The Situation

There is too much internal debate that would need to take place for DL to match the changes for the 2021 medallion year (qualify during 2020). The amex relationship and MQM earning and the rollover MQM benefit would be complications that would take too long to discuss the implications of. Delta has conditioned travelers to behave a certain way and that is to maximize MQM while spending money and I think the decision makers are too conservative to upset that conditioning so quickly. They also may want to give it some time to see how it plays out and how behavior changes. I wouldn't be surprised to see an increase in MQD requirements this year, but I doubt that DL would fully match UA's scheme. As many people that would benefit from United's scheme would also probably be hurt by it. Having different programs at different carriers is a way to differentiate and DLs program is probably more appealing to more people than United's.

SJC ORD LDR

I could see that along with the ability to buy status outright if you give them enough money.

ElmhurstNick

The thing I was struck by is how badly they are treating flyers who use *A partners in premium classes. 16-20% for PE/J/F?? DL allows 30% on VS for PE.

aCavalierInCoach

It translates to pretty close to the current earning rates relative to how quickly they got you to e.g. 1K. And previously you had to get the EQM and hit the dollar threshold, so this is probably at worst a wash for most folks.

HDQDD

If UA had better connections for the Eastern US from RDU, this wouls entice me to move my loyalty there. My travel is every week, mostly East of the Mississippi, with 4-5 international rounds/yr. For too long I've had to take connecting itins where a non-stop was available just to make MQS for status. I've been saying this for years, but this is not only bad for me bum, it's bad for DL. I can pay basically the same (and sometimes less) to take a connecting itin where they now have to carry me on two flights (vs. 1) for the same or less money, not to mention the opportunity cost of not being able to sell the unnecessary second flight.

All they need to do is add a $25K spend/yr. requirement to reach DM without all the MQD/MQM/MQS nonsense. They can leave all the other credit card crap the same for now, but going forward, UA's system makes a lot more sense than what DL/AA have right now. Reward your highest spenders, not people who are wasting space in your system.

HDQDD

When you pay for a premium fare, you're paying a higher price. This would also be rewarded in the new UA system. Higher spend, higher status. And then of course people who routinely buy premium fares don't need to care about status anyway. They're already going to get everything that status would provide.

You do realize that many (most?) people here make status without a single F/D1 purchase a year. MQMs are meaningless for many here who qualify on MQS.

MSPeconomist

I disagree.

Under the new UA rules, some partner fares will earn 40% of distance (200% X 1/5) toward PQD or whatever it's now called. FULL IFC might be even more.

Moreover, the big difference is that only segments count and status miles can't be used to reduce the PQD requirement. 1K at 54 asegments doesn't sound bad for those who qualify on segments, but those of us who fly a lot of nonstops and especially longhaul international flights don't do that many segments. For instance, I've been DM every year and I doin't think I ever had 45 or more segments, and this is without relying on a lot of rollover of AmEx MQMs.

gmt4

As a multi-year UA 1k I have to say there is a real opportunity for DL to take the lead and poach UA business here. All DL (or AA) has to do is hold off on going down the same path, or if they do, don't go so extreme and people will migrate over. Big spenders with UA are unaffected by this bomb today so their opinions and behavior won't change. But there's millions of dollars to be enticed away by those who don't want to play the high dollar UA status game. I'm really anxious to see DL and AA's response. I can't make any decisions on what direction I'll go until I see what the competitors put up.

scubadu

LOL! If you are expecting AA to do much here, prepare yourself to be ridiculously disappointed.

I'd suggest you spend some time in that forum for awhile. You will find the exact some frustrations, threats to leave, declarations that "this change is the last straw, I'm going to UA or DL" etc

These carriers are all on the same paths, just at different speeds. Free agency is your friend.

Regards

ethernal

Bingo. The intent is to pull in those who don't fly nonstops. Hub captives at SFO, IAH, DEN, and IAD are likely to fly United regardless (just like you are going to fly Delta regardless for as long as you are based out of MSP). Why incent those folks? United wants to incent someone who has to connect anyways (think cities like Sacramento, San Antonio, New Orleans, Austin, and so on - or people who live close to a secondary airport and far from a primary where connecting vs. driving to the primary airport is a wash) but still buys a lot of close-in expensive fares. Those are the travelers that are up for grabs (or, even better, a competitor's hub captive customer.. but that's probably a bit of a stretch).

gmt4

My post as a non-DL flyer in the DL forum was not so much about wanting to switch programs, but a simple admission as UA elite to DL elites that UA has gift wrapped a chance at millions of dollars of business for its competitors and that status pain is probably coming their way.

MSPeconomist

There are also people at outstations and more generally airports that aren't hubs with lots of international service who rack up a lot of miles on longhaul international flights, even in premium cabins, and don't spend huge amounts of money or fly lots of segments. Of course, premium cabin international tickets get one many of the same benefits of status, and the remaining elite benefits aren't that costly, but they could still matter a lot to people. It's elasticity again: someone who is treated well will go out of the way a bit to fly that carrier and will pay somewhat more to do so, but if someone taking half a dozen international longhaul RTs per year using somewhat cheap fares doesn't get meaningful status, there's little reason to fly that airline versus becoming a free agent (and also a free agent for whatever domestic travel the person does).

scubadu

I think what you are missing is that everyone has already had pain "coming their way" it just happens in waves and at different times between the 3 majors. Today just happened to be UA's day, nothing more.

Trust me, UA elites are not special in feeling pain. Again, spend time in this and the AA forum and you will sometimes forget/wonder which forum you are actually in. The story is the same for all.

Regards

ATOBTTR

DL is 30% of distance flown while UA will be actually 40% of distance flown for many premium fares on *A partners because it will be 1/5th of the "miles awarded" but miles awarded (not including elite bonuses) are often 200% of distance flown. For example, flying Int'l J on AC, regardless of fare code, earns miles at 200% of distance flown. So for example, YVR-HKG-YVR, which is ~6400 miles each way, or ~12,800 miles round trip. In J, x2, that becomes 25,600, which then at 20% becomes ~5,100 PQPs, and thus UA Silver through PQP only in just in one trip, regardless of fare class paid on the AC flight (This is my understanding, if I'm interpreting it all correctly).

ethernal

These things go both ways. I would actually argue that I am now more incented to fly United on short haul domestic.

I have a trip to ATL-IAD next week I booked earlier today. It's a $700 ticket but will only net a bit over 1000 MQM/PQM. Next year I'll definitely take that on United since it helps me qualify "more" than it does on Delta (I've always been PQM constrained on United) - and 1K extra rollover miles only means so much when you already have 400K of them.