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Anyone have any luck getting EU261 compensation from LY?

Anyone have any luck getting EU261 compensation from LY?

Old Sep 7, 14, 2:29 am
  #1  
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Anyone have any luck getting EU261 compensation from LY?

My ZRH-TLV flight was cancelled last week which under EU261 ought to entitle me to 400 Euros. I emailed LY about it but haven't received a response. Any suggestions from the group about how to best get them to pay?
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Old Sep 7, 14, 6:03 am
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I may be wrong but not sure the law applies to LY?

EU 261 applies only for flights departing from Europe or airlines based in in Europe flying to Europe from outside.

As a "foreign airline" flying to Europe not sure there is any application of the law.
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Old Sep 7, 14, 3:08 pm
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Originally Posted by craigc View Post
I may be wrong but not sure the law applies to LY?

EU 261 applies only for flights departing from Europe or airlines based in in Europe flying to Europe from outside.

As a "foreign airline" flying to Europe not sure there is any application of the law.
Would be applicable as flight was departing from Europe.
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Old Sep 11, 14, 5:38 am
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Please note that you may be entitled to more than 400 EUR according to the Israeli law.

http://www.knesset.gov.il/privatelaw.../3/413_3_1.rtf

I once had a delayed flight issue from CDG to TLV.

When I asked Air France for a compensation I was offered a discount voucher with a ridiculous amount.

When I referred them to the EU regulation, they came back to me with a cash compensation according to the Israeli law, which was higher than the one I asked for according to the EU regulation.

In your case, assuming you weren't notified about the flight cancellation more than 14 days in advance, I think that in addition to an alternate flight or a refund of the ticket cost, you are entitled to 2000 NIS.

See section 6.c (6.ג.) in the link above, as it includes some more exceptions in which you are not entitled to a compensation, if you were notified 7-14 days or less than 7 days before your flight, and you were offered certain alternative flights.
Please note that if you were provided with such offers, it is El-Als responsibility to prove the offers they provided you (section 6.c.(g) - 6.ג.ז)

Please note that if an alternate flight was provided and you reached TLV within 5 hours after the original arrival time, you are entitled to a compensation of only 1000 NIS (50%).
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Old Sep 11, 14, 6:19 pm
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Tonight's Munich flight has also been cancelled (LY254) due to mechanical issues.

As 2000 NIS is (at current exchange rates) more than the EU261 compensation, I would be interested if anyone has any experience in claiming the 2000 NIS from El Al (how willingly they paid out; how long it took etc.)
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Old Oct 2, 14, 4:37 am
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Originally Posted by NYTA View Post
My ZRH-TLV flight was cancelled last week which under EU261 ought to entitle me to 400 Euros. I emailed LY about it but haven't received a response. Any suggestions from the group about how to best get them to pay?
I wouldn't bother pursuing this avenue; Switzerland is not an EU nation.
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Old Oct 2, 14, 5:21 am
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Originally Posted by NickW View Post
I wouldn't bother pursuing this avenue; Switzerland is not an EU nation.
Quite right - Switzerland is not part of the EU.

...but it is part of the EEA, and it has voluntarily signed up to enforce EU261/2004.

So you can claim EU261/2004 compensation for all flights on CH flagged airlines, and for all flights departing CH.

...but the Israeli statutory compensation sounds like it may (if it applies) well give you a few more, erm, Shekels.....

Ken.

Willard the Bear - Unfortunately, they don't pay out to Bears, blatant discrimination if you ask me!
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Old Oct 2, 14, 8:11 am
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So far zero response to my two e-mails and my phone call only ended up having them tell me to send another e-mail. Under the Israeli compensation system, I think they are supposed to hand you the cash at the time it happens so maybe next trip I will get to the airport early to go to the ticket office.
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Old Oct 2, 14, 9:40 am
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Originally Posted by NYTA View Post
So far zero response to my two e-mails and my phone call only ended up having them tell me to send another e-mail. Under the Israeli compensation system, I think they are supposed to hand you the cash at the time it happens so maybe next trip I will get to the airport early to go to the ticket office.
Fax them, specifically demanding 2000 NIS compensation under the Israeli Aviation Services Law 5772-2012. The fax number is 03-7602233.

Two weeks ago I faxed a formal letter, very brief (three sentences: I travelled on LY... on..., which was delayed x number of hours. According to the Israeli Aviation Services Law each passenger is entitled to 2000 NIS compensation due to the delay. Please send 2000 NIS within the timeframe mandated by the Law to .... ).

After I faxed it I called 3 or 4 days later to check that they had received the fax and to get my customer reference number. From what the lady said on the phone I'm hopeful that they will pay out within the time frame (I'm claiming for several passengers on my booking).

I wrote the letter in English and spoke on the phone in English, not that it should make a difference, but I felt that I could be more concise and to the point in English than in Hebrew.
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Old Oct 29, 14, 8:27 am
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After almost 2 months and an in person complaint at the airport yesterday I finally got the following response. Not sure about the Israeli law issue but certainly under EU law a mechanical isn't "extraordinary" and I know the residency test for EU261 is BS.

Dear NYTA,
Thank you for contacting El Al regarding the cancellation of our flight from Zurich on the 3rd of September 2014.
I am sorry for the inconvenience that you were caused.
Regarding compensation as written in your email, since your country of residence is not part of the European union the EU regulations do not apply.
The applicable law is the Israeli Aviation Services Law (Compensation and Assistance for Flight Cancellation or Change of Conditions 5772-2012).
The aircraft experienced a technical problem that was discovered immediately before the departure. The aircraft was grounded and necessitated transporting an alternative part from our hub in Tel Aviv. The circumstances surrounding this flight delay are considered extraordinary. In accordance to the Israeli Aviation Services Law, compensation is not awardable due to the explanation above. However, if you incurred 'out of pocket' expenses due to the delay, please send me copy of receipts to be reviewed.
I hope that you will be able to overlook your disappointing experience and allow us the opportunity to serve you again so that we may restore your confidence in El Al.
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Old Oct 29, 14, 1:37 pm
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Originally Posted by NYTA View Post

...
, since your country of residence is not part of the European union the EU regulations do not apply.

.
No such paragraph in the Israeli law regarding compensations due to canceled flight.

You do not have to get בםצפקמדשאןםמ under the EU regulation but the ISRAELI regulation.

The full law wording is available from ELAL web site:

Hebrew here - PDF Hebrew

English - nonbinding here

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Old Oct 29, 14, 3:31 pm
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It does say in the summary of Israeli law that if it was canceled because of circumstances beyond the airline's control then the payment doesn't need to be made. That said, I'm pretty sure that EU precedents state that mechanical problems aren't beyond the airline's control. If mechanical problems aren't in the airline's control, whose control are they in?!
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Old Oct 30, 14, 9:14 am
  #13  
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Originally Posted by NYTA View Post
After almost 2 months and an in person complaint at the airport yesterday I finally got the following response. Not sure about the Israeli law issue but certainly under EU law a mechanical isn't "extraordinary" and I know the residency test for EU261 is BS.

Dear NYTA,
Thank you for contacting El Al regarding the cancellation of our flight from Zurich on the 3rd of September 2014.
I am sorry for the inconvenience that you were caused.
Regarding compensation as written in your email, since your country of residence is not part of the European union the EU regulations do not apply.
The applicable law is the Israeli Aviation Services Law (Compensation and Assistance for Flight Cancellation or Change of Conditions 5772-2012).
The aircraft experienced a technical problem that was discovered immediately before the departure. The aircraft was grounded and necessitated transporting an alternative part from our hub in Tel Aviv. The circumstances surrounding this flight delay are considered extraordinary. In accordance to the Israeli Aviation Services Law, compensation is not awardable due to the explanation above. However, if you incurred 'out of pocket' expenses due to the delay, please send me copy of receipts to be reviewed.
I hope that you will be able to overlook your disappointing experience and allow us the opportunity to serve you again so that we may restore your confidence in El Al.
They are wrong about the residency requirement (they completely made that up) and they are wrong about classifying tech as "extraordinary."

You'd have legal standing to sue in Switzerland, but I'm not sure if you could force an Israeli company in an Israeli court to pay you based on a European law. But an escalation with a complaint to the Ministry of Transportation is certainly in order. They are lying 100%.
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Old Nov 17, 14, 7:42 am
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Just as an update I filed a claim with refund.me who will send them a nastygram followed by a lawsuit if they don't pay. Some Israeli lawyer should file a class-action against them but I don't have time to deal with that.
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Old Nov 17, 14, 8:10 am
  #15  
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Originally Posted by NYTA View Post
Just as an update I filed a claim with refund.me who will send them a nastygram followed by a lawsuit if they don't pay. Some Israeli lawyer should file a class-action against them but I don't have time to deal with that.
Just took a look at their website. Seems like a smart concept, though completely unfair that you should have to pay someone money just to get the money you are legally owed because LY refuses to pay up
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