Delay problems of AY69 / AY99 HEL-HKG
#16
Ambassador: Finnair
Join Date: May 2003
Location: HEL
Programs: AY Lumo, BA Silver, HHonors Gold
Posts: 4,258
If this is "protocol" then they've really upped the ante. Proactively offering re-route on other airlines is a far cry from the old SOP where all handling was left to a tired employee at transfer desk, unwilling to do anything at 11pm when pax arrived HEL on their connections.
#17
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: HEL
Programs: lots of shiny metal cards
Posts: 14,083
If this is "protocol" then they've really upped the ante. Proactively offering re-route on other airlines is a far cry from the old SOP where all handling was left to a tired employee at transfer desk, unwilling to do anything at 11pm when pax arrived HEL on their connections.
#18
Ambassador: Finnair
Join Date: May 2003
Location: HEL
Programs: AY Lumo, BA Silver, HHonors Gold
Posts: 4,258
Just to add a comment to intuition's point. I have no experience with major delays with HEL connections yet but some years ago I was booked on 6 from JFK and the flight was cancelled that day, 5 also. I was on paid J ticket that time, plat too. AY called me, actually woke me up at my hotel in NY and offered to reroute on AA/AY via BRU, J all the way..I happily accepted so they have done these in the past, too. Re-routes exHEL, however, are often more difficult for many reasons, as we all know..
#19
Moderator, Finnair
Join Date: May 2011
Location: MMX (CPH)
Programs: Eurobonus Diamond, QR Platinum, AY+ Platinum, A3*G, Nordic Choice Lifetime Platinum, SJ Prio Black
Posts: 14,132
Well, my view is based on 2 major incidents in the past - one on sixty-niner and one on 74. Not going to drag on about it, I'm just happy if they generally are proactive and service-minded towards FF regardless of ticket type and origin these days.
#20
Join Date: May 2014
Location: HEL
Programs: AY+Plat, ALL Plat, Scandic L2
Posts: 3,619
Last year, CS called me in the previous evening to solicit invol reroute because of oversell from down-gauging: AY/I,AA/Y HEL-CDG-MIA instead of 2xAA/O HEL-LHR-MIA. So yes, it happens.
#21
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Seat 1L these days :)
Programs: AF Platinum/AY LUMO/SK EBG/baEC S/HYATT Globalist/MR LTP/A3 *G/HH Dia/IHG plat
Posts: 7,895
Off to ARN this mornibg abd a farmilian flights number showing delayed again Till 0800... Just after someone at Work yesterday asked me If There was a single route that came to mind as a frequent delay 😁😁😁
#23
Moderator, Finnair
Join Date: May 2011
Location: MMX (CPH)
Programs: Eurobonus Diamond, QR Platinum, AY+ Platinum, A3*G, Nordic Choice Lifetime Platinum, SJ Prio Black
Posts: 14,132
"How late can sixty-niner be?" is the Finnair version of "How long is a string?"
I have no doubt that double-nine will fill the shoes and perform admirably in the bottom 5% of all commercial flights for years to come! ^
I have no doubt that double-nine will fill the shoes and perform admirably in the bottom 5% of all commercial flights for years to come! ^
#24
Moderator, Finnair
Join Date: May 2011
Location: MMX (CPH)
Programs: Eurobonus Diamond, QR Platinum, AY+ Platinum, A3*G, Nordic Choice Lifetime Platinum, SJ Prio Black
Posts: 14,132
And here are the stats for double-nine when it flew the second slot on HKG, same time period (15.th Aug - 15.th Oct.). It isn't the destination or the flight-number that causes the delay... Watch these stats crash in the next 6 months!
#26
Moderator, Finnair
Join Date: May 2011
Location: MMX (CPH)
Programs: Eurobonus Diamond, QR Platinum, AY+ Platinum, A3*G, Nordic Choice Lifetime Platinum, SJ Prio Black
Posts: 14,132
I think there is actual improvement. Those flightstats grades are usually even lower, like 0,1-0,5 stars out of 5.
The 8h delays several times a month quickly pushes the average delay to the bottom 2% of the industry. But if there is one less such delay every month, then the score also quickly improves.
But there are also many shorter delays, usually having an ontime quota of say 50% or lower. That part seems to have improved drastically to 75%, while Finnair on total has fallen to an ontime of 84,8% (Still ranked #3 in major european airlines, for example SK 85,6%, D8 70,4%, LH70,2% , BA74,0%)
The combined performance (avg delay and ontime stats) still points to this flight being industry worst, and since it is controlled by policy rather than circumstances, nothing will change.
--
Ontime meaning 14 minutes or less delayed at gate arrival
The 8h delays several times a month quickly pushes the average delay to the bottom 2% of the industry. But if there is one less such delay every month, then the score also quickly improves.
But there are also many shorter delays, usually having an ontime quota of say 50% or lower. That part seems to have improved drastically to 75%, while Finnair on total has fallen to an ontime of 84,8% (Still ranked #3 in major european airlines, for example SK 85,6%, D8 70,4%, LH70,2% , BA74,0%)
The combined performance (avg delay and ontime stats) still points to this flight being industry worst, and since it is controlled by policy rather than circumstances, nothing will change.
--
Ontime meaning 14 minutes or less delayed at gate arrival
Last edited by intuition; Oct 30, 2017 at 2:40 am
#27
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: EWR
Programs: CX Green | UA Silver | Marriott Lifetime Platinum | Hyatt Globalist | Hilton Gold | AA EXP
Posts: 813
AY99 - unreliable by design??
I didn't realize it is a such perennial problem (as AY69) until I found this thread but I flew AY99 4x this year (including one this past Thursday 21/6) and every single flight arrived in HKG around 3 to 4 hours late (which unfortunately is not considered 'late' under EC261, if i understand it correctly)! Then again I guess I should be grateful(?) because I look it up just now and today AY99 will depart 9 hours later than scheduled ....
Does anyone know why AY99 has such a bad on-time performance? I understand A359 may not be reliable but I presume AY rotates its A359 and I don't think other AY A359 routes suffer as extensively as AY99? And this gets me thinking ... is it possible that AY99 is unreliable by design? Meaning that once an A359 lands/on its way back to HEL and AY realizes the plane might have an issue/require a longer maintenance, then oh, lets assign that A359 to AY99 just in case ...
(and yes, as you can see, I'm a cynical person )
Does anyone know why AY99 has such a bad on-time performance? I understand A359 may not be reliable but I presume AY rotates its A359 and I don't think other AY A359 routes suffer as extensively as AY99? And this gets me thinking ... is it possible that AY99 is unreliable by design? Meaning that once an A359 lands/on its way back to HEL and AY realizes the plane might have an issue/require a longer maintenance, then oh, lets assign that A359 to AY99 just in case ...
(and yes, as you can see, I'm a cynical person )
Last edited by Rivarix; Jun 24, 2018 at 3:13 pm
#28
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: HEL
Programs: AY Plat Lumo, SK Gold
Posts: 948
This morning OH-LWK went tech in BKK. It managed to fly to HEL 6 hours late, but looks like it's not in shape to continue flying, so AY is (again) one A359 short - and they apply the usual remedy, postpone AY99 to the morning.
#29
Moderator, Finnair
Join Date: May 2011
Location: MMX (CPH)
Programs: Eurobonus Diamond, QR Platinum, AY+ Platinum, A3*G, Nordic Choice Lifetime Platinum, SJ Prio Black
Posts: 14,132
It is by design, due to above said rotations. AY clearly finds it practical and without major downsides. Pax delay is of no concern.
And it is not because of A359, this has been going on for ages.
And it is not because of A359, this has been going on for ages.