Go Back  FlyerTalk Forums > Miles&Points > Airlines and Mileage Programs > Delta Air Lines | SkyMiles
Reload this Page >

Increased Turbulence Announcements Before Takeoff

Increased Turbulence Announcements Before Takeoff

Old Feb 17, 2020, 3:05 pm
  #16  
 
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: Midwest US
Programs: AA Executive Platinum, Hyatt Globalist , Marriott Plat, Delta Plat
Posts: 59
Originally Posted by cmd320
On many airlines it's not uncommon to have the seatbelt sign off even before 10,000ft if the ride is smooth.

The problem with leaving the sign on constantly is that people then disregard it when there actually is a reason to observe it.

And yes, I was on DL for two flights a little over a week ago and on both there was very little service even in F due to 'weather' as noted by the crew. The reality is that it was really only a light chop for most of the ride and nothing that would really necessitate FAs being in their seats the whole time. I had not problem getting up to use the lav and only on departure and short final was there any kind of notable turbulence.
I just got back from a IAD-FRA leg on Lufthansa; pilots pushed the aircraft while people were still finding seats and situating the bins, and seemed like the gear was barely up before the light came off, and it was with a fair amount of yaw still taking place as the aircraft stabilized. Stayed off the entirety of the flight, even though some moderate turbulence on the northern Canadian border. Yet, nobody got hurt! Miracles I tell you.

Maybe it's a liability thing? Would make sense.
readywhenyouare and cmd320 like this.
RDGCU is offline  
Old Feb 17, 2020, 5:16 pm
  #17  
 
Join Date: May 2011
Programs: Delta Diamond; Marriott Gold Elite
Posts: 162
I've been on an LAX-SYD or SYD-LAX flight where the fasten seatbelt light was on for nearly the entirety of the flight. I don't know if they forgot about it or what but it seemed absurd.

As an American I'm used to this nonsense and know I can ignore it, but in Australia when they put the fast seatbelt light on, you better be seated with your seatbelt on because it's about to get serious! So I'm thinking, there's gotta be more than a handful of people on this flight who think they actually can't get up and use the toilet, get some water, or do any of those things because the seatbelt light is on! It actually seemed very cruel.
SecurityTheaterFanClubPresident is online now  
Old Feb 17, 2020, 5:35 pm
  #18  
Suspended
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: DCA
Programs: UA US CO AA DL FL
Posts: 50,265
It's also liability-limiting. If you choose to disobey a sign (or crew member instruction), DL likely wins a motion to dismiss if you are injured. Can't blame the carriers for this one as those judgments just get factored into the P&L = ticket price.
Often1 is offline  
Old Feb 17, 2020, 5:46 pm
  #19  
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: RDU
Programs: DL DM+(segs)/MM, UA Ag, Hilton DM, Marriott Ti (life Pt), TSA Opt-out Platinum
Posts: 3,201
Originally Posted by Gig103
In my opinion, the seatbelt light has become a mostly superfluous indicator because the pilots leave the light on for such significant amounts of time even in calm air. People (and I admit I'm among them) are up and down while the light is on, and unless the captain has specifically warned of rough air, the FAs aren't stopping passengers from using the lavatory or getting anything from their bags (thankfully). It's sort of like how speed limits in the USA are often far lower than is safe and prudent in good conditions (since they seem to be set based on poor road conditions or for revenue generation) so there is a social contract to stick to within 10mph.
Agreed, U.S. airlines have created seatbelt sign “alarm fatigue”. I’d be willing to bet many (most?) folks no longer even look at the seatbelt sign when they need to get up. Note: I’m not condoning this, just pointing it out.
cmd320 likes this.
HDQDD is offline  
Old Feb 17, 2020, 6:58 pm
  #20  
 
Join Date: Oct 2017
Location: BNA
Programs: DL GM, HH Diamond
Posts: 1,026
Conversely, I find annoying (relatively speaking) all the hullabaloo on a short flight (~30min) that they will try their best to turn it off. I mean all that chattering just to turn it off for 5 minutes... it isn't like there is time to use the lav anyway.
defrosted is offline  
Old Feb 17, 2020, 7:14 pm
  #21  
FlyerTalk Evangelist
 
Join Date: May 2012
Location: MCO
Programs: AA, B6, DL, EK, EY, QR, SQ, UA, Amex Plat, Marriott Tit, HHonors Gold
Posts: 12,809
Originally Posted by defrosted
Conversely, I find annoying (relatively speaking) all the hullabaloo on a short flight (~30min) that they will try their best to turn it off. I mean all that chattering just to turn it off for 5 minutes... it isn't like there is time to use the lav anyway.
I can pee in under 5 minutes.
cmd320 is offline  
Old Feb 17, 2020, 8:35 pm
  #22  
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: SNA
Programs: AA EXP, UA 1K (until it expires then never again), *wood Plat, Marriott Gold
Posts: 9,222
Originally Posted by SSF556
In my travels with Delta recently this seems to be happening more and more. Today #2607 and the captain went on for about 2 minutes how he has asked the FAs to remain seated for about the first 45 minutes of the flight.

Last week I got the same announcement on #1460 . No turbulence and FAs finally got up to serve but no main cabin service.

Is this a trend among Delta flights? Is turbulence becoming the new thing?

There are several websites that report turbulence and todays map looks good.
I've had this happen before, two weeks most recently, and given the flight crew has access to far more details about the ride than I do I'll take their word on it. In my case that crew had just flown that route the opposite direction, and pretty much right when he said we'd hit some major turbulence we did, I had to hold my drink (which the really attentive FA had topped off just before taking his jumpseat) to avoid spilling for several minutes where the ride was very rough. Is it possible that conditions might change or they might get a different route/altitude that ends up making things not as rough as expected but I'd rather the crew make these decisions based on the data they have (which again is far more than some website) and have it end up not being as bad than someone get hurt.
ryan182 is offline  
Old Feb 17, 2020, 8:50 pm
  #23  
 
Join Date: Sep 2016
Location: LAX/BUR, RDU
Programs: DL SM, AAdvantage, SPG
Posts: 1,360
Originally Posted by HDQDD
I'm about 95% sure the meteorological reporting is automated and much of it goes directly to NOSA (the NOAA Observing System Architecture).
Yes, you're right, and aircraft data also automatically goes through NOAA MADIS (Meteorological Assimilation Data Ingest System) to be used by weather models.

I thought pilots could also manually send short text reports of turbulence through ACARS?
FlyerWx is offline  
Old Feb 17, 2020, 9:18 pm
  #24  
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Treasure Coast, FL
Programs: DL Diamond, Marriott LT Plat, HH Diamond, Avis Preferred Plus, National Executive
Posts: 4,577
Originally Posted by Often1
I tend to trust the judgment of trained professionals over my own knowledge of meterorology. I also don't have access to the many "ride reports" which are called or sent in by enroute aircraft and provide up-to-the-minute information about conditions in specific locations.

One doesn't have to do too much searching to find the reports of messy accidents involving injured crew and passengers from sudden and unexpected turbulence.

I'd rather wait 5 minutes for my drink.
The problem is the drink never comes in the name of turbulence that never comes also. Wasn't served twice in F (paid not upgraded) last week where the captain went on about turblence prior to take off and it was barely a light chop for maybe 15% of the flight on one and 20% on the other. SRQ-ATL was one and the other was ATL-TPA.
apodo77 is offline  
Old Feb 17, 2020, 9:39 pm
  #25  
Suspended
 
Join Date: Oct 2019
Location: MSP
Programs: SkyMiles, Global Entry, Non-Rev
Posts: 101
Unfortunately YMMV depending on the particular crew operating the flight. For example I've been on a flight where they said "due to the turbulence there will be no service in any cabin" and there were hardly any bumps. Meanwhile on a recent ATL-MSP flight we had light-moderate turbulence for the entire flight with patches here and there of heavier stuff, the flight was never smooth. Crew still managed to do full drink/meal service up in F, drink of choice in Comfort+, and water back in Y. They managed to get it done during the lighter stuff.

I feel this is a very much "kid who cried wolf" situation where there are times I would expect and hope the crew remain seated for their safety but there are times I feel they use a little patch of turbulence here or there as an excuse not to do any service whatsoever.
gotmilk8 likes this.
FlyDeltaConnection is offline  
Old Feb 17, 2020, 10:14 pm
  #26  
 
Join Date: Feb 2020
Posts: 85
Originally Posted by mot29
One of my peeves on Delta is having the seatbelt sign on for almost the whole of a trans-Atl or Pac flight.
Sometimes needed, maybe, but....
Three weeks ago, on MU flying JFK-PVG the seatbelt sign was on for almost the whole flight, this was on a day when we flew the route eastbound over Greenland and northern Scandinavia and Russia.

​​​​​​​Regarding the JFK-PVG MU flight, I think that's a policy of all Chinese airlines, possibly as a recommendation/policy from the CAAC (Chinese FAA equivalent). Every single flight I've been on with a Chinese airline, the seat belt sign is on the entire flight and just gets toggled when the crew wants people to return to their seats for turbulence.
hpmh is offline  
Old Feb 17, 2020, 11:02 pm
  #27  
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: out my front door 60 min prior to IAH flight until they increased the check in time to 45 min
Programs: CO Platinum or UA 1K for so long, now almost 2MM
Posts: 322
I don’t know about others, but I feel a sense of reassurance when the pilot talks about potential turbulence, like the pilot cares enough to take the time to talk to us.
anc-ord772 likes this.
arisaa is online now  
Old Feb 18, 2020, 8:04 am
  #28  
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: RDU
Programs: DL DM+(segs)/MM, UA Ag, Hilton DM, Marriott Ti (life Pt), TSA Opt-out Platinum
Posts: 3,201
Originally Posted by FlyerWx
Yes, you're right, and aircraft data also automatically goes through NOAA MADIS (Meteorological Assimilation Data Ingest System) to be used by weather models.

I thought pilots could also manually send short text reports of turbulence through ACARS?
They can, PIREPs are still all manual I believe. I think AIRREPs are the more automated ones (from the electronics on the aircraft).
HDQDD is offline  
Old Feb 18, 2020, 11:36 am
  #29  
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: KEWR
Programs: Marriott Platinum
Posts: 780
I recently had a flight to EWR/ZRH where the turbulence forecast over the tracks was horrendous. 3-4 hours of moderate turbulence with no way around it. We briefed the passengers at the gate, before push, and during level off that it was going to be pretty rough for an extended period of time in about 2 hours into the flight.

As we coasted out, our dispatcher sent a report that the lower altitudes (F280-F300) are much better than the planned F350.

Requested lower and ended up flying at F290 where it was nothing worse than light chop here and there the whole way. Meanwhile our iPads kept showing red areas of turbulence nearly the entire ocean crossing. The other airplanes higher were getting beat up pretty bad and unable to descend to get out of it because of traffic like us.

Landed uneventfully in ZRH, after blocking in the three of us debriefed on what a great move that it was to opt to fly lower and adjusting our fuel consumption to make it work out. How this could have been a very long and uncomfortable night if we didnt.

Minutes later as pax were deplaning a Multi-Million Mile passenger approached and accused me of deliberately lying; completely overdoing the turbulence reports to reduce workload for the flight attendants. Im onto your game and rest assured this seat belt sign abuse will be reported to United.

Theres no winning in a situation like that and I just responded Id try to do better next time, sorry about that. I was the one standing by the cockpit door as the other two pilots were packing their things up. They listened to this guys diatribe and I could hear them quietly laughing behind me.

Bottom line, cant win for trying!

We dont keep the seat belt sign on to create issues...honestly. If its bumpier than planned, sorry. If its smoother than reported, sorry. Its also not a conspiracy against your bladders or a means to impede service.
ATOBTTR and hhdl like this.
clubord is offline  
Old Feb 18, 2020, 11:39 am
  #30  
FlyerTalk Evangelist
 
Join Date: May 2012
Location: MCO
Programs: AA, B6, DL, EK, EY, QR, SQ, UA, Amex Plat, Marriott Tit, HHonors Gold
Posts: 12,809
Originally Posted by clubord
I recently had a flight to EWR/ZRH where the turbulence forecast over the tracks was horrendous. 3-4 hours of moderate turbulence with no way around it. We briefed the passengers at the gate, before push, and during level off that it was going to be pretty rough for an extended period of time in about 2 hours into the flight.

As we coasted out, our dispatcher sent a report that the lower altitudes (F280-F300) are much better than the planned F350.

Requested lower and ended up flying at F290 where it was nothing worse than light chop here and there the whole way. Meanwhile our iPads kept showing red areas of turbulence nearly the entire ocean crossing. The other airplanes higher were getting beat up pretty bad and unable to descend to get out of it because of traffic like us.

Landed uneventfully in ZRH, after blocking in the three of us debriefed on what a great move that it was to opt to fly lower and adjusting our fuel consumption to make it work out. How this could have been a very long and uncomfortable night if we didnt.

Minutes later as pax were deplaning a Multi-Million Mile passenger approached and accused me of deliberately lying; completely overdoing the turbulence reports to reduce workload for the flight attendants. Im onto your game and rest assured this seat belt sign abuse will be reported to United.

Theres no winning in a situation like that and I just responded Id try to do better next time, sorry about that. I was the one standing by the cockpit door as the other two pilots were packing their things up. They listened to this guys diatribe and I could hear them quietly laughing behind me.

Bottom line, cant win for trying!

We dont keep the seat belt sign on to create issues...honestly. If its bumpier than planned, sorry. If its smoother than reported, sorry. Its also not a conspiracy against your bladders or a means to impede service.
So after descending to an altitude where it was nothing worse than a light chop the seatbelt sign remained on? Why?
cmd320 is offline  

Thread Tools
Search this Thread

Contact Us - Manage Preferences - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service -

This site is owned, operated, and maintained by MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. Copyright © 2024 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Designated trademarks are the property of their respective owners.