How to learn about wine?
Apr 27, 2018, 8:59 pm
#61
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Join a "wine club" (or several) that organizes wine tastings and/or wine dinners; these are often offered at reasonable prices by wine stores. Look also for restaurant (or private club) tastings, classes and wine dinner series offerings. Try to find a compatible group of people who are at approximately your level of knowledge. You don't want to keep retaking the "wine 101" class if you're beyond that level, nor do you want to become overwhelmed too soon by self-proclaimed experts.
Get yourself onto an email list for announcements of classes and other wine events in your area. Some newspapers publish a weekly list too. There might be a website for your area, but it's likely to be run by an entity that organizes such events as a business. IMO the national website resources are at best useless. Wine tastings for charity can be fun too, but again you need to find the right group (and cause) for you. Groups such as alumni associations hold wine tastings, typically at irregular intervals. Big cities should have a handful of wine consultants who are willing to organize/teach tastings/classes for small private groups, of course for a big fee.
When you travel, look for local wine (to pair with local cuisine) and ask about it. Visit a few wineries when you have time, even if you're not in a major wine region. Especially in a less popular area or on a less busy day, you can sometimes have a long conversation with the winemaker or tasting room manager and learn a lot, although the folks employed to pour can be clueless.
After you begin to discover the types of wines you like after getting an overview (overtaste?), you might decide to specialize a bit: learn more about French roses this summer, or try to taste Cabernet from every major region that produces it.
When you travel, look for local wine (to pair with local cuisine) and ask about it. Visit a few wineries when you have time, even if you're not in a major wine region. Especially in a less popular area or on a less busy day, you can sometimes have a long conversation with the winemaker or tasting room manager and learn a lot, although the folks employed to pour can be clueless.
After you begin to discover the types of wines you like after getting an overview (overtaste?), you might decide to specialize a bit: learn more about French roses this summer, or try to taste Cabernet from every major region that produces it.
I've seen wine clubs advertised by people who have NO credentials besides "we like wine", which in turn makes me hesitant to sign up.
Are these wines actually any good, or is it being picked out because the club is getting a kick back?
I do agree with going to a local wine bar when travelling though. Great way to be introduced to something new you may not have tried otherwise.
And if you don't like it, relax! It's just a glass of wine.
I'm surprised no one has mentioned Wine Folly, both the book and the blog. Definitely brings wine down to "normal people level". I'm in the restaurant business and am in charge of our wine list, and often still refer to notes found in the book.
Chris
Chris
I used it when I was studying for my CMS exam. I still refer to it as well from time to time, but my main reference source (as well as for the large majority of somms) is Guildsomm.
Some very interesting and insightful comments, thank you iceblueshoes for adding those thoughts.
I find the general discussion here seems to be focused on two things, a desire to describe a whole wine (i.e. its aroma, flavors, acidity, fruit intensity, finish and more all wrapped into one evaluation of good vs. bad, like vs. dislike).
The thing I like about the advanced levels of WSET’s study of wine and then into the MW pursuit as well is a consideration of the component parts, the processes, the adherence or divergence from what nature gave, the zillions of opinions on combinations of these factors, etc. It takes wine to a level that puts it on par with music, art, or cooking. For me that combination of wine as a stand-alone item, then in combination with food, and finally as a product of place is what does it for me. The WSET tasting method allows wines to be compared across regions and times. This is important if we are to understand wines in context. I believe this also enables us to make better pairing decisions and cellar creation decisions. People that see the description of wine as tasting of crushed strawberries, or as having a hint of nail varnish as being described with jargon are just being absurd in the criticism of the language used to describe wine. I agree going further into pH levels and effects of different soils and rootstocks on the acidity of wine is a bit much, but surely everyday words should be able to applied without people getting skittish. Imagine not being able to describe the yeasty characteristics of champagne without using a freshly baked piece of bread product as simile. I did not need to study at all to see how that brought to mind a picture or reference point that allowed me to understand a component flavor of many champagnes.
There really is some very good advice here in this thread by people who have discovered a passion for wine. Each consumer will be different in what appeals to them., I encourage above all to simply try and try again. When these memories become the basis for purchase decisions, then maybe take it a step further. The one secret I can share is that the more you know, when you really have a good database in your head, and end up somewhere that a bottle of something from a grape you have not tried is offered, you will likely jump at that chance, not because you know, but because you do not know yet.
I find the general discussion here seems to be focused on two things, a desire to describe a whole wine (i.e. its aroma, flavors, acidity, fruit intensity, finish and more all wrapped into one evaluation of good vs. bad, like vs. dislike).
The thing I like about the advanced levels of WSET’s study of wine and then into the MW pursuit as well is a consideration of the component parts, the processes, the adherence or divergence from what nature gave, the zillions of opinions on combinations of these factors, etc. It takes wine to a level that puts it on par with music, art, or cooking. For me that combination of wine as a stand-alone item, then in combination with food, and finally as a product of place is what does it for me. The WSET tasting method allows wines to be compared across regions and times. This is important if we are to understand wines in context. I believe this also enables us to make better pairing decisions and cellar creation decisions. People that see the description of wine as tasting of crushed strawberries, or as having a hint of nail varnish as being described with jargon are just being absurd in the criticism of the language used to describe wine. I agree going further into pH levels and effects of different soils and rootstocks on the acidity of wine is a bit much, but surely everyday words should be able to applied without people getting skittish. Imagine not being able to describe the yeasty characteristics of champagne without using a freshly baked piece of bread product as simile. I did not need to study at all to see how that brought to mind a picture or reference point that allowed me to understand a component flavor of many champagnes.
There really is some very good advice here in this thread by people who have discovered a passion for wine. Each consumer will be different in what appeals to them., I encourage above all to simply try and try again. When these memories become the basis for purchase decisions, then maybe take it a step further. The one secret I can share is that the more you know, when you really have a good database in your head, and end up somewhere that a bottle of something from a grape you have not tried is offered, you will likely jump at that chance, not because you know, but because you do not know yet.
I would just add to keep an open mind. You miss out on a lot if all you do is pick Pinot Grigio or try to be a Bay Street (Wall Street for you Americans) banker that only drinks high end Napa Cab because a publication tell you it's 90000 billion points. Of course, I'd rather drink Napa Cab out of those 2.
There is so much misinformation out there it makes you shake your head.
Here's an easy example: tannins. "I'm allergic to tannin."
I hear this often when people are giving wine samples, to which my response is "can you eat grapes?" If yes "do you eat the skin?". If yes, then you're not allergic tannin.
Tannin is a sensation, not a chemical compound.
Another one is "allergic to sulphites" or "I get bad headaches when I drink red wine so it means I'm allergic to sulphites"
Easy solution. Drink better wines with no added sugars (often sweetened on lower end wines to cover up faults), or "try switching to organic wines".
Drink more water so you don't get too dehydrated.
Or lastly,"can you eat raising, prunes, etc. and feel fine." If yes, then you're not allergic to sulphites as dried out fruits have more sulphites which naturally occur in the trying process than a wine.
If no, get an allergy test. A small portion of the population can't drink, but like "gluten free" stop trying to be trendy.
Don't get me started on low calorie wine though...
Apr 29, 2018, 6:44 am
#62
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Apr 29, 2018, 7:42 am
#63
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One of my instructors would say "it's a neutral white wine that doesn't taste like wine or really taste like much of anything. Why not just order a cocktail or a beer?"
With that being said, PG was a PAIN when doing blinds and trying to get ready for my exams since their is almost nothing to go off of. There are some decent PG out there, but yes, they are by far and few in the minority and not the "house wine" at a North American restaurant.
Apr 29, 2018, 11:06 pm
#64
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LOL and I agree.
One of my instructors would say "it's a neutral white wine that doesn't taste like wine or really taste like much of anything. Why not just order a cocktail or a beer?"
With that being said, PG was a PAIN when doing blinds and trying to get ready for my exams since their is almost nothing to go off of. There are some decent PG out there, but yes, they are by far and few in the minority and not the "house wine" at a North American restaurant.
One of my instructors would say "it's a neutral white wine that doesn't taste like wine or really taste like much of anything. Why not just order a cocktail or a beer?"
With that being said, PG was a PAIN when doing blinds and trying to get ready for my exams since their is almost nothing to go off of. There are some decent PG out there, but yes, they are by far and few in the minority and not the "house wine" at a North American restaurant.
Apr 30, 2018, 8:25 pm
#65
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The Alsace versions are far more enjoyable than the Oregonian stuff. The Italian ones always please me in the early part of a meal or in the late afternoon sunshine. I think Japan takes the cake on insipid flavor profile-less wine with Koshu. I won't even let it be served at my table. Blech! And the faux patriotism based exclamations of joy from locals when they drink it, yowza.
Sorry, I meant Pinot Grigio prior, not Pinot Gris. Similar in name but not the same in the glass.
One is actually enjoyable
Apr 30, 2018, 9:23 pm
#67
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Mass-imported pinot grigio for the poolside palate, sure. I don't discount pretty much any grape with a vintner who knows what s/he's doing.
Apr 30, 2018, 9:25 pm
#68
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- tell me you don't' take some of that fine stuff, add some cassis and fizzy water and tell your neighbo(u)rs you're serving Kir Royale!
Apr 30, 2018, 9:34 pm
#69
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You're welcome!
I would just add to keep an open mind. You miss out on a lot if all you do is pick Pinot Grigio or try to be a Bay Street (Wall Street for you Americans) banker that only drinks high end Napa Cab because a publication tell you it's 90000 billion points. Of course, I'd rather drink Napa Cab out of those 2.
There is so much misinformation out there it makes you shake your head.
Here's an easy example: tannins. "I'm allergic to tannin."
I hear this often when people are giving wine samples, to which my response is "can you eat grapes?" If yes "do you eat the skin?". If yes, then you're not allergic tannin.
Tannin is a sensation, not a chemical compound.
Another one is "allergic to sulphites" or "I get bad headaches when I drink red wine so it means I'm allergic to sulphites"
Easy solution. Drink better wines with no added sugars (often sweetened on lower end wines to cover up faults), or "try switching to organic wines".
Drink more water so you don't get too dehydrated.
Or lastly,"can you eat raising, prunes, etc. and feel fine." If yes, then you're not allergic to sulphites as dried out fruits have more sulphites which naturally occur in the trying process than a wine.
If no, get an allergy test. A small portion of the population can't drink, but like "gluten free" stop trying to be trendy.
I would just add to keep an open mind. You miss out on a lot if all you do is pick Pinot Grigio or try to be a Bay Street (Wall Street for you Americans) banker that only drinks high end Napa Cab because a publication tell you it's 90000 billion points. Of course, I'd rather drink Napa Cab out of those 2.
There is so much misinformation out there it makes you shake your head.
Here's an easy example: tannins. "I'm allergic to tannin."
I hear this often when people are giving wine samples, to which my response is "can you eat grapes?" If yes "do you eat the skin?". If yes, then you're not allergic tannin.
Tannin is a sensation, not a chemical compound.
Another one is "allergic to sulphites" or "I get bad headaches when I drink red wine so it means I'm allergic to sulphites"
Easy solution. Drink better wines with no added sugars (often sweetened on lower end wines to cover up faults), or "try switching to organic wines".
Drink more water so you don't get too dehydrated.
Or lastly,"can you eat raising, prunes, etc. and feel fine." If yes, then you're not allergic to sulphites as dried out fruits have more sulphites which naturally occur in the trying process than a wine.
If no, get an allergy test. A small portion of the population can't drink, but like "gluten free" stop trying to be trendy.
https://www.gpo.gov/fdsys/pkg/CFR-20...-sec24-246.xml
And sure, it's all filtered out. Right.
I don't put it past even some fairly spendy places to manipulate their wines more than yeast and fining.
I can drink a glass of red and my nose starts getting stuffy before I'm done. Or I can drink a couple of bottles over the course of an evening and feel fine ... really really fine
- and no congestion. Just ask MJM
Apr 30, 2018, 10:07 pm
#71
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I think you need to get real about what really might be giving people the headaches, or otherwise poisoning them. Of course, the industry doesn't like to talk about it. I started a "what's in your wine" thread a while back. And here's what is permitted in the USA.
https://www.gpo.gov/fdsys/pkg/CFR-20...-sec24-246.xml
And sure, it's all filtered out. Right.
I don't put it past even some fairly spendy places to manipulate their wines more than yeast and fining.
I can drink a glass of red and my nose starts getting stuffy before I'm done. Or I can drink a couple of bottles over the course of an evening and feel fine ... really really fine - and no congestion. Just ask MJM
https://www.gpo.gov/fdsys/pkg/CFR-20...-sec24-246.xml
And sure, it's all filtered out. Right.
I don't put it past even some fairly spendy places to manipulate their wines more than yeast and fining.
I can drink a glass of red and my nose starts getting stuffy before I'm done. Or I can drink a couple of bottles over the course of an evening and feel fine ... really really fine
- and no congestion. Just ask MJM Tannin is a texture (not an ingredient or chemical) so how can you be allergic to that? it would be like saying you're allergic softness or roughness.
As for sulphites, there is less in a bottle of wine than a dried prune or raisin.
The "allergy" culprit is likely something else.
Out of curiosity though, it it only a certain red? Certain grape varietal? Certain region? Certain country?
I'm not going to say it's, x,y,z because I'm not a wine maker and when it comes to the wine making process I only know the basics, but as a general trend, the industry (well for quality wines) is going towards an organic and sustainable method.
But you're right some add more things, some take out. Acidification and chapitulization come to mind.
Another factor could be the grapes themselves if they're spraying, what and how often.
Apr 30, 2018, 10:19 pm
#72
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I'm not the "right one" to really help people how to learn about wine in a more traditional sense, but I'm trying to help people understand that there can be a myriad of things in it other than the "usual suspects" that make you not feel so good afterward.
Apr 30, 2018, 11:23 pm
#73
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OK, lots of good points on the potential allergy causes, but going to have to call this one out. Tannins are actually a compound and present in the wine. They are introduced a variety of ways, most often through stems or skins. Tannins are not simply a textural sensation.