DL continues to weaken operationally (Summer 2022 Meltdown)
#361
Join Date: Jan 2022
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And it was the data for one day, which isn't particularly interesting from a comparison perspective.
You could choose a different day and the data might be different. The region matters, as weather causes flight cancellations, unless you've only presented data for one particular cause. As far as I can tell, you haven't normalized for types of equipment, either.
It may well be that your conclusion is correct, but it's not apparent from what you presented here.
#362
Original Poster
Join Date: May 2011
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Your post said "flights cancelled", not "percentage of flights cancelled".
And it was the data for one day, which isn't particularly interesting from a comparison perspective.
You could choose a different day and the data would be different.
It may well be that your conclusion is correct, but it's not apparent from what you presented here.
And it was the data for one day, which isn't particularly interesting from a comparison perspective.
You could choose a different day and the data would be different.
It may well be that your conclusion is correct, but it's not apparent from what you presented here.
Are you really claiming Delta hasn’t had worse operations than peers in June?
#363
Join Date: Jan 2022
Programs: DL, UA, AA
Posts: 1,996
#364
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: RDU
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#365
Join Date: Jul 2009
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As for the link to Flight aware, one of the tricky things is people in this thread consider regionals to be Delta, and flightaware does not. But yesterday, AA delayed 25% of flights and canceled 2%. Delta delayed 12% and canceled 8%. United delayed 21% and canceled 3%. I don't think a pattern like this shows what you think.
#367
Join Date: Jun 2013
Programs: DL Diamond, UA Premier Gold
Posts: 2,929
What's really incredible is Delta shrunk twice as much as American and United on a percentage basis, shrunk 8x more than Southwest, shrunk 30x more than JetBlue and has the lowest completion factor of the bunch now. Just a stunning failure to plan and execute.
#368
Join Date: Apr 2019
Posts: 14
Its not clear that cancelling versus delays is "worse." Most customers prefer a cancellation over a rolling six hour delay. And cancellations can be easier for the rest of the system.
As for the link to Flight aware, one of the tricky things is people in this thread consider regionals to be Delta, and flightaware does not. But yesterday, AA delayed 25% of flights and canceled 2%. Delta delayed 12% and canceled 8%. United delayed 21% and canceled 3%. I don't think a pattern like this shows what you think.
As for the link to Flight aware, one of the tricky things is people in this thread consider regionals to be Delta, and flightaware does not. But yesterday, AA delayed 25% of flights and canceled 2%. Delta delayed 12% and canceled 8%. United delayed 21% and canceled 3%. I don't think a pattern like this shows what you think.
#369
Join Date: Apr 2019
Posts: 14
Your post said "flights cancelled", not "percentage of flights cancelled".
And it was the data for one day, which isn't particularly interesting from a comparison perspective.
You could choose a different day and the data might be different. The region matters, as weather causes flight cancellations, unless you've only presented data for one particular cause. As far as I can tell, you haven't normalized for types of equipment, either.
It may well be that your conclusion is correct, but it's not apparent from what you presented here.
And it was the data for one day, which isn't particularly interesting from a comparison perspective.
You could choose a different day and the data might be different. The region matters, as weather causes flight cancellations, unless you've only presented data for one particular cause. As far as I can tell, you haven't normalized for types of equipment, either.
It may well be that your conclusion is correct, but it's not apparent from what you presented here.
Also yes, the points you raise are technically and academically correct. In the absence of a perfect dataset (time series, normalized by equipment) I’d argue that a series of point in time snapshots (i.e. this 1-2 month old thread) if sufficient to conclude that DL operations are materially worse than major competitors. Additionally, a Saturday in June with no major weather nationwide a week before the 4th of July long weekend is a decent indicator of how consumers will likely perceive airline performance.
But yes, it is easy to continue to say “show me the data” to defend Delta…
#370
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Washington, DC
Programs: DL PM; IHG PlatAmb; Hilton Dia; Marriott Plat; Hyatt Discoverist
Posts: 7,310
I believe the post does say by percent?
Also yes, the points you raise are technically and academically correct. In the absence of a perfect dataset (time series, normalized by equipment) I’d argue that a series of point in time snapshots (i.e. this 1-2 month old thread) if sufficient to conclude that DL operations are materially worse than major competitors. Additionally, a Saturday in June with no major weather nationwide a week before the 4th of July long weekend is a decent indicator of how consumers will likely perceive airline performance.
But yes, it is easy to continue to say “show me the data” to defend Delta…
Also yes, the points you raise are technically and academically correct. In the absence of a perfect dataset (time series, normalized by equipment) I’d argue that a series of point in time snapshots (i.e. this 1-2 month old thread) if sufficient to conclude that DL operations are materially worse than major competitors. Additionally, a Saturday in June with no major weather nationwide a week before the 4th of July long weekend is a decent indicator of how consumers will likely perceive airline performance.
But yes, it is easy to continue to say “show me the data” to defend Delta…
I'm not sure how this thread could present series in time snapshots. It's a thread where people complain when they feel aggrieved. Not an accurate snapshot of dates in time, and certainly does not control for weather and other things well outside Deltas control.
#371
Join Date: Jan 2006
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I don't know that most customers prefer cancellations. Count me as one that does not. With the load factors where they are all of my cancelled flights have led to rebooking over 24 hours later than my original schedule...I'd much rather take a delay. (Fortunately, all of the trips were for work and I was able to rebook on other airlines to get home sooner.)
#372
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Washington, DC
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Posts: 7,310
I don't know that most customers prefer cancellations. Count me as one that does not. With the load factors where they are all of my cancelled flights have led to rebooking over 24 hours later than my original schedule...I'd much rather take a delay. (Fortunately, all of the trips were for work and I was able to rebook on other airlines to get home sooner.)
#374
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Washington, DC
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Posts: 7,310
#375
Original Poster
Join Date: May 2011
Location: NYC (LGA, JFK), CT
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1) Cancellations are much worse than delays - I generally only fly nonstop, cancellations have led me to have to connect, often in much worse seating given all seats have been allocated beforehand. Plus a cancellation can result in you missing a meeting, having to pay for additional lodging, etc
2) Very consistently, on weekends, Delta has been running in the 6-7% cancel rate. We post this every weekend, JonNYC has something on this today
3) Everyone voicing complaints about this are Delta elite members who have relied on the airline for years. I'm not sure what incentive we would have to try to massage the data to make Delta look worse. Many of us are posting our real time experience with operational weakness and back it up with the flightaware data. Today, Delta has cancelled 6% of its flights versus 2% for American and 1% for United.
2) Very consistently, on weekends, Delta has been running in the 6-7% cancel rate. We post this every weekend, JonNYC has something on this today
3) Everyone voicing complaints about this are Delta elite members who have relied on the airline for years. I'm not sure what incentive we would have to try to massage the data to make Delta look worse. Many of us are posting our real time experience with operational weakness and back it up with the flightaware data. Today, Delta has cancelled 6% of its flights versus 2% for American and 1% for United.