JoeTPA

I use a Segway (by Ninebot) MiniPro for a mobility disability. It's a wonderful way for me to get around - sitting can be a substantial problem, so this allows me to stand and move. I have some minor ADA-related issues to deal with at malls and hotels and the like, usually resolved quickly. Airline travel hasn't posed much of a problem... Until this week.

Flew TPA-DFW-LAS on AA last week for conferences. Notified the staff at check-in and at the gate that I had a mobility device with a Li-ion battery and that it could fit in the wheelchair closet or in the overhead (the knee bar is removable). No issues.

Coming home, at LAS for an 0800 flight back along the same LAS-DFW-TPA route. Inform the check-in agent that I have a mobility device with a Li-ion battery. No problem. Get to the gate - major problem. Long story short, even after discussions with their CRO, I was denied boarding because the AA Hazmat staff determined that the 310wh battery exceeds the 300wh battery limit. Well, yes, he's right - BUT - that limit only applies to batteries that are not encased, not attached to the device, or not protected from short circuiting (49 CFR 175.10(a)(17), 49 CFR 175.10(a)(17)(v)). It doesn't apply to the Segway. They didn't want to hear that explanation, however, and in fact one customer service agent got quite rude and hostile when I attempted to bring up these sections of the FARs. So, basically, AA left me stranded in LAS with no recourse, despite flying me out there. Filed a complaint with the DOT.

So I sought out other airlines. First stop: Southwest. I've flown with them before. THEY CAME TO THE SAME CONCLUSION. So much for the "LUV" airline, right? DOT complaint filed.

On to Delta. Delta initially said that they, too, would not allow the Segway on board, however then came back and said that they had indeed made a mistake and that I was welcome to fly with them. YAY! Bought a 1-way ticket and was booked LAS-CVG-TPA. This was a 10:30pm red-eye, so I'd already been in the airport for over 16 hours by the time that flight departed.

Land in CVG, go the the TPA flight, board, stow the Segway in the overhead, take my seat. A staff member comes over with a question about the Segway, then leaves. Then another. Then I am asked to deplane as my Segway will not be allowed to fly because the pilot refused to allow it. I get off the plane, the flight pushes back and leaves. Third DOT complaint filed in less than 24 hours.

Fortunately, the Delta staff member who asked me to deplane listened to my explanation, looked at the FARs with me, and agreed with me. Immediately booked me CVG-ATL-TPA, and got me right on the plane - even put me in First ATL-TPA. No issues, and the ATL staff and flight crew went above and aboard to ensure that everything went smoothly from that point. Kudos for picking up the fumble and scoring a touchdown.

So I made it home, but this never should have happened. It was one of the most stressful trips I've ever experienced. 30 hours to go from LAS to TPA when it should have been 8. I was stressed, exhausted, was forcibly separated from my toiletries and medication (my bag went on AA to TPA without me), and humiliated by being effectively perp-walked from the CVG-TPA flight. All this because several airline staff are not educated on the FARs, didn't care to read them when confronted with a device that was out of the ordinary (not a scooter or power wheelchair), and totally didn't care to understand that they might have gotten it wrong. They acted like I was trying to bring an exploding hoverboard on the plane or that a Segway isn't a mobility device (it is: 14 CFR 382.3 “Battery powered mobility aid” - "Battery-powered mobility aid means an assistive device that is used by individuals with mobility impairments such a wheelchair, a scooter, or a Segway when it is used as a mobility device by a person with a mobility-related disability.") or maybe that my disability is not visible (neuropathy). Regardless, I am going to follow up with the DOT and FAA to ask that they propagate this information down to the airlines so that maybe myself or someone else won't ever have to go through this again.

I'm attaching the "explanation" that AA provided me. Note that the part of their rationale - no modification for handlebars - does not exist in the FARs, and the sections they cite expressly PERMIT the device. The battery being non-removable is a point IN FAVOR of transporting a lithium-ion battery in excess of 300wh!

DeafFlyer

Like the guys who said the limit is 300 watts, I didn�t know it didn�t apply in certain situations.. Does Segway make a version r that is 300 or .less?

JoeTPA

Not that I am aware of. This is pretty much the smallest Segway ever made.

arcticflier

I just looked at an image of your Segway device. I have neuropathy as well and I know first hand the resultant pain; however, a device that requires I stand and requires pressure on the soles of my feet is no different than the pain experienced by walking. In my case, a wheelchair would alleviate the pain of neuropathy. Do you have a medically certified disability? Is your Segway certified as a medical device?

The absence of handlebars means less control should your balance be impacted by the pain experienced with neuropathy. I also have a concern about the speed of this device in a busy airport.

Lastly, the restrictions on the size of lithium batteries is motivated by the risk created for an electrical fire aboard an aircraft full of passengers.

I don�t really feel sorry for your situation since there are other types of medical devices available and provided by airports that have the advantage of not being a safety hazard.

As for being �forcibly separated� from your toiletries and medications, I do not understand where �force� was involved. Travel Tip is to take medications in your carry-on.

sensia

Did you miss this part, "BUT - that limit only applies to batteries that are not encased, not attached to the device, or not protected from short circuiting (49 CFR 175.10(a)(17), 49 CFR 175.10(a)(17)(v)). It doesn't apply to the Segway."

arcticflier

I don�t believe I missed ANY parts of �49 CFR 175.10(a)(17)� and I ship HAZMAT on cargo aircraft and my employees fly with HAZMAT as �Checked Baggage� as well as Carry-On� and so I am familiar with this subject as well as reading CFR�s. The penalty for a Company in violation of batteries and battery operated devices is $10,000 and more so we pay close attention to this subject.

Did you meet each and every requirement stipulated in �49 CFR 175.10(a)(17)(i-vi)�?

I have never seen a Segway model that you named and so I am unfamiliar as to whether it meets every requirement stipulated in (i-vi).

Edit: You mentioned that the AA HAZMAT employee reviewed your Segway and denied your access. In my experience, I have yet to meet a HAZMAT Specialist, who is trained and who deals with this topic every day, to be poorly informed on the CFR.

arcticflier

Did you read this part of the CFR you pointed out to me:
�49 CFR 175.10(a)(17) A wheelchair or other mobility aid equipped with a lithium ion battery, when carried as checked baggage, provided-...(i)thru(vi)�

�Checked Baggage� by definition is contained in the Hold and not accessible to the PAX throughout the duration of the flight...therefore, 49 CFR 175.10(a)(17) does not pertain to your circumstance as you described.

You indicated in your original post that you were taking it as Carry-On and requested it be stored in the Cabin, therefore, it will be enlightening when you receive a response to your (3) DOT complaints and I certainly hope you will post their response here on the forum.

As for my opinion as a passenger on commercial aircraft, I am encouraged by the actions of the various airline employees in being concerned for the SAFETY of every other person on the aircraft.

Additionally, it appears that your Segway can achieve speeds of 10-15 mph and can be modified to attain even higher speeds. I trust you are not someone who would exceed the speed of pedestrian traffic in the Concourses.

Next time, it might be less stressful to request a wheelchair or golfcart.

Podcat

But then you�re not a Senior Hazmat Compliance Analyst for the country�s biggest airline. Don�t you think someone getting a fat six-figure salary plus benefits to do that should know?

JoeTPA

The Segway is recognized by both the DOJ under the ADA and by the DOT as part of the Air Carrier Access Act.

That's the rub - I don't get pain while standing or riding the Segway - just when sitting or walking long distances. While the device can go 10-12 mph, it can also go 1 mph - so there's no impact on other travelers in a busy airport or other venue.

However, this battery is actually rather small compared to those carried in powered wheelchairs and scooters. Plus, the FARs state that there is no size limit on a mobility device.

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Airlines - as I recall - are not supposed to transport a bag for which the passenger is not on board after 9/11. So the bag should have been removed when I was denied boarding.