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The Big UPGRADE Thread – all you need to know about AY upgrades

Old May 16, 2017, 1:37 pm
FlyerTalk Forums Expert How-Tos and Guides
Last edit by: lkrt
General
Upgrade space is capacity controlled, separately from revenue space in J cabin. The number of seats released to the different upgrade types are driven by a number of factors, but never by the "there are unsold seats in J cabin, let's fill them" policy some other airlines employ. Same applies with upgrades to Premium Economy.

Upgrades now book into fare bucket U, which is also used for business class awards. Note that availability tools such as Expertflyer etc. may or may not show correct U availability as AY tends to offer additional U availability to Plats and Lumos, and this hidden availability is not shown by non-AY affiliated availability tools. Premium Economy upgrade availability is in bucket F, with the above disclaimers applying similarly.

You can upgrade and review the available upgrade options at https://www.finnair.com/en/manage/upgrade.

The searches below very often show zero availability. Very few directly confirmable seats are released in particularly longhaul J. Instead upgrades must go on waitlist, from where a robot processes upgrades from an unknown set of parameters. A waitlisted upgrade can clear in minutes or never, and there is no way to know. Waitlisted upgrades are checked at T-59, 21, 10, 5 days, and at T-37 hours.

Final check most often actually takes place at approximately ~T-38 hours and you will be (most often) notified by email. In case you are denied an upgrade at this point and there is still revenue availability in J, you can contact CS which may be able to upgrade you on the spot or contact "another department" for confirmation. Furthermore, you may contact check-in desk at least in HEL, which may be able to process your upgrade.

You can check for the upgrades upon booking on the Finnair website. Each flight has a separate tab for "Upgrades", showing upgrade availability for PE and J if any exists, otherwise you will be waitlisted. Additionally, you may check your upgrade options for an already-booked flight here. EF gives you an idea of upgrade availability in the U bucket.


Upgrade-types
1. Upgrades with points
2. Upgrades with vouchers
3. Cash upgrades
5. Cash upgrades at airport
6. Complimentary upgrades

Upgrades with AY+ points

Requirements:
  • flight marketed and operated by AY (operated by Norra is also eligible as well as op by Iberia or Widerře for Finnair as wetlease)
  • ticketed booking in paid economy (there must be a ticket number in your reservation)
  • all paid economy booking classes are eligible
  • award flights and points+money combos are ineligible (booking class X)
  • you cannot upgrade any codeshare flights
  • It is not required to have a Finnair-issued ticket (although this has now been required according to some experiences)
Cost:
  • Northern Europe (ARN, BGO, CPH, GOT, KEF, KRK, OSL, WAW, WRO) 10,000 points one way
  • Rest of Europe, TLV 15,000 points one way
  • long haul (including DXB, DOH) 60,000 points one way
    • Previously, shorthaul connections were upgraded at the same cost but this has been discontinued as of 15JUN23. If you wish to upgrade a shorthaul feeder flight, a separate points charge will apply.
  • there have been some occasional promotions especially for short haul upgrades (winter and summer campaigns)
Process:
  • When booking, you can check for direct upgrade availability on "Upgrades" tab or by looking on Expertflyer for U bucket
  • once you have a ticketed booking, you can process your upgrade or waitlist yourself for upgrade online here
  • you may also call AY to process your upgrade at a 1000-point surcharge (does not apply to PE->J upgrades not available online)
  • If there is no availability, you can waitlist. A waitlisted upgrade may clear within hours of your request or up to 37 hours before STD. If it doesn't clear, after T-37 you may call AY, use the chat or go to the check-in desk at the airport and enquire about an upgrade.
    • your status is one of the factors affecting your priority on the waitlist
    • If there is no SH availability you can still upgrade the LH and waitlist the shorthaul. You'll pay the same points price even if SH does not clear though.
    • NOTE: If you wish to reserve your seat in original class, select the desired seats before waitlisting. After waitlisting it is not possible to select seats via Manage My Booking, however one can do that via Chat or Call Center.
  • if you waitlist, your points will be taken from your account immediately; if the upgrade does not clear, your points will be returned to you but you will lose any points that have expired during the waiting time
  • your points need to be valid at time of processing the request but they do not need to be valid on the day of the flight
  • When confirmed, you will receive a new e-ticket showing booking class U (or F for Premium Economy) but you will receive points/miles according to your original booking class (this may require a retroclaim if earning on other programmes than AY+)
  • Once you have a new ticket, your upgrade is confirmed. However, if J is overbooked on your flight, you will be among the first pax that AY will bump back into Y. J rarely gets overbooked, though.
  • as an unpublished perk, you may choose to change your upgrade from a points one to a voucher one by calling AY; your points will be returned to you save for any points that may have expired
  • If you change your mind about the upgrade you may conctact CS and ask to cancel the upgrade and have points returned. There likely must be seats left in Y cabin (or potentially, original booking class) to allow this, and your points expiry date must not have passed.

Perks:
  • Most of the J perks like priority check-in, priority security where available, lounge access, priority boarding. However the luggage allowance is one additional piece at 23kg (on top of your existing economy allowance).
  • you will receive points/miles according to your original economy class booking class (this may require a retroclaim if earning on other programmes than AY+)

Upgrades with vouchers
Vouchers are given to Finnair+ members upon advancing to and retaining the platinum and gold tiers. You can see number of vouchers, their type and expiry in your Finnair+ account.

Requirements:
  • flight marketed and operated by AY (operated by Norra is also eligible as well as op by Iberia or Widerře for Finnair as wetlease)
  • ticketed booking in economy (there must be a ticket number in your reservation)
  • all paid economy booking classes are eligible
  • award flights booked via AY+ are also eligible (booking class X)
  • most likely, points+money combos are eligible, too, since they book into X, but we have no verification of this
  • award flights booked via parners (eg. Avios, AAdvantage etc) are not eligible
  • you cannot upgrade any codeshare flights
  • It is not required to have a Finnair-issued ticket (although this has now been required according to some experiences)

Cost:
  • Northern Europe one "European" voucher for a one-way flight
  • Rest of Europe, TLV one "European" voucher for a one-way flight
  • longhaul (including DXB, DOH) one "Longhaul" voucher for a one-way flight
  • LH voucher does not include upgrade for connecting shorthaul (like it does with points upgrades), SH flight requires a separate voucher/points upgrade
  • you may exchange four European vouchers for one "Longhaul" voucher or vice versa by calling AY

Process:
  • When booking, you can check for direct upgrade availability on "Upgrades" tab or by looking on Expertflyer for U bucket
  • once you have a ticketed booking, you can process your upgrade or waitlist yourself for upgrade online here
  • you may also call AY to process your upgrade at a 1000-point surcharge (does not apply to PE->J upgrades not available online)
  • If there is no availability, you can waitlist. A waitlisted upgrade may clear within hours of your request or up to 37 hours before STD. If it doesn't clear, after T-37 you may call AY, use the chat or go to the check-in desk at the airport and enquire about an upgrade.
    • your status is one of the factors affecting your priority on the waitlist
    • If there is no SH availability you can still upgrade the LH and waitlist the shorthaul. You'll pay the same points price even if SH does not clear though.
    • NOTE: If you wish to reserve your seat in original class, select the desired seats before waitlisting. After waitlisting it is not possible to select seats via Manage My Booking, however one can do that via Chat or Call Center.
  • if you waitlist, your voucher will be taken from your account immediately; if the upgrade does not clear, your voucher will be returned to you but you will lose any vouchers that have expired during the waiting time
  • you will receive a new e-ticket showing booking class U but you will receive points/miles according to your original booking class (this may require a retroclaim if earning on other programmes than AY+)
  • Once you have a new ticket, your upgrade is confirmed. However, if J is overbooked on your flight, you will be among the first pax that AY will bump back into Y. J rarely gets overbooked, though.
  • If you change your mind about the upgrade you can contact CS and ask to cancel the upgrade and have voucher returned. There likely must be seats left in Y cabin (or original booking class) to allow this, and your voucher expiry date must not have passed.

Perks:
  • all usual J perks like priority check-in, one additional piece of baggage (23kg), priority security where available, lounge access, priority boarding
  • you will receive points/miles according to your original economy class booking class (this may require a retroclaim if earning on other programmes than AY+)

Cash upgrades, offered on website / app
On the app as well as on the upgrade tool you can review if an upgrade is offered at a cash price. The prices vary, and reports can be seen here. The cash prices become available at 60 days prior to departure and may fluctuate in the timeframe prior to departure.

Requirements:
  • flight marketed and operated by AY (or operated by Norra or Iberia or Widerře for Finnair (wetlease))
  • ticketed booking in paid economy (there must be a ticket number in your reservation)
  • all paid economy booking classes are eligible
  • you cannot upgrade any codeshare flights
  • you do not need to be a AY+ member

Cost:
Process:
  • Check the app or the upgrade tool for cash prices (earliest 60 days prior to departure)
  • you will receive a new e-ticket showing booking class U but you will receive points/miles according to your original booking class (this may require a retroclaim if earning on other programmes than AY+)
  • Once you have a new ticket, your upgrade is confirmed. However, if J is overbooked on your flight, you will be among the first pax that AY will bump back into Y. J rarely gets overbooked, though.

Perks:
  • Most of the J perks like priority check-in, priority security where available, lounge access, priority boarding. However the luggage allowance is one additional piece at 23kg (on top of your existing economy allowance).
  • you will receive points/miles according to your original economy class booking class (this may require a retroclaim if earning on other programmes than AY+)

Upgrades paid in cash at the airport

(Note that according to recent reports, check-in agents are in some cases only able to process last-minute points and voucher upgrades.)

Requirements:
  • upgrades may be available for purchase at check-in
  • flight operated by AY or Norra
  • ticketed booking in economy
  • all paid economy booking classes are eligible
  • most likely AY+ & partner award flights in economy are eligible, too, though this is unconfirmed
  • the marketing carrier does not matter, so this is the only upgrade where codeshares are eligible

Cost:
  • varies, expect to pay some hundreds of euros for long haul one way

Process:
  • the upgrade will be processed and paid for at the check-in desk of the airport of departure
  • most likely the above means the airport of departure of that particular flight, so to upgrade HEL-BKK on a CPH-HEL-BKK itinerary, you would need to contact (transfer) check-in at HEL
  • you will receive points/miles according to your original booking class (this may require a retroclaim if earning on other programmes than AY+)
  • Once you have a new ticket, your upgrade is confirmed. The odds of being bumped back into Y are close to 0 as AY will not offer these upgrades if J is overbooked

Perks:
  • Only in-flight perks apply
  • Lounge access, priority security, additional checked in baggage is not extended to airport upgraders
  • you will receive points/miles according to your original economy class booking class (this may require a retroclaim if earning on other programmes than AY+)

Complimentary operational upgrades
  • usually just a new boarding pass & seat either at the gate, at check-in or even after you have boarded
  • few and far between
  • the decision whom to upgrade on a particular flight seems a bit random but is at least partially dependent on the price of your ticket, booking class and status
    • AY highest tier members (Lumos, Plats, Golds) are prioritised with the travelling party size affecting upgrade priority (i.e. if only one seat is available in J, the party will not be split)
  • you will receive points/miles according to your original economy class booking class (this may require a retroclaim if earning on other programmes than AY+)
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The Big UPGRADE Thread – all you need to know about AY upgrades

Old Oct 11, 2022, 8:57 am
  #2476  
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Originally Posted by Teppo
I recently flew HEL-LHR and my upgrade didn't clear. J and PE was full and according to the FA several Plat and Lumo were on board. But J was mainly filled with Crew, as AY is operating flights for BA from LHR. The FA said that part of their new contracts is to fly J to the outstations.
Regarding the PE space, the FA said it is a black box for them and not bookable as we know on SH on the widebody planes. The information was that this is supposed to change beginning of next year, when all widebody planes should be equipped with it.
Wow, new low then. Why does crew need to position in J? I am quite shocked at this behaviour.
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Old Oct 11, 2022, 8:58 am
  #2477  
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Interesting if we'll see AY sell PE to LHR. And what do they do when there is a last-minute equipment change to narrowbody?

Ask for a PE seat at LHR check-in, and it should work.
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Old Oct 11, 2022, 9:06 am
  #2478  
 
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Originally Posted by Teppo
Regarding the PE space, the FA said it is a black box for them and not bookable as we know on SH on the widebody planes. The information was that this is supposed to change beginning of next year, when all widebody planes should be equipped with it.
Isn‘t the PE space bookable? Or what is the premium seat?


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Old Oct 11, 2022, 9:40 am
  #2479  
 
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Originally Posted by Jainzar
Isn‘t the PE space bookable? Or what is the premium seat?
I am also seeing the PE seats bookable for the ~55€ price for future LHR-HEL flight. Does anybody know if they become selectable for free at check-in? I'd like to try the PE seat on a short flight once before buying long haul tickets. And I know 55€ is not a bad price but 0€ would be even better.

I also had the "privilege" of flying with AY crew on LHR-HEL a month ago. They were about 6 people sitting in the last two rows of J, cabin crew returning home. This was the 7.30am morning service so most of the paying customers wanted to sleep or rest but this AY crew were having loud conversations the whole flight. I was sitting right in front of them and was close to start complaining but was too Finnish at the end. Maybe I felt sorry for them as they had to fly home in the A319, not in the A350 with proper J seats. And they also knew that as they were complaining about the poor seats to each other.
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Old Oct 11, 2022, 9:42 am
  #2480  
 
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Originally Posted by florens
Wow, new low then. Why does crew need to position in J? I am quite shocked at this behaviour.
I believe it is an industry practice and also possibly specified in their collective agreement that deadhead flights are always in J (”to be able to rest”).
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lkrt is online now  
Old Oct 11, 2022, 9:51 am
  #2481  
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Originally Posted by lkrt
I believe it is an industry practice and also possibly specified in their collective agreement that deadhead flights are always in J (”to be able to rest”).
Definitely not industry-wide. I've seen more often crews deadhead in Y than in J, especially on European shorthaul.
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Old Oct 11, 2022, 11:32 am
  #2482  
 
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Originally Posted by florens
Definitely not industry-wide. I've seen more often crews deadhead in Y than in J, especially on European shorthaul.
Other than AY, I only have experience with AF when crew is deadheading. The FA, who was flying to HEL for a flight the next morning, was travelling next to me in J on the CDG - HEL route.
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Old Oct 11, 2022, 11:42 am
  #2483  
 
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Originally Posted by lkrt
I believe it is an industry practice and also possibly specified in their collective agreement that deadhead flights are always in J (”to be able to rest”).
I recently flew ORD-HEL and there been at least 11 AY employees in J, the all had laminates and boarded first so you know they are AY related, cabin was filled by 80% service was so/so since the crew chat with their colleagues a lot. But I had flights worse on AY.
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Old Oct 11, 2022, 11:43 am
  #2484  
 
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LHR weatleases are over so no more loud FA's on LHR route. Only FRA wetlease now.
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Old Oct 12, 2022, 12:58 am
  #2485  
 
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Originally Posted by haapalainen
I am also seeing the PE seats bookable for the ~55€ price for future LHR-HEL flight. Does anybody know if they become selectable for free at check-in? I'd like to try the PE seat on a short flight once before buying long haul tickets. And I know 55€ is not a bad price but 0€ would be even better.
To answer my own question, there was still a charge of Ł48 for PE seat during online check-in for OWE passenger. On the app there was no option to select the PE seats but on the browser one could select and pay for the PE seat. I don't know if the seat would have been free is asking at the airport.
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Old Oct 12, 2022, 1:44 am
  #2486  
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One observation about the "Details and upgrades" panel in the App.






Sure, that seems logical.

But the thing is, the "Details and upgrades" is attached to the flight selection panel, ie should be independent of what ticket type you have selected. But it isn't.
Why would they choose this implementation? I mean, U availability as we understand it exists reagrdless of what fare you chose. So technically, displaying upgrade availability is not dependent on fare and thus should display regardless.

One possible explanation is that they decided to not only display availability but also price in one go. The price (in vouchers and points) differs based on path (Y->J, Y->PE and PE->J) so then there is a depence.
This would be even more logical if you were able to book and request in one go. Ie, choose econ ticket of your liking and before proceeding to payment request upgrade too. But that's not what the page does. It currently just holds the same info as the old search does; "Does U exist or not?"


A more sinister explanation would be that they are planning to offer upgrade availability and pricing based on the ticket types. Eg from Econ light there are no seats, but from econ basic there are one seat at 60k points. From Econ semi-flex there are 2 seats at 50k points each. et.c.
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Old Oct 13, 2022, 7:35 am
  #2487  
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HEL-BKK cleared at t-12 days for myself and my wife (AY+ Gold). Surprising to see J7 availability too now as it was at J2 at some point last week. Availability changed every day and also stayed the same after our upgrades confirmed.
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Old Oct 13, 2022, 8:16 am
  #2488  
 
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Has anyone got good news at T-37h?
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Old Oct 13, 2022, 8:31 am
  #2489  
 
Join Date: Jan 2014
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Originally Posted by haapalainen
I am also seeing the PE seats bookable for the ~55€ price for future LHR-HEL flight. Does anybody know if they become selectable for free at check-in? I'd like to try the PE seat on a short flight once before buying long haul tickets. And I know 55€ is not a bad price but 0€ would be even better.

I also had the "privilege" of flying with AY crew on LHR-HEL a month ago. They were about 6 people sitting in the last two rows of J, cabin crew returning home. This was the 7.30am morning service so most of the paying customers wanted to sleep or rest but this AY crew were having loud conversations the whole flight. I was sitting right in front of them and was close to start complaining but was too Finnish at the end. Maybe I felt sorry for them as they had to fly home in the A319, not in the A350 with proper J seats. And they also knew that as they were complaining about the poor seats to each other.
PE seats were not available for free even at the Plat/Lumo check-in desk in Helsinki when I tried (a few months ago now)
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Old Oct 13, 2022, 9:58 am
  #2490  
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Originally Posted by florens
Availability changed every day .....
I've observed this on multiple routes. Their farebot is hyper. It adds and removes seats and buckets all the time, making price swing between overpriced and ludicrous.
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