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Aug 1, 2002, 8:24 am

#31

B747-437B

Join Date: Aug 2000

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Quote:

Originally posted by BizJet:
Can someone fill me in on this little story?

Alaska announced amid great fanfare the launch of the first ever international service from SNA, with daily operation to YVR. Their first flight operated as planned, until the US Government notified them that SNA is NOT an international airport and hence they could not operate internationally from there. It appears that someone at Alaska's route planning department had inadvertently missed out that *minor* detail.

Full details from the Alaska Employee Website.

Aug 1, 2002, 10:11 am

#32

BER Flyer

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What would happen if BermudaII would be lifted? At least a dozen ( maybe a lot more ) intl. airlines would demand slots at LHR, and of course most of them during the rush hour times. Are BA/AA/VS/UA required to give up slots for the competition? Afaik
there are absolute no slots available right now during the "premium" times.

Aug 1, 2002, 12:33 pm

#33

777-232LR

Join Date: Jul 2002

Location: USA

Posts: 610

Quote:

Originally posted by B747-437B:
Alaska announced amid great fanfare the launch of the first ever international service from SNA, with daily operation to YVR. Their first flight operated as planned, until the US Government notified them that SNA is NOT an international airport and hence they could not operate internationally from there. It appears that someone at Alaska's route planning department had inadvertently missed out that *minor* detail.

Out of curiousity, why would this matter? AC flies from Canada to LGA/DCA. Are they the only ones who can pre-clear Canadians for customs? Was it at a time before such protocol was in place? Just wondering.

------------------
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Aug 1, 2002, 12:44 pm

#34

B747-437B

Join Date: Aug 2000

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Quote:

Originally posted by 777-232LR:
Out of curiousity, why would this matter? AC flies from Canada to LGA/DCA. Are they the only ones who can pre-clear Canadians for customs? Was it at a time before such protocol was in place? Just wondering.

The issue isn't as much with arrivals as it is with departures. Both LGA and DCA maintain US Customs presences at the airport, even though there are no non-precleared scheduled arrivals. Technically, all passengers leaving the US are subject to a check (which is rarely if ever enforced) by Customs, which cannot be provided at SNA. Hence, SNA may not be used to launch international services, as it is not classified as an international gateway.

Aug 1, 2002, 12:47 pm

#35

CKDGM

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Quote:

Originally posted by B747-437B:
the US Government notified them that SNA is NOT an international airport and hence they could not operate internationally from there

Note that both DCA and LGA are listed as "Int'l operations: customs landing rights airport" by AirNav.com, though passengers will not see a full blown international arrivals facility at either. This is why they can have pre-cleared Canadian operations even though they're not what most people would see as an "international airport".

Major oops by AS on that one.
[edit: fix ubb typo]

[This message has been edited by CKDGM (edited 08-01-2002).]

Aug 1, 2002, 3:57 pm

#36

hfly

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So technically could IReland flights go into LGA as they also have pre-cleared customs??

Aug 1, 2002, 4:14 pm

#37

B747-437B

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Quote:

Originally posted by hfly:
So technically could IReland flights go into LGA as they also have pre-cleared customs??

Yes. Pre-cleared flights from Ireland could fly into LGA or even DCA for that matter, assuming the airport was physically able to accept them.

Aug 1, 2002, 8:29 pm

#38

hfly

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Would the 75's or 76's be okay?? Or would their fuel load out be too heavy?? I suppose much of the Caribbean would qualify as well then?

Aug 1, 2002, 8:42 pm

#39

B747-437B

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There already are services to the Carribean from LGA, and possibly DCA as well. I know that DL runs LGA-NAS and used to do LGA-BDA at some point. DCA-NAS was on the cards last September, but I don't recall if it actually started.

Both LGA and DCA might be restricted from European ops by their respective perimeter rules though.

Aug 1, 2002, 9:21 pm

#40

CKDGM

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Quote:

Originally posted by hfly:
So technically could IReland flights go into LGA as they also have pre-cleared customs??

Ireland flights only pre-clear immigration--not customs--so no. (At least that's my experience based on DUB-JFK.)

That would also be beyond the LGA distance limit (perimeter rule).

Aug 2, 2002, 12:07 am

#41

pdxer

Join Date: Jun 2002

Posts: 960

Quote:

Originally posted by B747-437B:
I must respectfully insist otherwise. DAL (Dallas Love Field/DALLAS) and HOU (Houston Hobby Field/HOUSTON) are two that immediately come to mind.

MKC includes the airports KMKC (Kansas City Downtown), KOJC (Kansas City Executive), KJCI (Kansas City Industrial) and KMCI (Mid Continent International). Service to London may be operated from any of those gateways, pending approval from the appropriate US authorities.

i must respectfully disagree...i checked a few online databases of airport codes and found that KCK is kansas city metro area, MKC/KMKC is kansas downtown, and mixed results for KJCI/JCI.

http://www.mapping.com/airportcodes.html

lists KCK for kansas city metro area, no listing for JCI or kansas city industrial. it also lists MKC for kansas city downtown.

http://www.airnav.com

KCK was not found (nor other metro codes like NYC)

KJCI was not found.
JCI returns IXD - NEW CENTURY AIRCENTER AIRPORT OLATHE, KS
and looking up IXD in mapping.com shows two listings for that code:
olathe, ks, and allahabad, india.

interstingly, faa.gov had a very very sparse listing of airport codes.

Aug 2, 2002, 9:57 am

#42

B747-437B

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pdxer - you are barking up the wrong tree here buddy, but I'm more than willing to show you the error of your ways.

MKC is the IATA code for Kansas City Metropolitan area.

KMKC is the ICAO code for Kansas City Downtown airport. Similarly KMCI for Mid Continent International, KJCI for Johnson County Industrial (hence JCI) and KOJC for Olathe - Johnson County Executive (hence OJC). All of these are included under the IATA MKC code.

KCK is the IATA code for Fairfax Municipal Airport which is located about 23 miles southeast of MCI.

[This message has been edited by B747-437B (edited 08-02-2002).]

Aug 2, 2002, 10:08 am

#43

Just Passing Thru

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Quote:

Originally posted by B747-437B:
KCK is the IATA code for Fairfax Municipal Airport which is located about 23 miles southeast of MCI.

Incidentally, it is also local Kansas City slang for "Kansas City, Kansas." "KCMO" is local slang for "Kansas City, Missouri."

Aug 2, 2002, 10:09 am

#44

Spiff

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Isn't the airport code for the Dallas area QDF?

Quote:

Aug 2, 2002, 10:16 am

#45

B747-437B

Join Date: Aug 2000

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Quote:

Originally posted by Spiff:
Isn't the airport code for the Dallas area QDF?

Common misconception. QDF is a CRS system "pseudocode" that searches all Metroplex area airports since there is scheduled commercial service at both DAL and DFW. Similarly with QHO and Houston. MKC doesn't need this "pseudocode" because the only scheduled commercial service is into MCI.

In truth, QDF is the IATA code for Conselheiro Lafaiete in Brazil.

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