xracer

I also just made a change to a reservation (with two people on it). Was asked if I wanted to use one of my 'free waivers' and answered yes. We'll see if anything shows up on my credit card bill. I made a number of changes to a previous reservation in late-April / early-May (i guess I am an 'abuser' ), so was expecting them to tell me that I had already used the freebies, but this didn't happen.

GrizShel

Here are key excerpts of their last response - what do you think?

Thank you Delta/Northwest for addressing this issue. If possible, I'd like a specific promise to do your best to make sure that what happened to me will not happen to other Northwest Worldperks Platinum Elites in two respects:

1. It is important to note that there was an inconsistency in the retroactive application of the brand new for 2009 Platinum fee waiver counts; other Worldperks Platinum elites that had to make award ticket changes since late May did not have this (retroactive counting of changes) happen to them, it did happen to me. As you know, evne though you earlier this year set March 1, 2009 as the date for implementation of these new fees for WorldPerks Platinums, you did actually end up delaying the date for which you started counting these award ticket changes until late in May 2009. I was told this was because of technical problems in implementing this online on nwa.com .

2. The charging of two change fees for one change for my itinerary should not happen according to the $50 change fee per reservation language that is used on nwa.com and delta.com . I hope you will take measures to ensure the published policy on this is consistently followed.

My response is that I have made very few changes to award tickets. And, in fact, if this is the primary concern you have, a $25 change fee is quite adequate (this is enough to incentivize me to make as few changes as possible). Better yet, allow free changes for Gold elites up to 1 week prior to the date of travel, Platinums up to 3 days before, and Diamond Medallions up to 1 day before. Furthermore, for elites allow up to 2 free changes up to 3 hours before travel per year. Automatically implement a $100 fee if the ticket is not canceled before travel. Charge a redeposit fee if the member does not ever travel on the booked itinerary.

And so on.

Any suggestions as to what I should write back and tell them?

They made no mention of the fact that my special Platinum award change counter should now be set at 1 used up, not 2 used up. (Oops! Edit to add I guess they're arguing above that the fees are per ticket, not per reservation! Wow! this is not consistent with the per reservation language, or the recent experience of others outlined above). What a mess - the right hand does not even know what the left hand is doing their.

I have a little hope that my constructive feedback might have a little of bit of a positive impact.

fti

I think they have no idea what they are talking about.

It has been made very clear that the "free changes to two reservations" means all passengers in one PNR. This was even clarified earlier in the year by JeffBob on the Delta forum. But each change to the same PNR is considered a new/different change so you don't get unlimited changes to those two PNR's, just changes on two different occasions.

I changed a PNR last month with three passengers. No charge that I am aware of (haven't seen my credit card statement yet).

John

ResSalesGuy

I dont have alot of faith in NWA.COM personnel answers, but I can tell you 100% that any chgs prior to 1Mar dont count towards the 2 free changes.....Its 2 for free regardless of how many people are booked in the same itin...(So use them wisely)...When I change a tkt, a folder is created in the Wperks acct and it documents the useage of a waiver.....After there are 2 documented, then the computer will automatically "pop-up" stating the change fee etc....at that time, the agents dont actually have access to the previous Credit Card....the nbrs are blocked for security...(this is why they are no-longer stored in your personal profiles, other than on nwa.com)....So a CC would need to be provided for the agent to complete the change....

There may still be errors, but that's all they are...Its not some evil plan to screw over Elite members...(at least not that IM aware of)....

Hope that helps clarify things....

ResSalesGuy

2. The charging of two change fees for one change for my itinerary should not happen according to the $50 change fee per reservation language that is used on nwa.com and delta.com . I hope you will take measures to ensure the published policy on this is consistently followed.

The fee applies PP not per itinerary once you have used the WVR's....
The WVR is for the entire party

Jaimito Cartero

The problem is that NWA did not actually implement these changes on March 1st. You were able to make these changes either online or calling up, and no fees were assessed for Plats, until sometime in May. If you are now saying that even though we weren't notified when making the change, that they are counted against our 2 free ones, then that's silly.

I specifically asked NWA Elite line agents about this when changing a ticket. If you can't believe an airlines best agents, who can you believe?

And if you keep up with all the NW threads, the whole reason for these fees is to put more money into DL's pocket. Beancounters are in charge.

The whole DL idea seems to be to take away as many benefits from your elite members who stuck through you during the hell years of strikes, bankruptcy and other nonsense, only to be given a double fisted middle finger from Atlanta.

In fact, this whole Diamond level now, is really what NW Plat's had last year. I flew 140-160k a year with NW/Skyteam for the last couple of years. I have given NW no new revenue this year. I have 15k EQMs from their giveaway, but it's doubtful it will grow from there. You reap what you sow.

ResSalesGuy

My bad...You are correct....1Mar was the new program yr. and the wvrs were implemented around 15May....The waivers dont count till that date....

ResSalesGuy

And if you keep up with all the NW threads, the whole reason for these fees is to put more money into DL's pocket. Beancounters are in charge.

The whole DL idea seems to be to take away as many benefits from your elite members who stuck through you during the hell years of strikes, bankruptcy and other nonsense, only to be given a double fisted middle finger from Atlanta.

In fact, this whole Diamond level now, is really what NW Plat's had last year. I flew 140-160k a year with NW/Skyteam for the last couple of years. I have given NW no new revenue this year. I have 15k EQMs from their giveaway, but it's doubtful it will grow from there. You reap what you sow.[/QUOTE]

I agree 100%....Its the same thing with the Advance bkng fees...Write to them, encourage your friends to do the same...Employees dont like it either...we use miles to book ourselves or families for last minute travel or when we need to be confirmed....WE are stuck with the same fees and BS...

Jaimito Cartero

Oh, trust me, I and other formerly loyal NW folk did write in. Perhaps you've seen some of my 7 flyers? There would be no 2 free changes, or $50 changes without the campaign we did earlier this year.

However, you can only bang your head against the wall so many times, before your head starts hurting.

I truly enjoyed flying NW, and all the great folk who worked there. I was super loyal, and stuck with them through thick and thin, until their "Weasel" email of January 6th, with the doubling of change fees, elimination of Plat free changes, all stuck in the middle of a "Mountain of Miles" promotional email. Not to mention close in fees and other stuff. I only read about 30% of all emails, and am lucky I was bored and in SJU that I read that one.

Onsen

I am a CPA. I used to do the same to our sales and marketing departments in NY when I was the controller. If I were the president and run the show, the company would go bankrupt in no time. The beancounter thinks that a dollar saved is a dollar earned, without considering all the intangible goodwill, rapport, and nurturing loyal customer base since all these cannot be counted. To get a dime from its most loyal customers but lost out all the goodwills and damaging its future business income is really pity of how a once famous Amercian corporate fail. In a few years when Delta goes down to drain, this "suck the Platinum campaign" will be a text book case study for future entrepereur to read. So, Delta is really doing something good for America.

GrizShel

I still intend to write back and offer some constructive criticism, this time they'll know I don't have a monetary incentive (not that this effort is worth the $100 savings considering the amount of time invested in it).

Regarding the wonderful, exciting new award change rules, I've gone back again and looked at the current language on the airline websites, here it is and my comments:

(I assume it is the same language on the NA English site)

Ok, first they say per reservation, then they say per person. This time I thought about this, and perhaps they do mean both are true, i.e., the so-called Plat waivers are indeed per reservation (so use them wisely), but once the change fees kick in, they are indeed $50 per person, even those on the same reservation?

Footnote: And I bet they didn't reset my "waiver counter" to 1 change made like they should have if this is indeed the policy.


And another quote from delta.com:
As you can see, the delta.com language is even less clear on the post waiver per ticket or per reservation issue (unless I missed something?), but would seem to imply that it is per reservation since they also clearly start out saying that the waivers are per reservation.

This is all bull to me anyway. Unlike some (not at all criticizing you) I'm not in the habit of trying to tweak an award ticket once I got it booked - unless it's something like getting family members on the same flights (finally) or medical reasons or the like. So instituting the fees is not going to generate any additional revenue. They are somewhat right in that I'll be a little more reluctant to book an award ticket way ahead of time (but only in some cases, an international business class ticket I'll still grab as soon as I can find it - especially given the horribly inflated mileage charges that prevail with the new multi-tiered system fully in place now). I resent them calling me an abuser of award tickets. What in the heck do they think awards are for anyway?

P.S. - Delta is really clueless on this. Don't they know they could have left well enough alone - and I would have continued to book them virtually ALL the time without even looking at other airline programs? Now they have me and countless other of their frequent flyers (especially those from NW) spending a lot of time looking around at the alternatives, even sometimes booking now on an another airline that they don't evey have any status on?

I don't understand how they consider the stick their customers with as many extra fees as possible policy (and make awards as much a hassle as possible policy) as good for their business in the long run unless they want eventually to be focused on being a low-cost carrier with a largely symbolic award program that is nothing that is going to actually incentivize a customer to fly them more.

mnredfox

Ok, so now my head is spinning with this verbage being posted.

Let's say I have a PNR which I book with two pax on it. Three days later, I change the itinerary. Wham, one waiver burned for that change for two pax.

A week later I want to make another change.

Does this count as waiver #2, or is this one reservation?

My understanding from the PE line is that even if the same PNR, it counts as ANOTHER change and hence waiver #2.

Clarification please?

GrizShel

I think this is the experience that most have had. However, according to the agent that worked on my award, you'd already be up to 4 changes and would have had to pay $100 as a Platinum Elite the second time you called to change the itinerary.

seoulmanjr

DL/NW has just become a completely crappy program for an elite level flyer. Why everyone hasn't returned their "double fisted middle fingers" and gone to the competition at this point is really beyond me. Taking away the two free changes retroactively is just asinine and dishonest.

peace,
~Ben~

ResSalesGuy

2nd change=2nd WVR.....3rd change would be 50$pp...($100 for 2 pax)
On the NW side it seems pretty clear....They should have delayed it for this program yr. since the programming couldnt support it....The confusion all came with the announcement and then not implementing it until May....It confused employees and obviously everyone else....