I have what might be an old pdf chart of multi-airline awards using DL miles. It includes itineraries that do not include flights to/from the US. PM me if you want me to send it to you.

This is DL being plain evil. :td: :mad:

A normal award from EU to ME should be 40k in Y and 80k in C. C awards are hard to come by (the biz cabins are usually full), but you should be able to find Y availability. Good luck!

Sorry to bump up an old thread.

But,wow....I thought it was just me not being able to find an inter-Asia award chart.

I used to be a NWA PE but made the switch to UA ~5yrs ago. I've been burning my NW miles on inter-Asia CZ flights, but haven't done any since the WP/SM merger.

This seems beyond shady.

If Delta were to actually put up an award chart that showed all possible permutations of global award travel (say, like United, AA, CO, etc.) it would just serve to reinforce what a crap program SkyMiles is for international redemptions.

I hope someone who attends the DL love-fest in ATL will call out the SM weasels on this point - it's not an oversight, it's a deliberate act to minimize the low value of Zimbabwe Miles.

lol.

Well actually, the SM mileage levels are not all that bad. In fact, they are, for the most part, fairly competitive.

That is why it's beyound me why does Delta feel so extremely adamanantly that it has to hide the SkyMiles award charts and only publishes 1/12th of the award mileage charts and does not even provide to its own staff the rest. As far as I can see (from checking various routing bookings online), the mileage has not been increased since the merger (other than HNL/ATL/DTW A330s to HNL recently). It is still the same old fairly decent NW mileage levels (after it was increased by DL 1-2 years ago). (Now low award availability, that is another question - but let's not get off topic here.)

The SM mileage levels are actually not all that bad (it's the low award availability that is, for the most part, abysmal), though some are definitely higher than the competition (e.g. anything to S. America). But, Delta still very strongly refuses to disclose that (though nothing has changed), thus making those who printed to PDF the 12 SkyMiles mileage charts from nwa.com the only people to know how much their SM are worth.

To me, at least, this seems rather unethical: blatantly and intentionally refusing to tell customers what their SkyMiles(Pesos/ZimMiles) are worth.

I asked about this very fact earlier this week (thinking that perhaps something has changed in the last ~9 months and now it's published at least internally if not publicly), and was straight out told:
and then when requested that of "Medallion line" rep:
Just a load of total BS (but I feel bad for the CS agent who has to deal with this greatly unethical Dullta nonsense of outright refusing to tell customers what their SMs are worth), as specific "destinations" or changes to such have nothing to do with the SM mileage levels, which are set into 12 zones and are the same to any destination within a zone.

I think Sabai's point is that based on the old NW charts and the charts pretty much every other major airline worldwide publishes, multi-airline awards are not tiered, but all in the lowest tier.

If DL published the chart, anyone researching the site would officially see:

- an ICN-CGK flight on KE would cost 20,000 miles, yet LAX-JFK typically prices out at a mid-tier 40,000.
- Europe to Australia in J would cost 150,000 using partners, whereas US to Australia on DL will likely be 240,000 (mid-tier) or 370,000 (high-tier).

The number of people trying to redeem on partners (which costs DL $ when they pay the partner for the seat) would rise, versus the accounting book entry (higher revenue and greater reduction of their frequent flyer liability) of people redeeming higher mileage levels for DL flights.

Their inability to publish this chart demonstrates a lack of loyalty of Skymiles towards customers outside the US, and is enough reason (of a number) not to credit non-flying miles to DL and to use DL/SkyTeam only when it is the most convenient/cheapest.

Ah, I see what was meant here.

Well then, in a perverse way, it's better for the full award charts not to be published, as if they got published then it would show the higher US49/CA mileage (esp. if one looks at normally available mid and high levels and not the holy grail like virtually unobtainable, mythical lows) and may push Dullta to increase the other mileage levels.

Personally for me it's no problem (at least, not until some mileage levels change, then it'll be harder to keep track of it), as I know the mileage as I have all 12 award charts saved to PDF. It's just the extreme lack of honesty in the program that is worrying. No other airline refuses to publish their award charts online. For everyone else the full award charts are online. Dullta is really "in a class of its own" by being so extremely unethical in its (mis)management of SkyMiles.

(delete - duplicate)

I'm not sure it would push DL to unilaterally increase mileage levels like they have done with their own awards, as these are agreed between airlines. It would mean e.g. Korean would need to do the same for their SkyTeam awards (which, like every other major airline, they publish on their website). To stay competitive with Asiana, ANA, JAL etc., I can't see KE doing that.

It does also show a lack of interest in anyone based outside the US.

Has SMI ever given us the official justification for the lack of an award chart? I remember this issue being raised a zillion times, but don't recall hearing anything.

The awards do not need to be in sync amongst SkyTeam airlines, I believe.

With NW there used to be higher unpublished awards for some routes. For example, if you book the route with NW (connecting via NRT), it's the published rate. But if you book the same route with KE (direct to ICN), it's 20,000/40,000 miles higher (unpublished higher award mileage level).

Delta actually took out these, IMO unfair, unpublished higher rates and though 11/12ths of the award chart are now unpublished, at least now the rates are even for all airlines, and not the published rates for DL and others, while higher rates for some like KE (as used to be the case up to end of Sept, 2009 when WP was still separate - this practice was abolished when WP merged with SM Oct 1, 2009).

So, again, things with DL SM mileage levels wise are not as bad as they seem. On some routes, KE operated flights, actually now booking it through DL/SM it's less than it would have been with NW/WP. But, Dullta, true to being dull to its customers and public perception of it, shoots itself in the foot by not publishing its award charts -- though really it has nothing to be ashamed of there, IMO.

To me it seems like Dullta has a really out-of-touch marketing group with some serious lack of competence issues. Dullta marketing seemingly does everything it can to avoid any type of contact with its customers and goes out of its way to never look at things from a PR or customer perception perspective.

Never any response to it. It has been always absolutely ignored.

But why? That is the one area where really Dullta has nothing to hide and has nothing to be ashamed of.

I disagree with the part I emphasized... I don't think DL pays a partner for an award seat. I think it's more like this: airlines A and B decide to share award inventory. When A releases award seats on a particular flight, members of both A and B FF programs can book those seats. The same goes for the other airline. No money exchanged. These "free" seats are accounted for; they are seats that they don't expect to sell anyway.

I don't know what EVIL reason they have for hiding it, but the excuse the CSR offered to RealHJ is simply pathetic. "This information is
constantly changing due to modifications of our destinations"... SAY WHAT?!?!?! :confused: That's insulting.

There has been lots of useful information posted here by Delta (through SMI & Co.). They monitor this forum and they KNOW we're very annoyed by this, yet they refuse to discuss the "no award chart" issue. :td:

Interesting if true. When Delta makes award inventory available, for that portion redeemed by its own members Delta would debit its FF liability and credit revenue. Under your scenario, Delta wouldn't record any revenue for redemptions from partner FF programs.

They should then also know that it's one of the reasons some people don't credit any non-flying miles to Skymiles and fly DL/SkyTeam only when it's the absolute cheapest or most direct option.