Are bloggers getting paid to fly?
Feb 1, 2013, 3:30 pm
#151
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: PHX
Posts: 4,787
It's not really a question of entitlement. If you're saying you're justified in doing it, that's another matter. I'm just not seeing any evidence of it. Failing to complain about the livery is a pretty slim reed to support a claim of objectivity to me. So, I agree you're entitled to express your opinion. I also am prepared to hear you out and even be convinced. I'm just not convinced. Not close, actually. I also think it's way too serious of an allegation to be leveled casually, but noted pretty clearly I understand I may be oversensitive.
If it were to be discovered that lucky was obtaining actual benefits from the airlines he was reviewing without disclosing them it would be potentially ruinous to his career -- the blogging and the business he has built around it. It's a serious allegation against this blogger, whatever the standards in the industry generally. I, for one, enjoy his blog but would have a hard time seeing past it if it were revealed.
Again, you don't have me convinced. Not close, really. There is an awful lot going on with AA right now. He's talking about things he's reported on his own blog. And to fault him for not saying, "lots of people hate the new livery"? Well, I'm done on that subject. I think it's a slim reed to claim bias.
You must have me confused with another poster. I didn't say this.
It's a blog -- a writing for public dissemination and absorption. If you are suggesting that this is a challenge to journalistic integrity, I guess I agree. Except there is nothing close to the standard of journalistic integrity in play on this or any blogs.
And blogging isn't really what they "do for a living". Blogging itself does not pay money.
And blogging isn't really what they "do for a living". Blogging itself does not pay money.
If you were a blogger purporting to objectively cover the travel industry, you would admit that lots of people think the livery is ugly/stupid/a waste of money instead of saying: "With its new livery, new premium 777 planes, Choice Fares and the Business ExtrAA enrollment bonus, American Airlines has been on a roll lately with big news."
That's an advertisement. Not an objective commentary.
That's an advertisement. Not an objective commentary.
You must have me confused with another poster. I didn't say this.
Feb 1, 2013, 3:40 pm
#152
Join Date: Jun 2012
Programs: SPG Platinum, UA GS
Posts: 121
TPG had the most gushing positive things to say in a PR-release style about AA.
But don't tar lucky with that, best I can tell he covered the existence of the new livery and asked readers what they thought but didn't offer an opinion.
Gary covered it, said he liked the old livery better, questioned the timing of the change, suggested AA might not even be serious about it given the 5 year planned rollout.
So, a diversity of coverage and opinions including by people flying AA. But nothing to suggest that any of them is taking anything from AA for the coverage. There's a lot in this thread that borders on libel.
But don't tar lucky with that, best I can tell he covered the existence of the new livery and asked readers what they thought but didn't offer an opinion.
Gary covered it, said he liked the old livery better, questioned the timing of the change, suggested AA might not even be serious about it given the 5 year planned rollout.
So, a diversity of coverage and opinions including by people flying AA. But nothing to suggest that any of them is taking anything from AA for the coverage. There's a lot in this thread that borders on libel.
Feb 1, 2013, 3:44 pm
#153
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Washington, DC
Programs: DL PM; IHG PlatAmb; Hilton Dia; Marriott Plat; Hyatt Discoverist
Posts: 7,320
I obviously didn't provide every example. This is a Flyertalk forum, which I did not start. If I were bringing them up on charges, I would give you plenty of examples, heavily cited. But unlike some people, I don't "do this for a living" and have neither the time nor inclination.
I guess I also don't see the suggestion that two bloggers go easy on American Airlines to be "serious charges", or the suggestion that they're cozy with the banks that they promote to be anything other than a statement of obvious fact.
We will just have to agree to disagree.
As for libel, I hope you are not a lawyer.
I guess I also don't see the suggestion that two bloggers go easy on American Airlines to be "serious charges", or the suggestion that they're cozy with the banks that they promote to be anything other than a statement of obvious fact.
We will just have to agree to disagree.
As for libel, I hope you are not a lawyer.
Feb 1, 2013, 3:50 pm
#154
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: PHX
Posts: 4,787
As a matter of fact I am. Are you sure you're responding to me? You keep saying words I didn't say. Where did I say anyone had committed libel?
Ok. Gotcha.
Ok. Gotcha.
Feb 1, 2013, 3:51 pm
#155
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Washington, DC
Programs: DL PM; IHG PlatAmb; Hilton Dia; Marriott Plat; Hyatt Discoverist
Posts: 7,320
I never said I was only responding to you. There are other posts here, including one 2 above this one that mentions libel. Sorry if that wasn't clear.
Feb 2, 2013, 1:21 pm
#156
Used to be 'Scooter'
Join Date: Mar 1999
Location: SAN
Programs: Free Agent
Posts: 398
As a flyertalk member since 2000, (elite member since 1999 on various programs) I can attest that the scene has gone downhill, fast, ever since these blogs started to emerge circa 2002.
I personally dislike most of the bloggers for this reason.
I blame the bloggers for the devaluation / harder and harder to find inventory on what little seats there are left. And no, I don't mean SkyPesos. I mean all the programs. There was a time when LX F/SQ etc was easier to attain. Now? Fat chance. Its because they all make it easier to obtain and their so called "award consulting services" certainly doesn't help. In fact, it ruins it for everyone else..
I do though have a few blogs/forums I like, because I get actual real value from them. However,most these bloggers show only first class / business class pÖrn pics and provide little to no value, other than a credit card referral link at the bottom/side and google nonsense links. Talk about a turn off......
Are there any FT purists left? It seems as though everyone and their mother has a mileage blog these days.
I personally dislike most of the bloggers for this reason.
I blame the bloggers for the devaluation / harder and harder to find inventory on what little seats there are left. And no, I don't mean SkyPesos. I mean all the programs. There was a time when LX F/SQ etc was easier to attain. Now? Fat chance. Its because they all make it easier to obtain and their so called "award consulting services" certainly doesn't help. In fact, it ruins it for everyone else..
I do though have a few blogs/forums I like, because I get actual real value from them. However,most these bloggers show only first class / business class pÖrn pics and provide little to no value, other than a credit card referral link at the bottom/side and google nonsense links. Talk about a turn off......
Are there any FT purists left? It seems as though everyone and their mother has a mileage blog these days.
I like Ben's blog. His is the only one I read on a daily basis, as I feel that he's truly doing this for the love of airlines and travel. I never get the sense that he's overly pushy with the CC links and other deals. I don't care how he does it - I find it very entertaining and highly inspiring.
As others have said, I wouldn't care if he's getting "paid" by the airlines or hotels. That's extremely unlikley anyway, so I don't even think about it.
Ben's living the dream, and I tip my hat to him.
Feb 3, 2013, 1:43 pm
#157
Join Date: Jul 2011
Programs: DL, UA, BA, AA
Posts: 28
I like how bloggers take heat for revealing TOO MUCH about how to work the system (especially when it comes to manufactured spending), but in this thread Lucky got heat for revealing TOO LITTLE about how he gets all his miles and points...
So, as plenty of people have said, they get referral bonuses, they get money for the ads they run, and they have booking services. I think that's plenty for Lucky to be able to do what he does. Maybe he also has his own resources, who knows.
But if he also leverages AP, WFPP, makes daily runs to OD with his Ink and then off to beans etc etc, would you really want him to be super vocal about it????
So, as plenty of people have said, they get referral bonuses, they get money for the ads they run, and they have booking services. I think that's plenty for Lucky to be able to do what he does. Maybe he also has his own resources, who knows.
But if he also leverages AP, WFPP, makes daily runs to OD with his Ink and then off to beans etc etc, would you really want him to be super vocal about it????
Feb 3, 2013, 2:02 pm
#158
Original Poster
Join Date: Feb 2009
Posts: 3,737
I like how bloggers take heat for revealing TOO MUCH about how to work the system (especially when it comes to manufactured spending), but in this thread Lucky got heat for revealing TOO LITTLE about how he gets all his miles and points...
So, as plenty of people have said, they get referral bonuses, they get money for the ads they run, and they have booking services. I think that's plenty for Lucky to be able to do what he does. Maybe he also has his own resources, who knows.
But if he also leverages AP, WFPP, makes daily runs to OD with his Ink and then off to beans etc etc, would you really want him to be super vocal about it????
So, as plenty of people have said, they get referral bonuses, they get money for the ads they run, and they have booking services. I think that's plenty for Lucky to be able to do what he does. Maybe he also has his own resources, who knows.
But if he also leverages AP, WFPP, makes daily runs to OD with his Ink and then off to beans etc etc, would you really want him to be super vocal about it????
Feb 3, 2013, 10:01 pm
#159
Join Date: Nov 2011
Posts: 6,385
Well I think the title is incorrectly worded because I'm pretty sure we're coming to a consensus on that bloggers aren't getting paid but rather some here are concerned about why the numbers don't really match up.
Feb 6, 2013, 10:36 pm
#160
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Canadia
Programs: A loyal Amerisuites customer... oh wait
Posts: 2,033
I have no expectation that any blog is impartial. I expect a blog to have some kind of bias or tilt.
Anyone who writes a blog does so for some reason. If I can't discern that the author is writing either in the capacity of a journalist with an established publication, or if I don't sense that the person is writing because they're genuinely passionate about the topic, then, yeah, I expect they might be getting some kind of reward for trying to convince me to take a certain option.
I think it's just healthy to be skeptical of anything on the Internet.
Anyone who writes a blog does so for some reason. If I can't discern that the author is writing either in the capacity of a journalist with an established publication, or if I don't sense that the person is writing because they're genuinely passionate about the topic, then, yeah, I expect they might be getting some kind of reward for trying to convince me to take a certain option.
I think it's just healthy to be skeptical of anything on the Internet.
Feb 6, 2013, 11:04 pm
#161
Original Poster
Join Date: Feb 2009
Posts: 3,737
I have no expectation that any blog is impartial. I expect a blog to have some kind of bias or tilt.
Anyone who writes a blog does so for some reason. If I can't discern that the author is writing either in the capacity of a journalist with an established publication, or if I don't sense that the person is writing because they're genuinely passionate about the topic, then, yeah, I expect they might be getting some kind of reward for trying to convince me to take a certain option.
I think it's just healthy to be skeptical of anything on the Internet.
Anyone who writes a blog does so for some reason. If I can't discern that the author is writing either in the capacity of a journalist with an established publication, or if I don't sense that the person is writing because they're genuinely passionate about the topic, then, yeah, I expect they might be getting some kind of reward for trying to convince me to take a certain option.
I think it's just healthy to be skeptical of anything on the Internet.
This would be an example of a product review.
This was added at the end of the review.
Full disclosure: Eric Rosen flew Air New Zealand Business Premier as a guest of the airline, but all opinions expressed are entirely his own.
A brief mention of being a guest of the airline was provided at the start of the blog entry. Read the review and form your own opinion if you believe compensation/gift/being a guest (whatever you want to call it) had any influence on the type of review that was given. Off topic, I'm not sure one can book an award ticket LAX-AKL with Air New Zealand w/ partner miles?
Also, if a blogger takes compensation from time to time.. could this not have an influence on future reviews? A blogger could write a horrible review of a product, but even more reason for an airline to invite them to events to get a second chance to win them over.
Feb 6, 2013, 11:10 pm
#162
Join Date: Nov 2011
Posts: 6,385
http://thepointsguy.com/2011/11/flig...emier-lax-akl/
This would be an example of a product review.
This was added at the end of the review.
Full disclosure: Eric Rosen flew Air New Zealand Business Premier as a guest of the airline, but all opinions expressed are entirely his own.
A brief mention of being a guest of the airline was provided at the start of the blog entry. Read the review and form your own opinion if you believe compensation/gift/being a guest (whatever you want to call it) had any influence on the type of review that was given. Off topic, I'm not sure one can book an award ticket LAX-AKL with Air New Zealand w/ partner miles?
Also, if a blogger takes compensation from time to time.. could this not have an influence on future reviews? A blogger could write a horrible review of a product, but even more reason for an airline to invite them to events to get a second chance to win them over.
This would be an example of a product review.
This was added at the end of the review.
Full disclosure: Eric Rosen flew Air New Zealand Business Premier as a guest of the airline, but all opinions expressed are entirely his own.
A brief mention of being a guest of the airline was provided at the start of the blog entry. Read the review and form your own opinion if you believe compensation/gift/being a guest (whatever you want to call it) had any influence on the type of review that was given. Off topic, I'm not sure one can book an award ticket LAX-AKL with Air New Zealand w/ partner miles?
Also, if a blogger takes compensation from time to time.. could this not have an influence on future reviews? A blogger could write a horrible review of a product, but even more reason for an airline to invite them to events to get a second chance to win them over.
Off topic, you can if there is award space, which right now there isn't.
I mean compensation other than cash, could be points... but as far as I'm concerned, any blogger is biased. Doesn't matter what they say and take everything they say with a grain of salt.
Feb 7, 2013, 12:56 am
#163
Moderator: Lufthansa Miles & More, India based airlines, India, External Miles & Points Resources
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: MUC
Programs: LH SEN
Posts: 48,162
I recall Crankyflier getting some love from BA but disclosing it right in the first few sentences:
http://crankyflier.com/2012/08/07/mi...y-trip-report/
http://crankyflier.com/2012/08/07/mi...y-trip-report/
Apr 21, 2013, 1:00 am
#165
A FlyerTalk Posting Legend
Join Date: Apr 2001
Location: PSM
Posts: 69,232
Wirelessly posted (Mozilla/5.0 (BlackBerry; U; BlackBerry 9930; en-US) AppleWebKit/534.11+ (KHTML, like Gecko) Version/7.1.0.755 Mobile Safari/534.11+)
A whole bunch of writers were recently offered freebie flights on AA's new 77W, either to GRU or LHR. Most declined the comped fare but took advantage of the increased access (e.g. boarding early to take photos) which came with the junket. Of the miles & points blogger group I elieve that only Lucky accepted the comp'd flights. He made sure to remind his readers that accepting the free flight didn't skew his review.
A whole bunch of writers were recently offered freebie flights on AA's new 77W, either to GRU or LHR. Most declined the comped fare but took advantage of the increased access (e.g. boarding early to take photos) which came with the junket. Of the miles & points blogger group I elieve that only Lucky accepted the comp'd flights. He made sure to remind his readers that accepting the free flight didn't skew his review.