"fastbreak" service MSY-ATL
Jan 11, 2003, 3:57 pm
#1
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"fastbreak" service MSY-ATL
I cashed in some miles and was flying MSY-ATL. What the heck is up with "Fast-break" on a 90 minute flight ???
Are employees upset with DL and/or the customers and wanting to work a little less? (First set of nearly rude FA's I've seen on DL in a very, very long time.)
-or-
Has Coke gotten too expensive for the vactioning low-paying (or no-paying) pax??
Geez, even SWA gives you beverage service. Have I missed a new round of cost saving implimentations?
edited because, as you already know, I'm a lousey typist.
[This message has been edited by theDeltaFlyer (edited 01-11-2003).]
Are employees upset with DL and/or the customers and wanting to work a little less? (First set of nearly rude FA's I've seen on DL in a very, very long time.)
-or-
Has Coke gotten too expensive for the vactioning low-paying (or no-paying) pax??
Geez, even SWA gives you beverage service. Have I missed a new round of cost saving implimentations?
edited because, as you already know, I'm a lousey typist.
[This message has been edited by theDeltaFlyer (edited 01-11-2003).]
Jan 11, 2003, 5:21 pm
#2
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: The Villages, FL, USA
Posts: 649
Due to a the reduction in staffing on various aircraft (NOT lazy or angry employees) Fast Break services are now on flights of up to 450 miles.
FAs can't just decide "I'm feeling lazy today - I'll just do a Fast Break." These flights DO require special catering. We've been told Fast Break services are more expensive to Delta than a beverage service.
Many Delta flights are now staffed with FAA minimums - that's 1 FA per 50 passengers.
FAs can't just decide "I'm feeling lazy today - I'll just do a Fast Break." These flights DO require special catering. We've been told Fast Break services are more expensive to Delta than a beverage service.
Many Delta flights are now staffed with FAA minimums - that's 1 FA per 50 passengers.
Jan 11, 2003, 5:39 pm
#3
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OK, then why was the ATL-MLB randomly "fast-break" last year?? Same number of FA's, yet the usually full MD-88's had fast break on some mornings and not on others. Same thing was true for the evening, though less so.
Mid-day was never fast-break, but the flights were still full. Strikes of tired more than overworked FA's. (Lazy ... that comment came out because of the also included rudeness and is not meant as an indictment of any other fast-break I've ever had.)
But the number of pax vs. FA's seems an inconsistant reason at best.
I mean no disrespect ... as just about every DL flight has an awesome FA crew (NW, on the other hand, could be called "Grumpy Airlines" based on the attitude I've experienced in some dozen flights over the last three months). It just seems odd that fastbreak and borderline rude FA's coincided on that ATL-MSY run.
The catering part makes sense ... but the reasoning for doing fast-break doesn't. At least I have a hard time understanding the seeming randomness of it.
Besides, if SWA can give out Cokes and make money ...
I was especially irritated about the comment that one FA made to another about my bringing fixin's to make sandwiches for the family during the flight. Since in a previous world I would have actually been fed something on this flight, I decided to bring it myself. I did offer to share the chips or cookies with them ... more out of spite because of the comment I heard than out of true generosity ... but I'll settle up that lack of true charity with the big-guy on my own time. The harumph response was not expected, however. Not even so much as a 'no-thanks'. But I digress ...
If fast-break was a consistant policy, I'd know what to expect. I'll see what happens on my next flight through CVG (less than 450 miles for one leg - coach award ticket) and post back the results. My bet is more randomness. And in the interest of full disclosure ... I hate the cran-apple. I could tolerate the lemon crud if I could buy a JD to 'Lynchburg' it.
Mid-day was never fast-break, but the flights were still full. Strikes of tired more than overworked FA's. (Lazy ... that comment came out because of the also included rudeness and is not meant as an indictment of any other fast-break I've ever had.)
But the number of pax vs. FA's seems an inconsistant reason at best.
I mean no disrespect ... as just about every DL flight has an awesome FA crew (NW, on the other hand, could be called "Grumpy Airlines" based on the attitude I've experienced in some dozen flights over the last three months). It just seems odd that fastbreak and borderline rude FA's coincided on that ATL-MSY run.
The catering part makes sense ... but the reasoning for doing fast-break doesn't. At least I have a hard time understanding the seeming randomness of it.
Besides, if SWA can give out Cokes and make money ...
I was especially irritated about the comment that one FA made to another about my bringing fixin's to make sandwiches for the family during the flight. Since in a previous world I would have actually been fed something on this flight, I decided to bring it myself. I did offer to share the chips or cookies with them ... more out of spite because of the comment I heard than out of true generosity ... but I'll settle up that lack of true charity with the big-guy on my own time. The harumph response was not expected, however. Not even so much as a 'no-thanks'. But I digress ...
If fast-break was a consistant policy, I'd know what to expect. I'll see what happens on my next flight through CVG (less than 450 miles for one leg - coach award ticket) and post back the results. My bet is more randomness. And in the interest of full disclosure ... I hate the cran-apple. I could tolerate the lemon crud if I could buy a JD to 'Lynchburg' it.
Jan 11, 2003, 5:51 pm
#4
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AA LAS-LAX. 39 minutes, full beverage service. AA ORD-SDF. 55 minutes, full beverage service..... Many more examples exist...
I still love the DL FAs. But management is cutting and cutting and cutting...
I still love the DL FAs. But management is cutting and cutting and cutting...
Jan 11, 2003, 5:52 pm
#5
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But FoPAA said it was more expensive ... and they won't take money for drinks !!
Jan 11, 2003, 6:51 pm
#6
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: The Villages, FL, USA
Posts: 649
1. The increase of miles for Fast Break from 250 to 450 took place Jan. 1, 2003. I was just waiting for FlyerTalk fliers to be made aware of how many more flights will be Fast Break, as I know how well-loved this service is! And I should have made myself clearer - the supplies are more expensive for Fast Break - but removing 1 FA reduces total costs.
2. Each flight is supposed to be either Fast Break or beverage service, based on its mileage (not flight times), so we wouldn't be able to say "There are only 3 FA's on board, we're doing Fast Break."
3. I don't know why ATL/MLB was so inconsistent. The only reason I can think of is occasionally Catering might be out of Fast Break supplies; then we're supposed to offer Coke/Sprite/Diet Coke/water or coffee/orange juice/water (this is off the top of my head). The aircraft may come from ATL the previous night and be catered in ATL; I don't think MLB has catering.
3.If a passenger requests a mixed drink, we're ALWAYS supposed to say "Time permitting I'll be happy to get it for you" (or something to that effect)so there is a possibility of getting a JD.
Sorry your crew was so grumpy!
2. Each flight is supposed to be either Fast Break or beverage service, based on its mileage (not flight times), so we wouldn't be able to say "There are only 3 FA's on board, we're doing Fast Break."
3. I don't know why ATL/MLB was so inconsistent. The only reason I can think of is occasionally Catering might be out of Fast Break supplies; then we're supposed to offer Coke/Sprite/Diet Coke/water or coffee/orange juice/water (this is off the top of my head). The aircraft may come from ATL the previous night and be catered in ATL; I don't think MLB has catering.
3.If a passenger requests a mixed drink, we're ALWAYS supposed to say "Time permitting I'll be happy to get it for you" (or something to that effect)so there is a possibility of getting a JD.
Sorry your crew was so grumpy!
Jan 11, 2003, 7:08 pm
#7
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I never really understood the ATL-MLB thing. It was over 250 miles (400+, I think).
An MD-88 seats 142 (14+128) and requires 3 FA's. For the longest time I've only seen 3 FA's on the MD-88's, 2 in back and one up front. That was true for the majority of my MLB-ATL flights, literally hundreds over the years. By the rules you said, none should have been fast-break (over 250 miles). There has never been a correlation on that flight to the number of FA's and the type of service. So what drove the choices?
I don't know enough about the ATL-MSY run to know.
You're right ... MLB provided ice and that's it, as far as I can remember. I never saw them load the F "snack" breakfast so I always assumed it came from ATL the night before and kept refrigerated on-board.
Oh, and the flight crew that day was very friendly over the PA system, as usual.
[This message has been edited by theDeltaFlyer (edited 01-11-2003).]
An MD-88 seats 142 (14+128) and requires 3 FA's. For the longest time I've only seen 3 FA's on the MD-88's, 2 in back and one up front. That was true for the majority of my MLB-ATL flights, literally hundreds over the years. By the rules you said, none should have been fast-break (over 250 miles). There has never been a correlation on that flight to the number of FA's and the type of service. So what drove the choices?
I don't know enough about the ATL-MSY run to know.
You're right ... MLB provided ice and that's it, as far as I can remember. I never saw them load the F "snack" breakfast so I always assumed it came from ATL the night before and kept refrigerated on-board.
Oh, and the flight crew that day was very friendly over the PA system, as usual.
[This message has been edited by theDeltaFlyer (edited 01-11-2003).]
Jan 11, 2003, 8:33 pm
#8
Join Date: Nov 1999
Posts: 3,511
Back in the good old days, it was based on aircraft type, not just mileage.
For example, Tampa to Atlanta (504 miles) was always Fast Break service on the L-1011s and always regular beverage service on the 767s.
I assumed this was likely due to the much larger passenger capacity of the L-1011, but it could have been due to something else specific to the aircraft, such as galley storage room (i.e., the full beverage service carts can't be stowed on the maindeck, but fastbreak carts can, and it would take too long to bring the carts up from the "basement")
It could have time of day, because the 767 flights were almost all the morning flights, and the L1011s flew all the afternoon/evening flights.
I thought the Fast Break service served only the minibottles of water and small cans of juice. I thought they didn't serve Coke and Diet Coke and Sprite because Coca-Cola couldn't provide small cans and it would take too long to open and pour. Did this change? Does Fast Break now include the Coke family of soft drinks?
For example, Tampa to Atlanta (504 miles) was always Fast Break service on the L-1011s and always regular beverage service on the 767s.
I assumed this was likely due to the much larger passenger capacity of the L-1011, but it could have been due to something else specific to the aircraft, such as galley storage room (i.e., the full beverage service carts can't be stowed on the maindeck, but fastbreak carts can, and it would take too long to bring the carts up from the "basement")
It could have time of day, because the 767 flights were almost all the morning flights, and the L1011s flew all the afternoon/evening flights.
I thought the Fast Break service served only the minibottles of water and small cans of juice. I thought they didn't serve Coke and Diet Coke and Sprite because Coca-Cola couldn't provide small cans and it would take too long to open and pour. Did this change? Does Fast Break now include the Coke family of soft drinks?
Jan 11, 2003, 8:53 pm
#9
Join Date: Apr 2002
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Fast Break service is only the bottles; the Cokes, etc. are ONLY if Catering, for some reason, cannot supply juices.
Jan 11, 2003, 10:10 pm
#10
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The FastBreak service would not bother me in the least if they really did serve real juice.
All the FastBreak services I experienced served cranberry-apple drink and lemonade, which are little more than sugared water, and regular water.
If they threw in a bag or two of pretzels along with a bottle of real juice, I would not mind FastBreak, though I do miss catered service.
I would even serve it to myself before I board the airplane a la the old SkyDeli method, if it were offered.
All the FastBreak services I experienced served cranberry-apple drink and lemonade, which are little more than sugared water, and regular water.
If they threw in a bag or two of pretzels along with a bottle of real juice, I would not mind FastBreak, though I do miss catered service.
I would even serve it to myself before I board the airplane a la the old SkyDeli method, if it were offered.
Jan 11, 2003, 10:20 pm
#11
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Well, the inconsistency is not limited to the coach service. I fly Atlanta-Knoxville frequently in F. Granted, it is a short flight, but at 28 minutes it is long enough (in the absence of rough air) to do a first class beverage service.
Sometimes one is done, other times it is completely ignored (and I base this on literally a hundred flights experience over the past four years on this route). This week I flew up Wednesday afternoon and back Thursday afternoon. On Wednesday, no service at all, not even a glance into the cabin by the permanently-seated flight attendant. And the air was perfectly smooth. On Thursday, however, a great flight attendant who provided an expeditious beverage service AND came back through to offer refills (even carrying the wine bottle back with him before asking). This sort of inconsistency happens all the time.
And, guess what? The crew that didn't offer the beverage service was also very detached and distant during the boarding process, skipping over people for the pre-departure drink, not making eye contact, huddling in the galley and chatting during the entire boarding process. The other crew (the good one) offered prompt assistance, snacks before departure and in flight, and was so much more engaging.
I simply think it depends a great deal on the demeanor of the crew. And all of this comes home to roost when the airline is demanding that elite level flyers fork over major increases in dollars beginning next year to purchase those upgrade certificates, under the premise that somehow the "premium" service in F is so much worth the increase. And wondering why so few people buy F anymore. This sort of inconsistent service wears on people over time.
Sometimes one is done, other times it is completely ignored (and I base this on literally a hundred flights experience over the past four years on this route). This week I flew up Wednesday afternoon and back Thursday afternoon. On Wednesday, no service at all, not even a glance into the cabin by the permanently-seated flight attendant. And the air was perfectly smooth. On Thursday, however, a great flight attendant who provided an expeditious beverage service AND came back through to offer refills (even carrying the wine bottle back with him before asking). This sort of inconsistency happens all the time.
And, guess what? The crew that didn't offer the beverage service was also very detached and distant during the boarding process, skipping over people for the pre-departure drink, not making eye contact, huddling in the galley and chatting during the entire boarding process. The other crew (the good one) offered prompt assistance, snacks before departure and in flight, and was so much more engaging.
I simply think it depends a great deal on the demeanor of the crew. And all of this comes home to roost when the airline is demanding that elite level flyers fork over major increases in dollars beginning next year to purchase those upgrade certificates, under the premise that somehow the "premium" service in F is so much worth the increase. And wondering why so few people buy F anymore. This sort of inconsistent service wears on people over time.
Jan 12, 2003, 8:48 am
#12
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<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by Robert Leach:
I simply think it depends a great deal on the demeanor of the crew. And all of this comes home to roost when the airline is demanding that elite level flyers fork over major increases in dollars beginning next year to purchase those upgrade certificates, under the premise that somehow the "premium" service in F is so much worth the increase. And wondering why so few people buy F anymore. This sort of inconsistent service wears on people over time.</font>
I simply think it depends a great deal on the demeanor of the crew. And all of this comes home to roost when the airline is demanding that elite level flyers fork over major increases in dollars beginning next year to purchase those upgrade certificates, under the premise that somehow the "premium" service in F is so much worth the increase. And wondering why so few people buy F anymore. This sort of inconsistent service wears on people over time.</font>
I was on a paid FC flight from atl to pns two weeks ago - sitting in first row - the FAs spent most of the time in the galley gossiping and talking in a negative manner about passengers - unfortunately in very loud voices. I was appalled. I have never experienced this on a delta flight before as the FA's are generally great. The girl sitting next to me was operationally upgraded - she is not a frequent traveler - she was shocked and ask me if it is always like this in FC - also, in regard to FC in general, she stated that it was no different than the back of the plane and why pay extra for it?
Jan 12, 2003, 9:12 am
#13
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<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by Robert Leach:
The crew that didn't offer the beverage service was also very detached and distant during the boarding process, skipping over people for the pre-departure drink, not making eye contact, huddling in the galley and chatting during the entire boarding process. The other crew (the good one) offered prompt assistance, snacks before departure and in flight, and was so much more engaging.
I simply think it depends a great deal on the demeanor of the crew. And all of this comes home to roost when the airline is demanding that elite level flyers fork over major increases in dollars beginning next year to purchase those upgrade certificates, under the premise that somehow the "premium" service in F is so much worth the increase. And wondering why so few people buy F anymore. This sort of inconsistent service wears on people over time.</font>
The crew that didn't offer the beverage service was also very detached and distant during the boarding process, skipping over people for the pre-departure drink, not making eye contact, huddling in the galley and chatting during the entire boarding process. The other crew (the good one) offered prompt assistance, snacks before departure and in flight, and was so much more engaging.
I simply think it depends a great deal on the demeanor of the crew. And all of this comes home to roost when the airline is demanding that elite level flyers fork over major increases in dollars beginning next year to purchase those upgrade certificates, under the premise that somehow the "premium" service in F is so much worth the increase. And wondering why so few people buy F anymore. This sort of inconsistent service wears on people over time.</font>
Jan 12, 2003, 9:14 am
#14
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<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by Donna D:
I was on a comair flight the other day and its the first time we have not even been offered bottles of room temp water. The FA quickly announced "I am here for your safety ... there will be no service on this flight."
</font>
I was on a comair flight the other day and its the first time we have not even been offered bottles of room temp water. The FA quickly announced "I am here for your safety ... there will be no service on this flight."
</font>
Jan 12, 2003, 9:18 am
#15
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<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by Donna D:
I was on a paid FC flight from atl to pns two weeks ago - sitting in first row - the FAs spent most of the time in the galley gossiping and talking in a negative manner about passengers - unfortunately in very loud voices. I was appalled. I have never experienced this on a delta flight before as the FA's are generally great. The girl sitting next to me was operationally upgraded - she is not a frequent traveler - she was shocked and ask me if it is always like this in FC - also, in regard to FC in general, she stated that it was no different than the back of the plane and why pay extra for it?</font>
I was on a paid FC flight from atl to pns two weeks ago - sitting in first row - the FAs spent most of the time in the galley gossiping and talking in a negative manner about passengers - unfortunately in very loud voices. I was appalled. I have never experienced this on a delta flight before as the FA's are generally great. The girl sitting next to me was operationally upgraded - she is not a frequent traveler - she was shocked and ask me if it is always like this in FC - also, in regard to FC in general, she stated that it was no different than the back of the plane and why pay extra for it?</font>
The operationally upgraded lady had a very valid point. FC, if it is to mean anything, must mean something.
DL's coach product really suffers, IMHO. I was on a CO flight recently in which the flight attendants made THREE passes through the cabin offering service. On DL, it's one pass through as soon as possible after takeoff and that's about it.
Once, while on a lengthly ground hold, there was no service. Finally two passengers (guys in Harley attire) commandeered the drink cart and began serving drinks. The lead flight attendant complained to the captain who sided with the Harley guys.