Poster
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Asia
Programs: AY Gold (OWS), SK Gold (*A Gold), airBaltic VIP, Hilton Gold, PP
Posts: 376
Finnair, stop waitlisted upgrades!
Those of us who have belonged to AY Plus for decades remember how easy it was to use vouchers or points for upgrades. They were virtually always available with the exception of some LH flights.
Nowadays this is a mess. Whenever you wish to upgrade, you are put on a waitlist. This is very inconvenient, as in the case of non-upgrade I would personally opt for other services. Recently I asked for an upgrade HEL-FCO-HEL for a family member. Checkmytrip shows that both flights have a totally empty business with many seats. Yet both requests were waitlisted!
Easy upgrades were my reason to opt for AY. Now these are gone and increasingly often I choose *A. After many years as an AY Plat, I am now a lowly Gold.
Nowadays this is a mess. Whenever you wish to upgrade, you are put on a waitlist. This is very inconvenient, as in the case of non-upgrade I would personally opt for other services. Recently I asked for an upgrade HEL-FCO-HEL for a family member. Checkmytrip shows that both flights have a totally empty business with many seats. Yet both requests were waitlisted!
Easy upgrades were my reason to opt for AY. Now these are gone and increasingly often I choose *A. After many years as an AY Plat, I am now a lowly Gold.
Last edited by Justinus; Jan 27, 2019 at 1:34 pm
#3
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Helsinki
Programs: BA Gold
Posts: 405
Those of us who have belonged to AY Plus for decades remember how easy it was to use vouchers or points for upgrades. They were virtually always available with the exception of some LH flights.
Nowadays this is a mess. Whenever you wish to upgrade, you are put on a waitlist. This is very inconvenient, as in the case of non-upgrade I would personally opt for other services. Recently I asked for an upgrade HEL-FCO-HEL for a family member. Checkmytrip shows that both flights have a totally empty business with many seats. Yet both requests were waitlisted!
Easy upgrades were my reason to opt for AY. Now there are gone and increasinly often I choose *A. After many years as an AY Plat, I am now a lowly Gold.
Nowadays this is a mess. Whenever you wish to upgrade, you are put on a waitlist. This is very inconvenient, as in the case of non-upgrade I would personally opt for other services. Recently I asked for an upgrade HEL-FCO-HEL for a family member. Checkmytrip shows that both flights have a totally empty business with many seats. Yet both requests were waitlisted!
Easy upgrades were my reason to opt for AY. Now there are gone and increasinly often I choose *A. After many years as an AY Plat, I am now a lowly Gold.
#5
Join Date: Jan 2011
Programs: * Alliance Gold, oneworld Emerald, Marriott Bonvoy LT TE, HHonors Diamond, WoH Globalist
Posts: 2,097
Something to learn from TK. When J booking class is available you get immediate confirmation, when not, but business seats are, they can release seats to J class.
#6
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: HEL
Programs: AY Platinum, TK Elite, AA, BA, SK, DL, NT, WB + hotels
Posts: 8,645
I quite like the current system. As a Plat, my requests have sometimes cleared instantly (within 24 hours) and at other times, a bit later, but they've always cleared. Maybe I'll change my mind next week when I fall to Gold for some four months.
The biggest advantage here is that basic members, who cannot waitlist (?), don't hoard the upgrade space. Now that points don't expire, there will be many more basic members saving points for that once-in-a-lifetime J upgrade, and if they just released F inventory without restrictions, it would be a lot more difficult for Plats to get upgrades.
Really? And what is your other option? A paid Y ticket with another airline, and with no possibility to upgrade?
The biggest advantage here is that basic members, who cannot waitlist (?), don't hoard the upgrade space. Now that points don't expire, there will be many more basic members saving points for that once-in-a-lifetime J upgrade, and if they just released F inventory without restrictions, it would be a lot more difficult for Plats to get upgrades.
Really? And what is your other option? A paid Y ticket with another airline, and with no possibility to upgrade?
#7
Join Date: Mar 2015
Location: HEL
Programs: AY+ Plat and several other cards
Posts: 640
I quite like the current system. As a Plat, my requests have sometimes cleared instantly (within 24 hours) and at other times, a bit later, but they've always cleared. Maybe I'll change my mind next week when I fall to Gold for some four months.
The biggest advantage here is that basic members, who cannot waitlist (?), don't hoard the upgrade space. Now that points don't expire, there will be many more basic members saving points for that once-in-a-lifetime J upgrade, and if they just released F inventory without restrictions, it would be a lot more difficult for Plats to get upgrades.
The biggest advantage here is that basic members, who cannot waitlist (?), don't hoard the upgrade space. Now that points don't expire, there will be many more basic members saving points for that once-in-a-lifetime J upgrade, and if they just released F inventory without restrictions, it would be a lot more difficult for Plats to get upgrades.
Solution: priority upgrade availability and that to be shown only for Lumos/Plats/Golds when signed in.
#8
Join Date: May 2014
Location: HEL
Programs: AY+Plat, ALL Plat, Scandic L2
Posts: 3,615
I don't mind the wait-listing as such, though it gets really bad for Silver's and statusless semi-frequent fliers looking for their once in a decade upgrade.
But. Why oh why is the self-wait-listing form no longer available? I don't want to run after a customer service chat agent all the time...
But. Why oh why is the self-wait-listing form no longer available? I don't want to run after a customer service chat agent all the time...
#9
Moderator, Finnair
Join Date: May 2011
Location: MMX (CPH)
Programs: Eurobonus Diamond, QR Platinum, AY+ Platinum, A3*G, Nordic Choice Lifetime Platinum, SJ Prio Black
Posts: 14,120
I share OP's anger over the system.
I don't think the waitlist itself is to blame, it is the changed policy in capacity control.
Before, they released F seats well in advance and if that got depleated, then you could get on waitlist and rev mngmt was nudged and told about new additional demand.
Now, they release almost nothing to F and almost all requests have to go on waitlist.
Some are happy because "all requests clear immediately" and others are unhappy for a very low rate of clearance. But that is not even the main point. Yes, clearance rate have gone down, which is bad.
But worse is, they had a reliable and (somwhat) transparent system of publicly open F availability plus a tiered waitlist where extra seats could be released.
Now only the waitlist is left, with less availability and you need to be savvy with weel of fortune to be able to use your upgrade instruments...
This dents the trust in the loyalty program. Why qualify for a tier this year to get some upgrade vouchers which may or may not clear next year?
I don't think the waitlist itself is to blame, it is the changed policy in capacity control.
Before, they released F seats well in advance and if that got depleated, then you could get on waitlist and rev mngmt was nudged and told about new additional demand.
Now, they release almost nothing to F and almost all requests have to go on waitlist.
Some are happy because "all requests clear immediately" and others are unhappy for a very low rate of clearance. But that is not even the main point. Yes, clearance rate have gone down, which is bad.
But worse is, they had a reliable and (somwhat) transparent system of publicly open F availability plus a tiered waitlist where extra seats could be released.
Now only the waitlist is left, with less availability and you need to be savvy with weel of fortune to be able to use your upgrade instruments...
This dents the trust in the loyalty program. Why qualify for a tier this year to get some upgrade vouchers which may or may not clear next year?
#10
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Helsinki
Programs: AY Platinum, IHG Gold, Diners
Posts: 1,274
Theres a long time to the flight in question, but if competition comes with a campaign, and Finnair doesnt release the award space, then my money goes to the competition. Most likely this is *A, and then I just might start building up status there instead. With my travel patterns, I have actively chosen AY, but I could just as easily fly *A. Upgrades are the greatest benefit of AY. If they become more stingy, I will look for alternatives.
#11
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: KUO
Programs: HH Diam, AY/AX/KQ/IHG/VISA Plat, SK/Bonvoy/Melia/Strawberry Gold, Radisson Prem, PP Prest, BT Exec
Posts: 2,248
So far using the vouchers and getting upgrades for my frequently flown HEL-LHR-flights has been no pain. No help of the web upgrade tool but after contacting AY Plus by email or chat, the upgrades have been processed within a day.
In the near future I begin frequenting AMS. The planes have only 1 to 2 rows of J (with several rows of pre-paid seat and meal) and no immediate upg-reserve. Email to AY Plus: March passed. April pending. May passed.
For the long haul sectors, this Feb PVR upgrade was impossible ("thank you" Aurinkomatkat and fanny packers! I have seen You to and from HAV ). I ended up buying J-tickets. For the upcoming Oct-Nov trip MIA, 4 LH upgrades were available right away (initially I was trying to find availability to Far-East in Oct by contacting the AY Plus and the only availability was one return from HKG for 2 pax). After all... more happy leisure time in Miami that time than in the Far-East...
Something needs to be done - AY Plus, please take a note!
In the near future I begin frequenting AMS. The planes have only 1 to 2 rows of J (with several rows of pre-paid seat and meal) and no immediate upg-reserve. Email to AY Plus: March passed. April pending. May passed.
For the long haul sectors, this Feb PVR upgrade was impossible ("thank you" Aurinkomatkat and fanny packers! I have seen You to and from HAV ). I ended up buying J-tickets. For the upcoming Oct-Nov trip MIA, 4 LH upgrades were available right away (initially I was trying to find availability to Far-East in Oct by contacting the AY Plus and the only availability was one return from HKG for 2 pax). After all... more happy leisure time in Miami that time than in the Far-East...
Something needs to be done - AY Plus, please take a note!
Last edited by TTL; Jan 27, 2019 at 11:35 am
#12
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: HEL
Programs: lots of shiny metal cards
Posts: 14,070
This really can drive business away. Scenario - going to SGN. With AY I could go via BKK and direct flight back for 1,2-1,3k€ in Y, with online upgrade availability showing X, ie none either for inbound or outbound. Probably they would clear for a Lumo, but still there's risk. OTOH I could buy from TK directly J for 1,4k€ - which I ended up doing. And thus ⅔ on the way to renewing *G until 2023 (TK Miles&Smiles proved to be a good *A programme for me, even though LH/OS discount biz in "P" earn zilch, which is a bummer)
#14
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: KUO
Programs: HH Diam, AY/AX/KQ/IHG/VISA Plat, SK/Bonvoy/Melia/Strawberry Gold, Radisson Prem, PP Prest, BT Exec
Posts: 2,248
#15
Join Date: May 2013
Location: HEL
Programs: AY Plat (OWE), SK EBG (*A Gold), KQ Plat (STE+), Accor Plat, Hilton Honors Gold
Posts: 3,153