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-   -   PMU Waitlisted - 777 with 45+ BE Seats Free (https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/delta-skymiles-pre-worldperks-merger/61506-pmu-waitlisted-777-45-seats-free.html)

heckler Jan 26, 04 11:12 am

PMU Waitlisted - 777 with 45+ BE Seats Free
 
I really can understand why people are leaving Skymiles.. really.. medallions in particular.

I am travelling on a FULL FARE Y ticket to NRT from ATL in a month or so. Currently, DL's seat map shows only 5 seats assigned going to Asia and a paltry 3 taken coming back. This means over 45 seats are available in each direction. 45 seats!!

DL always sends me thank you notices for giving them my business, and makes me believe I am a valued customer. Yet, according to their own rules, I cannot currently use a PMU, upgrading a "Y" fare at time of purchase. It's not available, and you'll have to be put into waitlist limbo.

Availability of upgrades? Sure we all know they hold the right to reserve seats for paying passengers. But where does the common sense kick in? If a PM comes along and meets their criteria for using a PMU - with 7/8 of BE free, then why the **ll do I have to be waitlisted...?

DL doesn't get it. Don't advertise a program which doesn't work the way you advertise it. Tell me you won't upgrade the Y fare, or better yet don't even send me any PMUs. More than likely, i'll clear the waitlist - but one has to ask oneself - where does DL greed, versus the desire to keep a good YBM PM begin and end?

Anyone else had any logic defying experiences like this?

Dovster Jan 26, 04 11:18 am

Actually, I had the opposite situation happen last August. I bought an M class ticket TLV-AMS-ATL-FLL-ATL-FCO-TLV. While there are no upgrades from TLV to Europe, all my other segments were upgraded on the spot. Of course, I "bought" the upgrades with miles, so that might be the difference.

Flying_Duck Jan 26, 04 12:46 pm

I have always been able to use all my PMU's for upgrades trans-atlantic, and have never had problems upgrading the flights I wanted at the time of booking. However, I am also almost always able to make my reservation a minimum of 3 months ahead, but on a few occaisions have had 1-2 months.

I have on two occaisions been told I had to waitlist on the domestic portion (or reroute), but in both cases were able to upgrade the otherwise unavailable segment using MSU's as "V" class apparently goes out of a more generous inventory than the "G" class (and as a minimum M-fare - that can still be done at booking). Thus I am going to Barcelona in March on a mix of V, G, and Z classes!!

I have never been able to get a BC award on Delta metal for my two family members occaisonally traveling with me abroad, with the time restrictions I had, however, have always succeeded to do so on a partner awards on AF metal.

As the phone booking most often is quite impersonal I find that going to the CTO can make wonders for breaking through what on the phone has been said to be insurmountable hurdles. Excuding friendliness and leaning over the desk with a sad face IMHO facilitates the CTO agent usually seeing the absurd a the situation (such as Hecklers) and often will take (significant) time to call around and pull whatever strings available to break through the obstackle and get a satisfactory outcome. Thus my recommendation to Heckler is to go to the CTO and try to get upgraded, though I guess it is possible that the ATL-NRT, being the only Delta Metal route to the Far East, may have unique restrictions.

Alpha Golf Jan 26, 04 12:57 pm

Hey,

On a recent DCA-ATL trip, DL wouldn't upgrade me when I checked in 45 minutes before departure even though 8 seats were still open and I was #1 on upgrade list. "Only 30 minutes before the flight, sir."

Their yield management guys must be VERY optimistic.

heckler Jan 26, 04 3:49 pm


<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by Alpha Golf:
Their yield management guys must be VERY optimistic.</font>
It just amazes me that I can't upgrade with a PMU and 45 seats free. DL must realize that giving medallions the capabilities to USE their benefits counts for something.

Delta - if I can't use your pathetic and over-controlled "benefits", then what benefit are they? PM and other medallions are too busy to have to track and fuss around with upgrade lotteries and waitlist roulette. Either we are valued customers or not, period. And by DL's own admission, i'm one of their favourites - travelling primarily on YBM fares.

I would have thought that corporate Wonks would value the yearly income they receive from a happy PM/GM versus one which decides his business is valued at other carriers who play fewer games than DL.. obviously greed and customerv indifference prevail at Virginia Avenue http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/mad.gif

[This message has been edited by heckler (edited Jan 26, 2004).]

andymo99 Jan 26, 04 6:24 pm


<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by Alpha Golf:
Hey,

On a recent DCA-ATL trip, DL wouldn't upgrade me when I checked in 45 minutes before departure even though 8 seats were still open and I was #1 on upgrade list. "Only 30 minutes before the flight, sir."

Their yield management guys must be VERY optimistic.
</font>
A similar situation was pretty annoying recently out of LAS. I was hoping to upgrade at the ticket counter, but was told I'd have to wait for the gate to upgrade me. Unfortunately, the priority line at LAS is only for F class, not for PMs in Y (as it is shared among many airlines and managed by TSA). So I had to wait in the plebe line even though it was quite obvious that I would clear to F by flight time.

Joe Flyer Jan 26, 04 6:35 pm

What days of the week are you flying? I've heard that certain days are so busy that they can fill BE with paying passengers on the ATL-NRT route. Why would Delta give away an upgrade when they know 99% of the time (give or take) they can fill it with people who are willing to pay? Again, this happens only on certain days of the week on this route specifically. I can't comment on other routes, but I live in Tokyo and take DL55/56 fairly often.

heckler Jan 26, 04 6:41 pm

My outbound flight is the saturday ATL-&gt;NRT and the return is a sunday (DL56) flight.. so it is a weekend flight when people are more apt to fly.. but still i'm on full "Y" with a PMU and told to step aside. So what good is the benefit? Has Delta really changed it's tune?? (Not).

As someone eloquently said on here once, "Raw sewage does not a fruit salad make.."

runningshoes Jan 26, 04 6:57 pm

I'm with Joe on this one - this is absolutely the toughest DL route to upgrade, and weekend flights are the worst. My bet is if you change your schedule to midweek, the upgrades will open up, but you're also VERY likely to find yourself in the back on your current schedule. I'm on the same route in a couple of weeks and got the upgrades by not flying on the weekend.

Just out of curiuosity why are you on a full Y fare? At that rate (probably over $1,600) you can buy a Biz class ticket on Korean and not worry about upgrades.

jimrpa Jan 26, 04 7:00 pm

If Delta has a reasonable expectation that they can sell a BE seat for full-price, why shouldn't they try to do so before using it as an award seat. Is it possible that you're trying to travel on peak days AND during a peak season (such as spring)?

By the way, I've used PMUs several times (including ATL-NRT) and have never had any problems. A couple of times, I had to play with dates a little, but the folks on the phone were very nice and accomodating. Sadly, I won't be earning any more PMUs to use in the near future.

the scribbler Jan 26, 04 7:25 pm

While I sympathize with your frustrations, it seems perfectly reasonable to me that on the peak travel days (in both directions) DL can sell 95%+ of J at full freight out of ATL. All that means is that 49-52 people in the southeast region (no better option than to connect through ATL, if they are not already based there) have companies that are sending them to Tokyo and can/will pay full boat. I will go ahead and say that many of these people may not even be top-tier Medallions, though these days one earns FO on one full J RT.

Full Y: $5,743.52

Full J: $7,772.52

If you get stuck in coach this might be the most expensive $2K your company "saves".

CoMooter Jan 26, 04 7:38 pm

Remember the 24 hour rule, if Heckler doesn't clear he won't get a B/F seat at checkin or the gate even if there are 'empty' seats when he checks in.

Shoulda flown UA or AA or NW or CO...at least they will clear Int'l at the gate if the good seats are empty (unless someone is bending rules for non-rev's at the expense of paying pax.)

heckler Jan 26, 04 7:44 pm


<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by runningshoes:
Just out of curiuosity why are you on a full Y fare? At that rate (probably over $1,600) you can buy a Biz class ticket on Korean and not worry about upgrades.</font>
It's a government fare, still a "Y" (and considered "Y" for upgrade purposes), but doesn't cost the Government the full Y price.

I guess i'll just put my roulette ball into the Delta upgrade wheel and see if black comes up...


Flying_Duck Jan 26, 04 8:38 pm


<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by runningshoes:


Just out of curiuosity why are you on a full Y fare? At that rate (probably over $1,600) you can buy a Biz class ticket on Korean and not worry about upgrades.
</font>
Maybe Heckler wanted to make sure he Returned in a seat! http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/wink.gif

akhullar Jan 27, 04 3:36 am


<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by heckler:
It's a government fare, still a "Y" (and considered "Y" for upgrade purposes), but doesn't cost the Government the full Y price.
.....

</font>
Ah! What is the 'gummint fare for ATL-NRT ? What are the restrictions ? Some of those fares are considered non-published.


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