CAPS-II ...yet another anti-passenger Delta Move?

 
Old Feb 28, 03, 1:44 pm
  #1  
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Original Poster
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: FLL/LAX/YYZ/TPE
Programs: CO Platinum 1K, United 1K, SPG LT Platinum, National Executive Elite, Platinum TSA Hater
Posts: 33,697
CAPS-II ...yet another anti-passenger Delta Move?

With a CNN poll just released on Headline News showing respondents 85/15 AGAINST CAPS-II, and the majority of people actually recognizing this atrocity as an unwarranted invasion of privacy, isnt it interesting that the first company to roll this out is Delta.

After making such an effort to anger and alientate the "small percentage" of Medallion users with the program changes, now they want to anger and alienate the balance of their customers by actively profiling them.

Has everyone at Delta lost their minds? If the majority of the population is against the program, and given many will not fly because of it...why stick your neck out to adopt such a controversial new program?

It almost seems like "anti-marketing 101". If I was a Delta customer (which I am not any longer ), and against this plan...I would therefore avoid flying DL specifically to avoid the plan. Do they not see the risk of their bookings dropping? Or they expect all the other carriers to run to join them?

I think we can all deduce the three "secret" airports the program is being rolled out at. Obviously, it must be the three places they have a virtual lock on...Atlanta, Cincinatti and Salt Lake City. I would also offer up as alternate candidates, JFK and Ft. Lauderdale.

Does anyone else see this is an incredibly stupid move, from a customer loyalty standpoint?
bocastephen is offline  
Old Feb 28, 03, 1:58 pm
  #2  
 
Join Date: Nov 2001
Location: ATL/DCA
Posts: 57
<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by bocastephen:
After making such an effort to anger and alientate the "small percentage" of Medallion users with the program changes, now they want to anger and alienate the balance of their customers by actively profiling them.</font>

I'm not sure exactly how it came to be that Delta would be the airline testing this program, but according to the NY Times:

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2"> The system, ordered by Congress after the Sept. 11 attacks, will gather much more information on passengers than has been done previously. Delta will try it out at three undisclosed airports, and a comprehensive system could be in place by the end of the year.</font>
So it looks like this is probably going to all airlines in the future. With all due respect, I don't think Delta is the entity that should be attacked for this.


[This message has been edited by DeltaATL (edited 02-28-2003).]
DeltaATL is offline  
Old Feb 28, 03, 2:00 pm
  #3  
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: AUS DL GM MM, HH LTD
Posts: 1,836
There is already another thread on this.

Program mandated by Congress. Delta at three airports just test sites. Supposed to be nationwide by later this year for all airlines. I, personally, don't see that Delta is trying to screw us. Take up your beef in DC.

marc
Marq is offline  
Old Feb 28, 03, 2:12 pm
  #4  
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Original Poster
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: FLL/LAX/YYZ/TPE
Programs: CO Platinum 1K, United 1K, SPG LT Platinum, National Executive Elite, Platinum TSA Hater
Posts: 33,697
Just to clarify my post....I did not mean to attack Delta for this program. This program is not their creation, or their fault. I also realize it might be systemwide for all airlines within a few months.

However, my question was, why didnt Delta resist or refuse to be the first test subject for the program...given revenues and bookings are already precarious, and war looming to make things worse, why volunteer for something that will make business and customer satisfaction even harder? If I was DL management, I would have told the TSA to bugger off and find another volunteer. What could the Government have offered DL as compensation to be the first...or what could they have coerced them with?

My question simply related to the judgement of DL management in being the first, and cooperating so easily with a program bound to anger the majority of customers.
bocastephen is offline  
Old Feb 28, 03, 2:26 pm
  #5  
 
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: ATL, PM
Posts: 440
Nice backpedaling.


[This message has been edited by BertBamboo (edited 02-28-2003).]
BertBamboo is offline  
Old Feb 28, 03, 9:49 pm
  #6  
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Original Poster
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: FLL/LAX/YYZ/TPE
Programs: CO Platinum 1K, United 1K, SPG LT Platinum, National Executive Elite, Platinum TSA Hater
Posts: 33,697
Ummm, thanks Bert...

not backpedalling...just clarifying. I was not attacking DL for creating CAPS-II, I was challenging their judgement for enthusiastically rolling out such a customer-hostile program in light of an existing soft market.

I think my concern and question is valid...it does not appear to make sense to run with this hot potato, when the overwhelming majority of your potential customer base thinks it's a bad idea.

Just curious...does anyone in this forum who is still a regular, loyal DL customer, welcome CAPS-II and welcome the prospect of being profiled in this way?
bocastephen is offline  
Old Feb 28, 03, 9:55 pm
  #7  
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: AUS DL GM MM, HH LTD
Posts: 1,836
Me!

I want a smart traveler card too.

This is blown out of porportion. All of the data that they are supposedly using is already in govt databases. I just wish they were allowed to take race, religion, and nationality into account.

marc
Marq is offline  
Old Mar 1, 03, 12:00 am
  #8  
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Buckhead (upgraded from Dunwoody)
Posts: 370
I too am all for this... and more. This really isn't a "hot potato" issue as someone called it. You can get a poll to show anything, including that people are against this. This will make security lines faster for the sky warriors.
FrequencyFlyer is offline  
Old Mar 1, 03, 9:26 am
  #9  
 
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: ATL, PM
Posts: 440
I like it. More secure and faster.
BertBamboo is offline  
Old Mar 1, 03, 9:45 am
  #10  
Moderator: Travel Bidding forum
 
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: Suwanee,Ga ,usa
Posts: 3,613
I'm not a great fan of "more government".I can see merits in some kind of profiling,but I'm worried about the long term effects as "Big Brother" potentially misuses this.
As far as Delta being first,someone had to.
jabez is offline  
Old Mar 1, 03, 9:48 am
  #11  
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Shanwick
Posts: 3,117
I'm for increased profiling and I'm still flying Delta.

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by Marq:
I just wish they were allowed to take race, religion, and nationality into account.

marc
</font>
Nationaility in the form of "Passport Country of Issue" is a factor. Wouldn't be surprised if the system assigned a weighting to names too.

At the end of the day it is what they *do* with information that matters. The security team at CDG picked up the shoebomber the day before he was allowed to board and also flagged him the day he did board - yet he was allowed to board ......
CelticFlyer is offline  
Old Mar 1, 03, 10:44 am
  #12  
 
Join Date: Dec 2000
Location: MA
Programs: DL DM/2MM Marriott Platinum, HH Diamond,
Posts: 8,470
Everything that TSA is doing is superfluous... the only aspects of increased security that actually matter are stronger cockpit doors that stay locked even if there is an atempted hijacking going on behind them.
RobertS975 is offline  
Old Mar 1, 03, 11:38 am
  #13  
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: AUS DL GM MM, HH LTD
Posts: 1,836
Robert:

I agree. The cockpit doors along with changes in ROE are what matter. Planeside screening is ridiculous. At the security checkpoints, it is getting bad that they are telling pax to take off shoes etc. What they are doing to, most times needlessly, the wait time is useless.

marc
Marq is offline  
Old Mar 1, 03, 1:26 pm
  #14  
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Shanwick
Posts: 3,117
<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by RobertS975:
Everything that TSA is doing is superfluous... the only aspects of increased security that actually matter are stronger cockpit doors that stay locked even if there is an atempted hijacking going on behind them.</font>
This assumes that another attack would seek to take control of the aircraft. If the attacker is willing to die there are many other options.

And some of those "secure" doors aren't everything they might be.



[This message has been edited by CelticFlyer (edited 03-01-2003).]
CelticFlyer is offline  
Old Mar 1, 03, 1:40 pm
  #15  
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Buckhead (upgraded from Dunwoody)
Posts: 370
<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by jabez:
but I'm worried about the long term effects as "Big Brother" potentially misuses this.</font>
It is too late to worry about Big Brother, he is already here. Should we now be worried about Big Sister, Big Momma, and Big Daddy? Seriuosly folks, there will always be some sort of oversight in your life. Live with it or live on another planet.

FrequencyFlyer is offline  

Thread Tools
Search this Thread