DL 89 Fuel Dump onto School LAX to PVG
Jan 14, 2020, 10:42 pm
#46
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Blue Ridge, GA
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"Media hysterics" is just blame shifting. Injuries were never described as serious or likely to pose lasting complications. Children in a school yard can't disperse all that readily. Frightened parents were legitimately part of the story.
Jan 14, 2020, 11:01 pm
#47
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No its not "blame shifting", no one but the flight crew is to blame for the fuel dump, again you need to have the cognitive ability to separate the action from the response. Headlines like"60 people treated after plane dumps jet fuel near several schools in LA area" (treated == a shower) or "26 Injured After Delta 777 Dumps Fuel On Elementary School" (injured == need a shower) are hyperbole. Also this got heavy coverage on national and cable news not just local channels, national news...I guess I should just be happy there's nothing else in the world of note going on today more pressing than some kids smelled fuel and a few needed a shower ¯\_(ツ)_/¯.
Jan 14, 2020, 11:06 pm
#48
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This has been an interesting discussion, but now it is time to move-on.
Obscure2k
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Obscure2k
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Jan 18, 2020, 6:29 am
#49
Join Date: Feb 2019
Posts: 3,097
Delta PR flack booed at town hall over DL89 fuel dump
https://abc7.com/5860316/
The Federal Aviation Administration released a fact sheet Friday stating that the pilot did not follow proper procedure which requires pilots to alert air traffic control if they plan to dump fuel.
"This is not just a school that they dropped this is on, it's a whole community. On black and brown communities - low income black and brown communities - so this is very upsetting," said one South Los Angeles resident.
Air traffic control twice asked the pilot whether he needed to dump fuel and twice he said no.
"This is not just a school that they dropped this is on, it's a whole community. On black and brown communities - low income black and brown communities - so this is very upsetting," said one South Los Angeles resident.
Air traffic control twice asked the pilot whether he needed to dump fuel and twice he said no.
Jan 18, 2020, 6:30 am
#50
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Good. That captain needs to be canned and have his certificate pulled.
Jan 18, 2020, 6:38 am
#51
Join Date: Feb 2019
Posts: 3,097
There are a few different possibilities here:
1) This really was a critical situation and it was imperative to get the plane on the ground ASAP. If this is the case, why didn't the pilot start the dump sooner?
2) This wasn't that critical - clearly in this case the pilot should have dumped the fuel somewhere else (there are designated areas for this) and at a higher altitude.
3) They thought it was critical at first and then later figured out it wasn't - this scenario doesn't make sense, they would have dumped sooner when they thought it was critical, or proceeded to the dump area when they figured out it wasn't critical.
4) they thought it was non critical at first but then figured out it was critical - this also doesn't make sense because they didn't start the dump until they were on approach for landing.
1) This really was a critical situation and it was imperative to get the plane on the ground ASAP. If this is the case, why didn't the pilot start the dump sooner?
2) This wasn't that critical - clearly in this case the pilot should have dumped the fuel somewhere else (there are designated areas for this) and at a higher altitude.
3) They thought it was critical at first and then later figured out it wasn't - this scenario doesn't make sense, they would have dumped sooner when they thought it was critical, or proceeded to the dump area when they figured out it wasn't critical.
4) they thought it was non critical at first but then figured out it was critical - this also doesn't make sense because they didn't start the dump until they were on approach for landing.
Jan 18, 2020, 7:09 am
#52
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Really, what does race and income level matter in this situation? I submit it would be "upsetting" regardless of the color or income level of the folks getting fuel dumped over their heads. Of all the things (or lack thereof it may seem) going through the pilots mind, I highly doubt those were factors.
Jan 18, 2020, 7:14 am
#53
formerly jackvogt
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Who cares what people had fuel dumped on them? Why did they have to turn it into a race and income thing? These people are obviously very smart because they are definitely looking for a payout from Delta.
Jan 18, 2020, 7:22 am
#54
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Really, what does race and income level matter in this situation? I submit it would be "upsetting" regardless of the color or income level of the folks getting fuel dumped over their heads. Of all the things (or lack thereof it may seem) going through the pilots mind, I highly doubt those were factors.
Jan 18, 2020, 7:27 am
#56
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Controller: OK, so you don't need to hold or dump fuel or anything like that?
Pilot: Ah, negative.
Pilot: Ah, negative.
Jan 18, 2020, 7:33 am
#57
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You know I will say, if, God forbid, the plane had crashed and dumping the fuel had saved hundreds of lives, yet still caused the same problems to those effected by dumping of the fuel would we have found it acceptable?
Don't get me wrong, I am not advocating dumping fuel over residential areas, or seemingly lying about it, I am just curious if the outcome of the emergency (plane didn't crash) changes the reactions to the fuel dump?
Don't get me wrong, I am not advocating dumping fuel over residential areas, or seemingly lying about it, I am just curious if the outcome of the emergency (plane didn't crash) changes the reactions to the fuel dump?
Jan 18, 2020, 7:35 am
#58
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If he's canned, the ATC controller should be canned too. He was using a double negative which was against policy and confusing. Note: I don't think either deserves to be canned with what we know right now.
The "negative" of "don't need to", is that you "need to". Sadly very few outlets are reporting this exchange and that ATC is investigating it internally.
The "negative" of "don't need to", is that you "need to". Sadly very few outlets are reporting this exchange and that ATC is investigating it internally.
Jan 18, 2020, 7:39 am
#59
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Jan 18, 2020, 7:43 am
#60
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You know I will say, if, God forbid, the plane had crashed and dumping the fuel had saved hundreds of lives, yet still caused the same problems to those effected by dumping of the fuel would we have found it acceptable?
Don't get me wrong, I am not advocating dumping fuel over residential areas, or seemingly lying about it, I am just curious if the outcome of the emergency (plane didn't crash) changes the reactions to the fuel dump?
Don't get me wrong, I am not advocating dumping fuel over residential areas, or seemingly lying about it, I am just curious if the outcome of the emergency (plane didn't crash) changes the reactions to the fuel dump?