Expertflyer wrong on D class availability?
 

Hi,
I've been looking for D class upgrades on some upcoming trips and set up Upgrade Alerts in Expert Flyer. I got an alert for one of them, checked on EF and it showed 3 seats in D (I need 2), tried to upgrade online but got "no seats" available, called Emirates and they confirmed this.

I'm pretty new at this, is this a regular occurrence? I did check EF, still showing 3 available. I also triple checked I've got the right dates, flight numbers etc.

Many Thanks,

Mike

Is your reservation part of a married segment it might be because of that and you need D on all sectors to be available?

Emirates frequently has availability display issues in Sabre. Since Expertflyer uses Sabre, it's not unusual to see this.

ExpertFlyer uses multiple GDSs. EK shows different availability to different point of sales. Since ExpertFlyer is based in a USA point of sale, the award availability will match the USA EK call center or website. Or it could be a married segment logic issue as well.

In my view, expertflyer has become increasingly useless for EK and EY. Especially in situations of critical availability (0, 1 or 2) I have found discrepancies between expertflyer results and every sales channel EK / EY use. It is always a lottery (which can work in both directions, but is mostly worse in reality than what expertflyer shows as results).

It would be helpful to have a button on the expertflyer page that connects me to an online travel agency that sells me exactly what I see on the expertflyer results page. I am really tired of finding space on expertflyer and having no luck in finding that seat on ANY EK channel (online, phone, travel agent, whatever ...).

By the way, the same is true about the fare listings. Often the fares shown on expertflyer are not actually loaded in travel agents' reservations systems, although nothing in the terms & conditions fineprint restricts them (no POS restrictions or else).

I have not had issues with fares being listed but not existing

With some fares ( e.g. CBR-LON ) that I have tried to book, it has been difficult with the agents having issues with the journey starting from a place where EK doesn't fly to but the fare has actually been valid

I just got an email alert from EF indicating D class availability. I log in at it shows D 7. I try and upgrade online on EK.com and guess what not available, I call EK CS and they confirm the same !

Single leg direct flight btw

Thanks for clarifying on the GDS front. However, the point about the availability issue still remains. Querying EK availability normally and via direct connect frequently produces different results. POS does not matter in this regard.

If you can give us a specific example we can look as we have the ability to query the inventory both via the GDS and via direct connect. However we have not seen differences in availability based on the GDS used (we have access to 3 of them) which is separate from if direct connect is used or not.

Seeing false positive D on EF now as well

I'm a relative beginner when it comes to Emirates upgrades and Expertflyer. Perhaps someone can help me out.

I am flying DXB-MEL next month on EK408. It's a flex Y ticket and when I checked a few days ago the EK website showed availability. I wanted to do the upgrade there and then, but was waiting for some miles to be credited from a flight 5 days prior (what's wrong with Emirates?). When the miles finally came through, after a complaint to Skywards, guess what. Your guess was correct, the availability had disappeared.

When I look at Expertflyer it shows D0 and I7. What does this mean as far as my desired upgrade is concerned? And is it true that people booking from Australia (like me) are less likely to see upgrade availability than someone booking from the USA or elsewhere?

Have they perhaps changed the fare bucket for upgrades?

I checked with EK and the buckets are still the same - D (as in Delta) is the upgrade fare bucket, I (as in India) is award bucket.

I recently made the same experience for award tickets (both I and D inventory). Expertflyer inconsistent with Emirates website which again was inconsistent with Emirates call centre.

As stated in our last post, we have multiple ways of getting this data, so if you can email us specific flight information that you believe to be inaccurate we can look at our other data sources. Thanks.

D is both awards and upgrades. I is only for flex awards, which are more expensive.

I am trying to book an F award for my parents, JFK-DXB on the 15th of February. ExpertFlyer is showing A=4 for this date on the 11 PM flight (EK202). However, EK.com is showing no availability at all. I thought Flex F Awards come out of discounted F inventory (A bucket) and there is definitely A bucket available on the flight.

I already PM'ed ExpertFlyer Voice to see if they can let me know the reason for the discrepancy. Has anybody else here found out what the deal is?

Just as a follow-up, I called the EK service center and they are telling me that FLEX F awards come out of the same Z bucket as SAVER F awards. Does that sound correct? ExpertFlyer shows FLEX F awards coming out of the A bucket.

As a further datapoint, the flight is JFK-DXB-MLE, and ExpertFlyer is showing the DXB-MLE EK652 as O=0 (Business FLEX award), yet at EK.com, EK652 is showing as having FLEX Business award seats available.

EF doesn't sync up that well with EK, especially when it relates to awards

The problem looks to be that you were searching each segment separately when you should have been searching for them together. EK uses married segment logic for awards so you need to search for the entire trip. When you do you'll see that the results are correct:

Results from ExpertFlyer.com

Actually, at first I was going to get an F award to DXB and pay for the flight to MLE. Still, there is no F availability just JFK-DXB. I have data below, sorry it's unformatted but I am posting from my iPhone.

EF shows:


JFK to DXB on 02/15/13 5:00 PM
Flying EK on booking class(es) A Z O D
Expanded
EK 202 JFK 11:00p → DXB 8:30p
A4 O7
Stops: 0
Aircraft: 388
Frequency: Daily
Reliability: 80% / 26m
Flight Details · Seat Map · Create Alert

And EK.com shows:

2. 23:00 on Fri 15 Feb, 2013
DEPARTING15 FEB 13 New York, United States to Dubai, United Arab Emirates
Flight
Depart / Arrive
Time
Airport
Duration / Aircraft
Economy
Business
First
EK202
Fri
15 Feb 13
23:00 John F Kennedy International Airport (JFK) 12hr 30min
Airbus A380-800 Available
Available
Unavailable
Sat
16 Feb 13
20:30 Dubai International Airport (DXB) Skywards Flex Reward Skywards Flex Reward

Very interesting. EK.com, ITA and EF all agree that there is A inventory available should one wish to purchase a revenue ticket.

I tried a one-way reward search for your date - that doesn't work either.

So do first class Flex rewards no longer book into A? Or are we seeing the first signs of a further restriction on reward bookings?

I wanted to wait until I get back to my computer as I didn't recall these flights, even with married segment logic, not having A bucket. I just did an award search on EF with JFK and origin and MLE and destination, and this is what I get:


1 Connections


EK 202 0 JFK
02/15/13
11:00 PM DXB
02/16/13
8:30 PM 388
Daily
80% / 26m
First - Flex Award A 4
Business - Flex Award O 0
Economy - Flex Award W 9
Economy - Partner Award X 9



EK 658 0 DXB
02/17/13
3:15 AM MLE
02/17/13
8:20 AM 77W
Su,Th,F
48% / 15m
Business - Flex Award O 0
Economy - Flex Award W 9
Economy - Partner Award X 9


Am I using EF incorrectly? I can't bring up the results you are bringing up.

You can obtain these results as follows:

-Specify classes A and O only. If you request Z,D,X or N also, you lose the ability to choose a connection point.

-Specify DXB as a connection point.

-Optionally, specify 10PM as departure time.

Married segment logic is what is zeroing A class on the JFK-DXB-MLE itinerary. It does not explain why you are unable to book a Flex First reward JFK-DXB as a one-way or return itinerary.

You are look at the wrong flights. You mentioned, and we posted the results for EK 202/652, however you just pasted the results for 202/658. Apparently the results for EK202 are different for when it is paired with 658 vs 652

Yes, I made an error, I want 658 which arrives to Male at 8 AM. Doing all this research on my iPhone, sitting by the pool in Maui, means I am easily mixing up details! :-)

With that pairing A=4 but of course there is no F award availability on EK.com.

Any ideas why?

I tried this and am still getting A=4 on EK202

I think we are obtaining the same results. Those instructions were necessary to show the 0935 connection, which I thought you were looking for.

EK202 has A=4 when connecting to EK658 (0315).
EK202 has A=0 when connecting to EK652 (0935).

As a further datapoint, EK202 shows A=4 for an itinerary to DXB only. This is correct as EK.com will sell a JFK-DXB-JFK revenue ticket (on EK202) for $15k, which is an A fare.

What we have here seems to be some process whereby access to A inventory for reward tickets is being limited.

When I called EK they told me all F awards come out of the Z bucket, which makes no sense as then there would be no distinction between SAVER or FLEX awards.

If they do come out of A bucket then I wonder what is necessary to decode how/where/when seats will be available.

EK202 on that date is relatively empty in F so I am not sure why they are blocking the redemption inventory.

I have tried searching for Flex First rewards from DUB - including via the calendar award search function, which incidentally I had never seen before.

There is no Flex First availability on dates that do not have Saver First (Z) availability, but do have plenty of revenue A available.

I think EK has removed the ability to book a Flex award in A inventory. It is still possible to book a Flex award (with increased maximum stay and free rebooking) by selecting the 'Flex' option when searching for awards, however these Flex awards are available only on dates when Z is available.

It seems the information the phone agent gave whimike is correct, all First awards now book into Z.

I'm not sure whether this is a temporary or permanent 'enhancement'...

Considering what I would have to pay in miles for a FLEX F ticket (310,000 EK miles for 2 tickets, just one-way, with the DXB-MLE segment in J), it is absurd EK would only allow FLEX inventory to come out of SAVER inventory now.

I have checked as well and get the same result - no Flex F awards unless saver award is available. Given that EK's IT often seems in a little disarray it may be that EK management don't know that this has happened so all of us that have any form of meaningful contacts at EK should ask/let them know to see if it is a glitch or indeed another enhancement to the Skywards programme. I for one will do so today... should I get any form or a response I will post back here.

As a further datapoint, FLEX J fares still maintain their O bucket and SAVER J is D bucket, only F fares are now sharing the SAVER Z bucket.

Hopefully you are right and it is an IT error. Just wondering why the EK person I called told me it FLEX F comes out of Z, or that is just what they are seeing on their computer, hopefully due to a technical glitch.