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for me, any wine that's unbalanced doesn't sit well. the only varietal that i absolutely cannot drink is white zin. just awful.
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Originally Posted by Eastbay1K
(Post 10959221)
Plastic is a horrible long term enclosure. It is "fine enough" for wines to be consumed within a year or two. But you may not know what is under the fauxoil (fake foil) until you remove it. Screwtops are 1000% better than plastic.
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Originally Posted by UCBeau
(Post 10961598)
that's far too broad of a statement to make. fake corks can do a fine job long term if they're made correctly, out of inert compounds. the plastic "cork" found in a 3$ merlot probably won't do for long term, but a well designed and constructed one can offer just as good a seal, if not better, than any real cork closure on the market.
http://www.wdwnews.com/ViewPressRele...leaseID=110056 Blurb/Snippet: Blazon put together a taste of the best New World wines with 95 cutting-edge choices that are all screw cap. The approachable list supports sustainable agriculture, he says, with a majority of the wines originating from vineyards where grapes are organically grown, or farmers are using sustainable methods. "And the recyclable screw caps are nothing short of a revolution in wine packaging," said Blazon. Industry experts say that the screw cap is the most significant technical evolution in the wine industry since the glass bottle was introduced 250 years ago. "In the forward-thinking wine industry, screw caps are gaining rapid acceptance," said Blazon. Research shows that the screw cap consistently provides the most reliable wine quality (spoilage is as high as 9 percent for corked bottles). The New Zealand wine industry, for instance, has set high standards for quality and bottles more than 90 percent of its wines with screw caps. The options for screw cap wine are growing, said Blazon. The Wave serves no California wines (California Grill on the resort's 15th floor has a corner on that market), but instead focuses on bright-style New World wines from the Southern Hemisphere, including Argentina, Chile, New Zealand, Australia and South Africa. Prices range from $37 for a bottle of pinot gris from Mendoza, Argentina, to a full-bodied shiraz blend from Barossa, South Australia, at $85. By-the-glass prices range from $8 to $20. With 45 whites and 40 reds on the list, the biggest challenge was finding Bordeaux-style grapes, said Blazon, because the industry still is hesitant to put expensive reds into screw cap bottles. But when Blazon visited one of New Zealand's top estates, Craggy Range Winery, he worked with the winery to bottle half bottles of merlot from the Gimblett Gravels region in Hawkes Bay, "arguably some of the finest merlot out of New Zealand," said Blazon. Exclusively at The Wave guests can unscrew a half bottle of Craggy Range Te Kahu, Gimblett Gravels, and Craggy Range Sophia, Gimblett Gravels. Pinot noir standouts on the list from New Zealand include Craggy Range Te Muna, Martinborough; Pegasus Bay, Waipara, and Peregrine Wines, Central Otago. Because of its range of styles, Australian syrah comprise the biggest collection of The Wave's wines, said Blazon. "It's flavorful, satisfying, and superb with food." Among other interesting choices are sparkling wines from Tasmania, Rieslings from South Australia and floral New Wave whites from Argentina. |
Originally Posted by UCBeau
(Post 10961598)
that's far too broad of a statement to make. fake corks can do a fine job long term if they're made correctly, out of inert compounds. the plastic "cork" found in a 3$ merlot probably won't do for long term, but a well designed and constructed one can offer just as good a seal, if not better, than any real cork closure on the market.
The Australian Wine Reseach Instiute over the last 7 or 8 years now have been examining wine closed with natural bark cork, technical corks (made from cork dust, particles etc.) Screwcaps and Synthetics. The results have found that screwcaps were the best at keeping O2 out followed by natural bark and then synthetics. The reason for the tests in the first place was to see if there was a difference in the wine bottle's ability to be closed and impervious to some extent vs. the incidence of TCA in the wines. TCA comes from the natural bark or technical cork being produced by a mold living in the bark and taking airborne chlorine and converting it to a less lethal compound TCA. Making a wine finished with this type of closure taste like a damp moldy wet basement or wet cardboard. It is estmated tht 5% of the wines with this type of closure have this problem. Whole wineries have been known to have the problem coming from their use of Chlorie as an antiseptic cleaning agent. Because of this probelm research in alternatives grew rapidly over the last 15 years. Screcaps have been use in Australia for several decades with some experimenting with them for over 30 years. The wines in the experiment IIRC were Clare Valley rieslings. Of the synthetics it appears that extruded do a better job than molded as a closure. Wines with molded should be consumed within 3 years of the vintage date period. 95-99% of the wines made in the world are meant to be drunk within this time frame. Producers who make age worthy wines thta will improve in the bottle from fine wine regions of the world typically do not use synthetics on their wines. Supremecorq is still developing additional synthetics that may be able to be used for a 5 to 10 year window but I don't believe they are in commercial production yet. So at the end of the day ask what type of closure is used if you can not see it because of the capsule. Rex Hil vs Supremecorq Oh BTW Good Loire SB producers Henri Bourgeois, Pascal Jolivet and Lucien Crochet |
Uh you posted nothing to counter my claim that what the poster said was far too broad...
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They are not called fake. |
Originally Posted by UCBeau
(Post 10971056)
Uh you posted nothing to counter my claim that what the poster said was far too broad...
fake corks can do a fine job long term if they're made correctly, out of inert compounds, but a well designed and constructed one can offer just as good a seal, if not better, than any real cork closure on the market. My comment was directed at the above statement. The fact is they do not do a fine job long term. They let too much oxygen in and the wines will oxidize. There are no synthetics on the market that will do a better job (at the moment) than a natural bark cork. Technical corks fall in line just a little better than synthetics. When it comes down to voting with you wallet and you see a red wine from say a cru bourgeois Bordeaux in the store, one with a synthetic and one with a natural bark cork, which one will you buy? I am not interested in debating semantics but, just providing some real information. |
Originally Posted by violist
(Post 10972954)
I call them fake. This implies no judgment on their efficacy.
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Originally Posted by Awino
(Post 10973022)
...When it comes down to voting with you wallet and you see a red wine from say a cru bourgeois Bordeaux in the store, one with a synthetic and one with a natural bark cork, which one will you buy?
I am not interested in debating semantics but, just providing some real information. The most interesting is 1997 Plumpjack Cab (bottled in 2002 if I recall correctly. $135 per bottle in a screwcap and $125 per bottle with cork. Yes, they charged a $10 premium for a screwcap!!!!! And the bottling sold out (half was in screwcaps and half in cork). So there is potential for screwcap sales even at the very high end, if it is done right. UC Davis has a 20 year closure study underway now. They are comparing wine at 10, 15 and 20 year aging using different types of closures (natural cork, various synthetics and screwcap). No results yet from that study. In Australia some wine has been bottled with non-cork closure for 30 years but no real studies were done. Stories are that some of the wine aged well and some did not (maybe due more to storage conditions and initial wine; the best wine wasn't bottled this way 30 years ago!). Some markets have really accepted the screwcap, even in Europe. For example almost 100% of Swiss white wine is bottled in screwcap now (but it is all drunk within a month of bottling, or so it seems when I visit my Swiss friends). |
Originally Posted by number_6
(Post 10973083)
The real future is in screwcaps. These are slowly shedding their low-cost image and some quite good (and expensive) wines have been bottled in screwcaps.
The most interesting is 1997 Plumpjack Cab (bottled in 2002 if I recall correctly. $135 per bottle in a screwcap and $125 per bottle with cork. Yes, they charged a $10 premium for a screwcap!!!!! And the bottling sold out (half was in screwcaps and half in cork). So there is potential for screwcap sales even at the very high end, if it is done right. UC Davis has a 20 year closure study underway now. They are comparing wine at 10, 15 and 20 year aging using different types of closures (natural cork, various synthetics and screwcap). No results yet from that study. In Australia some wine has been bottled with non-cork closure for 30 years but no real studies were done. Stories are that some of the wine aged well and some did not (maybe due more to storage conditions and initial wine; the best wine wasn't bottled this way 30 years ago!). Some markets have really accepted the screwcap, even in Europe. For example almost 100% of Swiss white wine is bottled in screwcap now (but it is all drunk within a month of bottling, or so it seems when I visit my Swiss friends). The issue, which is not cleary understood, is how does no O2 penetration through the closure affect the wines ability to develop tertiary flavors over time. What they have found is that under screwcap some of the wines deveolped reduced aromas ( think H2S categories of smells). The ongoing R & D with screwcaps is to allow the winemaker to dial in the aount O2 the winemaker feels he needs for the wine to develop. The other issue is winem,kers need to adust the level of SO2 the add at bottling. |
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