Platinum Experience 2013
Apr 1, 2014, 2:29 am
#166
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: LONDON
Programs: CX DM, BA G4L, QR PLT, EK PLT, Hyatt CourtesyC, HH DM, SQ PPS, BonvoyTit, UK, VS, UA, DL, AA
Posts: 1,715
The treatment of plats is a reflection of the overall inconsistent service on EK varying from exquisite to average to downright rude
Apr 1, 2014, 5:42 am
#167
Join Date: Jan 2008
Posts: 7
Does inconsistency start with the Seniors?
Had a lousy DXB to LHR last month in J which reinforces the inconsistency which EK is getting a reputation for, Plat or not it makes no difference, but Plats are just accustomed to seeing the good and the bad more often. The return a few days later was not much better, with inconsistency ruling, some crew can't do enough, others just can't wait till we are all disembarked.
By the way, if a 380 flight is busy, the only way to get a drink in the first hour of the flight is to get it yourself, i wonder if EK will get the message if 70 odd PAX make a dash for the bar at the back when the seat belt sign goes off, if EK does not, maybe the Captain will, with 5000 kgs of SLF moving to the rear of the aircraft upsetting his trim.
The inconsistency continues today with my Plat renewal email signed with his "Best Regards", by no other than the "Executive Vice President and Chief Commercial Officer" a certain "Mr.Thierry Antinori". If I may quote from "his" email, ".....I am extremely pleased to congratulate and welcome you into our new and exclusive Emirates Skywards Platinum tier.".
Further down the email "My team and I look forward to bringing you an even better experience when travelling with Emirates and hope to welcome you on board soon for your Platinum debut."
Maybe, just maybe, that is why in the whole of the last 12 months of Plat I have not had one single upgrade, although on one flight Golds were upgraded ahead of me.
Maybe, just maybe, there wasn't really a Platinum tier last year, and all will change this year when my "Platinum debut" commences.
I love the bit about they "hope to welcome you on board", yep sometimes a welcome as a Plat and sometimes not but we can live in EK "hope".
Has anyone else had the same email or does inconsistency dictate that we will all have different?
For me, nothing has changed on what I said on this thread a couple of months ago, (yep don't tell me, a twinkling of consistency is creeping in!).
As for the latest advert, it is very good indeed^^
By the way, if a 380 flight is busy, the only way to get a drink in the first hour of the flight is to get it yourself, i wonder if EK will get the message if 70 odd PAX make a dash for the bar at the back when the seat belt sign goes off, if EK does not, maybe the Captain will, with 5000 kgs of SLF moving to the rear of the aircraft upsetting his trim.
The inconsistency continues today with my Plat renewal email signed with his "Best Regards", by no other than the "Executive Vice President and Chief Commercial Officer" a certain "Mr.Thierry Antinori". If I may quote from "his" email, ".....I am extremely pleased to congratulate and welcome you into our new and exclusive Emirates Skywards Platinum tier.".
Further down the email "My team and I look forward to bringing you an even better experience when travelling with Emirates and hope to welcome you on board soon for your Platinum debut."
Maybe, just maybe, that is why in the whole of the last 12 months of Plat I have not had one single upgrade, although on one flight Golds were upgraded ahead of me.
Maybe, just maybe, there wasn't really a Platinum tier last year, and all will change this year when my "Platinum debut" commences.
I love the bit about they "hope to welcome you on board", yep sometimes a welcome as a Plat and sometimes not but we can live in EK "hope".
Has anyone else had the same email or does inconsistency dictate that we will all have different?
For me, nothing has changed on what I said on this thread a couple of months ago, (yep don't tell me, a twinkling of consistency is creeping in!).
As for the latest advert, it is very good indeed^^
Last edited by Two Fox; Apr 1, 2014 at 6:05 am Reason: incomplete
Apr 1, 2014, 9:54 am
#171
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: UK, US, UAE
Programs: BAEC Gold, EK Plat(Soon to be gold), HHonors Silver, Amex Gold
Posts: 185
Inconsistency
Mr Two Fox,
Inconsistency indeed does start with the seniors - in fact it starts with senior management. The only consistency is each year deciding how much of a bonus they should give to themselves and also how they well they've done each year in eeking more out of their staff whilst increasing revenue.
A380 crews are generally more inconsistent than main fleet for the most part they are newer than main fleet, however it is also down to the fact EK is shorter than ever of a full crew compliment but they are unable to accommodate any new crew because they have nowhere to house them. Over 1k crew are in hotels because they have no housing.
They need crew so we all know what happens when demand is higher with regards to standards of recruitment and this doesn't even take into account the over 120 nationalities working as crew leading to huge and dramatic culture differences.
I don't defend rude crew but perhaps take a look at how happy the crew are as opposed to the god given right some people seem to think they have because of status and how they're treated (I'm not implying you do or do not merely trying to state a point)
It would be physically impossible for 76 pax to move the distance required that you say to upset trim. Whilst I understand the theorem you are trying to explain in fact the trim system on the A380 could handle a 6t shift reasonably well. Aircraft now have extensive trim ranges and these are accomplished no longer by movement of the elevators alone but by horizontal stabiliser movement. This gives the greatest ability to deal with massive CG changes that occur around the CoP and FP down to the fuel alone.
If you are in any doubt I'll try and find the exert from an A380 FCOM.
Please do not constitute this passage as derogatory, demeaning or arrogance once again I'm only explaining my PoV and knowledge on the subject.
I shall not publicly publish my opinion of Mr T.A whom was a former LH employee and now at EK. I can assure you the general masses of whom know of him and his role do NOT like him and you will struggle to get a nice opinion of him.
Ultimately here is the thing - most crew join (there are a few bad apples like in every profession) to see the world, do some flying and make some money. Do most people not want something similar?
The problem comes from the top within however and unfortunately with treatment of staff being flushed faster than those onboard aircraft lav's whilst expecting more and more to the extreme whilst treating all crew at the lowest denominator (i.e like kindergarten) then they feel like they are being unfairly treated. Yes some will argue they have an easy life but I would like you to volunteer to do their job for a month and I am sure your opinion would change.
I've no doubt you are not demanding as a HVC (High Valued Customer) however there are some who even think because they are Plat they are entitled to ask the crew anything - when I say anything its even been said that because they're plat they should do sexual acts from a DYKWIA.
So when the company is failing people for senior position courses because even when the customer is wrong in the mock up situations - the potential seniors are sticking up for the crew they are being failed because of this same reason - That explains a lot about an organisation and I'm sure speaks for itself.
Please understand like most people who are hard working you will have bad days and stressful days, unlike some you meet new teams every time you come to work and inevitably you will get on with some and others you won't leading to inconsistency naturally. You don't have the chance to get to know each other and with over 18k cabin crew alone its unlikely you'll fly with them again for even the length of your service so why bother making friends? Well making friends means being a team and having respect for each other which then leads to consistency and good customer service. Leaders lead but not always by example and when they're under pressure to be complete jackas*es then the team feels the heat and the service will suffer.
So to answer your question...inconsistency starts at the top...
Inconsistency indeed does start with the seniors - in fact it starts with senior management. The only consistency is each year deciding how much of a bonus they should give to themselves and also how they well they've done each year in eeking more out of their staff whilst increasing revenue.
A380 crews are generally more inconsistent than main fleet for the most part they are newer than main fleet, however it is also down to the fact EK is shorter than ever of a full crew compliment but they are unable to accommodate any new crew because they have nowhere to house them. Over 1k crew are in hotels because they have no housing.
They need crew so we all know what happens when demand is higher with regards to standards of recruitment and this doesn't even take into account the over 120 nationalities working as crew leading to huge and dramatic culture differences.
I don't defend rude crew but perhaps take a look at how happy the crew are as opposed to the god given right some people seem to think they have because of status and how they're treated (I'm not implying you do or do not merely trying to state a point)
It would be physically impossible for 76 pax to move the distance required that you say to upset trim. Whilst I understand the theorem you are trying to explain in fact the trim system on the A380 could handle a 6t shift reasonably well. Aircraft now have extensive trim ranges and these are accomplished no longer by movement of the elevators alone but by horizontal stabiliser movement. This gives the greatest ability to deal with massive CG changes that occur around the CoP and FP down to the fuel alone.
If you are in any doubt I'll try and find the exert from an A380 FCOM.
Please do not constitute this passage as derogatory, demeaning or arrogance once again I'm only explaining my PoV and knowledge on the subject.
I shall not publicly publish my opinion of Mr T.A whom was a former LH employee and now at EK. I can assure you the general masses of whom know of him and his role do NOT like him and you will struggle to get a nice opinion of him.
Ultimately here is the thing - most crew join (there are a few bad apples like in every profession) to see the world, do some flying and make some money. Do most people not want something similar?
The problem comes from the top within however and unfortunately with treatment of staff being flushed faster than those onboard aircraft lav's whilst expecting more and more to the extreme whilst treating all crew at the lowest denominator (i.e like kindergarten) then they feel like they are being unfairly treated. Yes some will argue they have an easy life but I would like you to volunteer to do their job for a month and I am sure your opinion would change.
I've no doubt you are not demanding as a HVC (High Valued Customer) however there are some who even think because they are Plat they are entitled to ask the crew anything - when I say anything its even been said that because they're plat they should do sexual acts from a DYKWIA.
So when the company is failing people for senior position courses because even when the customer is wrong in the mock up situations - the potential seniors are sticking up for the crew they are being failed because of this same reason - That explains a lot about an organisation and I'm sure speaks for itself.
Please understand like most people who are hard working you will have bad days and stressful days, unlike some you meet new teams every time you come to work and inevitably you will get on with some and others you won't leading to inconsistency naturally. You don't have the chance to get to know each other and with over 18k cabin crew alone its unlikely you'll fly with them again for even the length of your service so why bother making friends? Well making friends means being a team and having respect for each other which then leads to consistency and good customer service. Leaders lead but not always by example and when they're under pressure to be complete jackas*es then the team feels the heat and the service will suffer.
So to answer your question...inconsistency starts at the top...
Last edited by DXBFlyer; Apr 2, 2014 at 3:20 am
Apr 2, 2014, 12:28 am
#172
Join Date: Jan 2008
Posts: 7
DXBFlyer, I totally agree with you, and this was the point of my comments in this thread in January. I think the vast majority of the frequent travellers are also of the same opinion. No, I certainly would not want to put up with some of the conditions they endure on a regular basis, couple that with the removal of Profit Share, and the negative alterations to Staff Travel, one of their few perks, they as a group have my admiration for their continued loyalty. I was unaware of the accommodation shortage, how long can anyone keep returning to DXB after a long trip and not be able to consider themselves "going home" for a day or so and, in the proverbial sense, putting their feet up?. I was talking with a Purser recently who joined EK for a career, how many new recruits do that nowadays?, and of those that do, how many become disillusioned?
As for the trim, I am aware of that too, i was a little tongue in cheek to provide the shortcut solution to everyone getting served asap, whatever happened to the taking of the orders before take-off, maybe time constraints, or an increase in the amount of pre flight checking, have swallowed this up.
Well that was the first year of Platinum for me, certainly in parts no better than before, however the lounge benefit in DXB is certainly a big plus, those lovely restaurant staff who always seem to be so proud to be serving, so meticulously, some delightful food, surely Emirates Catering at its best.
Roll on year two.
As for the trim, I am aware of that too, i was a little tongue in cheek to provide the shortcut solution to everyone getting served asap, whatever happened to the taking of the orders before take-off, maybe time constraints, or an increase in the amount of pre flight checking, have swallowed this up.
Well that was the first year of Platinum for me, certainly in parts no better than before, however the lounge benefit in DXB is certainly a big plus, those lovely restaurant staff who always seem to be so proud to be serving, so meticulously, some delightful food, surely Emirates Catering at its best.
Roll on year two.
Apr 2, 2014, 1:42 am
#173
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: UK, US, UAE
Programs: BAEC Gold, EK Plat(Soon to be gold), HHonors Silver, Amex Gold
Posts: 185
Mr Two Fox,
I have to be honest, sadly a lot of frequent travelers do not share your sentiment. It seems to be a culture thing as well with the vast majority of those who understand coming from "The West" or the MEDC's whilst less understanding coming from LEDC's. I shall not be more specific so as not to offend but complaint form on boarding may or may not enlighten people.
PS removal was terrible whilst not a huge surprise to be honest.
An email asking all crew to "go the extra mile" was sent out with the firm announcement of runway works, however I'm certain that the company management should be looking at themselves to go the extra mile because most staff don't have the stamina for the extra especially among the inter company practices. Its not quite as bad as QR but its now not far off, and its only getting worse.
I have pictures of the new pilots housing, it looks like a worker camp in my opinion, in fact the new worker camps in AUH are better looking than the new pilot villas which are supposed to house them and their families.
More and more crew go on layovers now and just leave and not return. Yesterday 51 people were at the Leaving counter in the employee service center - 51 people getting their cheques, passports etc. That is cabin crew/pilots only.
If you work on those numbers thats around 1k per month. For a 23k person workforce (cc/fd) thats quite a lot so imagine the recruitment that is required, although this is being stopped now and new crew who are yet to begin are being told that all recruitment is on suspension due to "runway works".
I for one would not want to return "home" to a hotel after a midnight turnaround or a 4 day trip. These hotels are not in downtown Dubai either.
More and more Emirates is trying to find ways to get rid of crew, part of that is through safety and security checks that are conducted prior to pax boarding.
More and more penny pinching, fares are going up for pax and staff, mileage on fares is coming down, Skywards is in comparison to a lot of other programs isnt as good IMO but EK profit on this whole "Oooh Emirates" aura however it doesn't wash with me knowing what goes on behind the scenes but I would agree with you regarding the lounge staff - in general they are very nice.
I'm glad you enjoy your status, I shall watch with interest as benefits diminish and become lesser value. They have become too big for their boots and we all know what goes up...
I have to be honest, sadly a lot of frequent travelers do not share your sentiment. It seems to be a culture thing as well with the vast majority of those who understand coming from "The West" or the MEDC's whilst less understanding coming from LEDC's. I shall not be more specific so as not to offend but complaint form on boarding may or may not enlighten people.
PS removal was terrible whilst not a huge surprise to be honest.
An email asking all crew to "go the extra mile" was sent out with the firm announcement of runway works, however I'm certain that the company management should be looking at themselves to go the extra mile because most staff don't have the stamina for the extra especially among the inter company practices. Its not quite as bad as QR but its now not far off, and its only getting worse.
I have pictures of the new pilots housing, it looks like a worker camp in my opinion, in fact the new worker camps in AUH are better looking than the new pilot villas which are supposed to house them and their families.
More and more crew go on layovers now and just leave and not return. Yesterday 51 people were at the Leaving counter in the employee service center - 51 people getting their cheques, passports etc. That is cabin crew/pilots only.
If you work on those numbers thats around 1k per month. For a 23k person workforce (cc/fd) thats quite a lot so imagine the recruitment that is required, although this is being stopped now and new crew who are yet to begin are being told that all recruitment is on suspension due to "runway works".
I for one would not want to return "home" to a hotel after a midnight turnaround or a 4 day trip. These hotels are not in downtown Dubai either.
More and more Emirates is trying to find ways to get rid of crew, part of that is through safety and security checks that are conducted prior to pax boarding.
More and more penny pinching, fares are going up for pax and staff, mileage on fares is coming down, Skywards is in comparison to a lot of other programs isnt as good IMO but EK profit on this whole "Oooh Emirates" aura however it doesn't wash with me knowing what goes on behind the scenes but I would agree with you regarding the lounge staff - in general they are very nice.
I'm glad you enjoy your status, I shall watch with interest as benefits diminish and become lesser value. They have become too big for their boots and we all know what goes up...
Last edited by DXBFlyer; Apr 2, 2014 at 3:23 am
Apr 7, 2014, 2:31 am
#174
Join Date: May 2010
Location: BOM
Programs: EK Plat, HHonors Gold
Posts: 2,883
I think the whole FF recognition thing is just dwindling across EK. Just did 2 legs in F (one ULH) and no acknowledgement of Platinum status on board. Crew was nice but nothing extra ordinary.