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"The 17% is a service charge, sir, it is not a tip."

"The 17% is a service charge, sir, it is not a tip."

Old Aug 29, 09, 6:47 pm
  #16  
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Originally Posted by Himeno View Post
I donít like the idea of tipping at all. It isnít the customerís job to pay the staff, it is the employers.

All tipping does is create an entitlement which leads to many people in those jobs doing shoddy work and then demanding a tip. Iíll tip someone if the service deserves it. If the service is just Ďaverageí then to bad, no tip for you.
I don't think tipping creates any such entitlement - I think it actually encourages better service. My experience is that wait staff service is better in tipping cultures than it is in non or lower tipping cultures. This is not universally true (Japan is a notable exception) but it's been my experience more often than not.
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Old Aug 29, 09, 7:15 pm
  #17  
 
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I was under the impression TIPS was actually an acronym for:

To
Insure (although I think it should be ensure but hey, that screws it up right?)
Proper
Service

So I agree with just not going there...it's crazy to have a serving professional to solicit further tip. What's the point? You get crappy service and you still get hosed for 17%?

Glad I moved out of SF, that would drive me nuts to see owners of these places charging for the health care bill...it called the cost of doing business. Move the darn place to Daly City if you're that annoyed.
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Old Aug 29, 09, 7:20 pm
  #18  
 
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Did the server mention the service charge before the OP ordered, or did it just appear on the bill? I would probably have left before ordering if it was mentioned first. Either way, I would have told the manager why I would not be returning, and that dissatisfied customers don't suffer in silence.
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Old Aug 29, 09, 7:22 pm
  #19  
 
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Originally Posted by Gaucho100K View Post
This entire tip thing in the US really does go a little toooo far sometimes...
Not to start a big fight (though I might), I am convinced that I receive better service in restaurants in the US because of our culture of tipping if and only the service is good. Servers in the US will hustle and be friendly for because their wages are directly related to the service that they provide. I travel to Europe twice a year (Italy, France, Germany, Switzerland, etc) and the Caribbean once a year. I have eaten at a wide range of restaurants in those countries and I have found the service to be, more often than not, stiff or brusque. I believe that waiters in Europe do not fawn over me because they are already getting a decent wage and do not need more scraps from me.
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Old Aug 29, 09, 7:51 pm
  #20  
 
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Do you want to be fawned over? I find it unseemly. I like the Euro model a lot better. Bring me food, bring me beer. No need to fake smile and be all over me while i'm eating.
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Old Aug 29, 09, 9:30 pm
  #21  
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Originally Posted by Georgia Peach View Post
Did the server mention the service charge before the OP ordered, or did it just appear on the bill? I would probably have left before ordering if it was mentioned first. Either way, I would have told the manager why I would not be returning, and that dissatisfied customers don't suffer in silence.
Yes, I knew about the service charge beforehand and although I don't like that approach, others in my party were really looking forward to this place so we went regardless.

I did NOT know that I was going to have to listen to begging afterwards. Most US restaurants that add a service charge also sneak in a blank "tip" line on the charge card receipt, but I've not seen it pushed beyond that before.
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Old Aug 29, 09, 10:31 pm
  #22  
 
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UGH!!! The whole "service charge" thing is like the damned "fuel surcharge"... If it is an expense related to providing the service, then they should role it INTO the price...

If it is unrelated to providing the good/service, and is indeed instead of a "TIP" then it should be OPTIONAL...

Any restaurant that has a required "service charge" for providing SERVICE then pretty much forfeit the right to expect any kind of significant TIP on top of it...
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Old Aug 29, 09, 10:37 pm
  #23  
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Originally Posted by inyourvillages View Post
Do you want to be fawned over? I find it unseemly. I like the Euro model a lot better. Bring me food, bring me beer. No need to fake smile and be all over me while i'm eating.
It's not about being fawned over, it's about getting efficient and knowledgable service.
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Old Aug 30, 09, 4:54 am
  #24  
 
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Originally Posted by rjque View Post
it's about getting efficient and knowledgable service.
Which I find to be more lacking in the US then elsewhere.
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Old Aug 30, 09, 7:42 am
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Originally Posted by rjque View Post
It's not about being fawned over, it's about getting efficient and knowledgable service.
Bingo! ^


Originally Posted by Himeno View Post
Which I find to be more lacking in the US then elsewhere.
Not my experience at all. Then again, YMMV.
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Old Aug 30, 09, 8:03 am
  #26  
 
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Originally Posted by gj83 View Post
Probably not kitchen staff, but the water refiller people. In CA they don't do tipped wage and minimum wage is $8/hr from what I found online. $8/hr for kitchen help isn't much, but I'd hope any good steak house pays kitchen staff above minimum wage.

17% is an odd number. I typically tip more than that, but autograt me and that's all you get.
ah, but it does include the kitchen staff. directly from their dinner menu...
Choice of Dessert

"A 17% taxable service charge will be added to your bill. This allows for a fair distribution to non-management employees between the service staff (tipped employees) and the kitchen staff (non-tipped employees). This distribution shows the entire staff how appreciated they are.
Any additional tips will stay directly with your server.
Thank you for your understanding and patronage.
The Petri Family "
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Old Aug 30, 09, 8:07 am
  #27  
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Originally Posted by PDXOutbound
I was under the impression TIPS was actually an acronym for:
Nah - that's bogus etymology.
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Old Aug 30, 09, 8:25 am
  #28  
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Originally Posted by tonypct View Post
Not my experience at all. Then again, YMMV.
Agreed. I find servers at the good restaurants in the U.S. to be very helpful and knowledgeable, definitely more so than many other foreign countries (particularly Europe).
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Old Aug 30, 09, 8:47 am
  #29  
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Originally Posted by PDXOutbound View Post
...Glad I moved out of SF, that would drive me nuts to see owners of these places charging for the health care bill...it called the cost of doing business...
First time that I saw this in SF was in a place where the service was rather ordinary and we were querulous about it, to say the least.

Our companions, who were local, said that the proprietor of this restaurant had been an outspoken opponent of the measure and had placed it on the bills in order to continually call attention to its absurdities.

Therefore, my response was to deduct it from whatever I had thought the waitstaff was worth that evening and think no more about it.
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Old Aug 30, 09, 9:36 am
  #30  
 
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Originally Posted by RichardInSF View Post
The waiter claimed he only got 45% of the service charge so we should tip him in addition.


Originally Posted by RichardInSF View Post
This is a scam, and I don't like it. Really spoiled the dinner for me.
I agree with you 100%. Is there any legal recourse if you refuse to pay the full 17%?
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