Fares are through the roof

Old Mar 18, 22, 11:00 pm
  #31  
 
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Originally Posted by eternaltransit View Post
I don't think it's as easy as "business travel pick up" - it's been a convenient segment for revenue management for the last couple of decades sure, but I think it's now just a question of whether there's enough disposable income to support fares with the expected capacity ramp up.

Businesses aren't the only source of high yield pax - lots of people have done quite well over the last couple of years, especially those with assets and who have saved money from not travelling. Combine that with capacity cuts (quite a few 77Ws were converted to cargo in the pax cabin) and it may be the real question is: how much are the financing costs hurting EK, rather than will an old passenger mix return. If DXB starts to be a more O&D market beyond the usual UK source, then that's going to flatter the revenue per km quite significantly.

As much as these high fares are extremely inconvenient for us as passengers, every single forum on FT has a stage in the cycle where it's all "I'm leaving for x because y". I personally wouldn't bet against EK's revenue management as much as I don't like them doing their jobs well!
The voice of reason.
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Old Mar 18, 22, 11:59 pm
  #32  
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Originally Posted by BadoRas View Post
I will drop EK like a hot spud if fares don't return to normal soon. Status or no status, I will move. It's outrageous. I will swap to Singapore Airlines in a heartbeat if they are not stupid enough to try the same thing. They are a great airline with a great F offering. Perfectly acceptable.

Emirates is not the only airline out there. But they seem to be the main culprit for upsetting and losing previously loyal customers. Bad move EK. I'm sure you will regret this. An airline's success or failure rests on the price sensitivity of all passengers. Get that wrong at your peril.
QR much the same. I tried to get an NBO-EDI-NBO flight booked recently. Cheapest the website came up with was @£3500 and both to and from EDI was in Y! For the whole itinerary to be in J, the fare was in excess of £4500. In comparison, booked with them NBO-LHR (and QSuites all the way) for a little over £2000. LHR-GLA bought with a BA travel voucher and got some change from that too.

Cheapest on EK just over £3000.
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Old Mar 19, 22, 9:59 am
  #33  
 
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Originally Posted by Metanoia View Post
I wonder if they're lurking and watching this forum, fares already down to $5200 for what I was looking at (LAX-DEL), but that's in H (J Special). Still almost double TK's fare.

The return leg of the MRU-MAN flight has suddenly gone down as they are now back to offering saver rather than just flex on that leg.

Now £7920.54 from £8767 for 2 pax.
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Old Mar 19, 22, 2:03 pm
  #34  
 
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Originally Posted by IntrepidAfrican2 View Post
The voice of reason.
Agreed.
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Old Mar 20, 22, 2:24 am
  #35  
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Originally Posted by BadoRas View Post

Emirates is not the only airline out there. But they seem to be the main culprit for upsetting and losing previously loyal customers. Bad move EK. I'm sure you will regret this. An airline's success or failure rests on the price sensitivity of all passengers. Get that wrong at your peril.
My friend, have you missed the BA issues of late? I think they win by a mile on upsetting loyal customers.
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Old Mar 22, 22, 3:14 pm
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Originally Posted by m0hamed View Post
My friend, have you missed the BA issues of late? I think they win by a mile on upsetting loyal customers.
Sorry, I've had no experience of BA. I've never flown with them. However, I do get the feeling that most people are unhappy with them from what I read.
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Old Mar 23, 22, 5:57 am
  #37  
 
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Too late!

Originally Posted by Metanoia View Post
I wonder if they're lurking and watching this forum, fares already down to $5200 for what I was looking at (LAX-DEL), but that's in H (J Special). Still almost double TK's fare.
I booked with Singapore Airlines. And if my miles expire I might not come back to EK.
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Old Mar 24, 22, 2:22 pm
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A little late, I noticed a article on BBC recently which stated EK was along with BA and others applying a surcharge for fuel costs. It seems a excuse to raise profitability given EK would more then likely have a contract as oppose to pay spot rates and even so, it would buy oil from Dubai aka its owner
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Old Mar 24, 22, 5:51 pm
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Empty wallet

Flying to PER next month and is the most money I have ever spent in Y class as J class was 3,000Ä more than pre-COVID and now after booking and stating that in April their 02:45am departure will be resumed they have changed my two hour transit in DXB to an 8 hour one meaning I am stranded upon arrival as the train stations are closed until the following morning! They offered a full refund which will take up to 21 business days so I could book with Qatar but I leave in 12 days! Crap customer service and no support whatsoever! So looking forward to hugging my Dad after two years apart and now I am stressed.
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Old Mar 24, 22, 8:45 pm
  #40  
 
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Originally Posted by suley View Post
A little late, I noticed a article on BBC recently which stated EK was along with BA and others applying a surcharge for fuel costs. It seems a excuse to raise profitability given EK would more then likely have a contract as oppose to pay spot rates and even so, it would buy oil from Dubai aka its owner
Hmmm. Dubai doesn’t have oil, so they have to buy it somewhere. Local Jet A1 refining capacity wasn’t huge the last time I checked, but the lack of oil means that whatever is sold by ENOC to Emirates has to be at commercial rates because they fund growth with debt, not money coming out from the ground. Emirates mostly buys Jet A1 from western companies like BP and Chevron. Abu Dhabi only does Dubai favours when there’s a crisis. It’s a complex relationship.

Additionally, EK is mostly a long haul airline, so even if there was a subsidy (I spent years studying EK’s books as my client, and saw no evidence of this, in sharp contrast with QR and EY) tankering would be pointless / impossible as many destinations are out of range, and significant proportion of fuel has to be purchased at outstations. Suggesting that EK can be completely immune to global prices is false, even if we accept that they somehow have access to cheaper fuel.

Last edited by IntrepidAfrican2; Mar 25, 22 at 1:40 am
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Old Mar 25, 22, 1:19 am
  #41  
 
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Originally Posted by IntrepidAfrican2 View Post
Hmmm. Dubai doesnít have oil, so they have to buy it somewhere. Local Jet A1 refining capacity wasnít huge the last time I checked, but the lack of oil means that whatever is sold by ENOC to Emirates has to be at commercial rates because they fund growth with debt, not money coming out from the ground. Emirates mostly buys Jet A1 from western companies like BP and Chevron. Abu Dhabi only does Dubai favours when thereís a crisis. Itís a complex relationship.

Additionally, EK is mostly long haul airline, so even if there was a subsidy (I spent years studying EKís books as my client, and saw no evidence of this, in sharp contrast with QR and EY) tankering would be pointless / impossible and at least half the fuel has to be purchased at outstations.
So for EK what destinations are cost efficient for tankering and which arnt? Or are you saying it is pointless and impossible for all destinations?
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Old Mar 25, 22, 1:40 am
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Edited post to make it clearer.
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Old Mar 25, 22, 7:14 am
  #43  
 
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In addition, Sir Tim and HH are very averse to hedging fuel costs - they got burnt in 2009 - so they stopped for a decade or so, reluctantly dipped toes in the water again in 2018-19 and promptly took a large loss in 2020.

So EK is usually an airline that goes with the flow when it comes to fuel pricing - helped before by the owner accepting a tolerable profit margin rather than maximising it!
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Old Mar 25, 22, 1:35 pm
  #44  
 
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Originally Posted by eternaltransit View Post
In addition, Sir Tim and HH are very averse to hedging fuel costs - they got burnt in 2009 - so they stopped for a decade or so, reluctantly dipped toes in the water again in 2018-19 and promptly took a large loss in 2020.

So EK is usually an airline that goes with the flow when it comes to fuel pricing - helped before by the owner accepting a tolerable profit margin rather than maximising it!
Yes, forgot about the hedging fiascos.
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Old Mar 26, 22, 3:03 pm
  #45  
 
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Prices are going absolutely crazy. Yes many people didn't travel druing the pandemic and from the ones that did various opted to pay more for their journey by flying in J or F due to more personal space etc. But even then fares were not cheap, now by going up again by 50% or more I cannot see them selling those seats that easily especially with always more capacity added. Hence i hope that within the next months we will see prices to get back to levels they were some months ago or even pre COVID.
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