Recent pathetic decisions/culture of Delta partners KE, GA
Jul 17, 2019, 10:39 pm
#31
Join Date: May 2006
Location: GA
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I think it is entirely relevant to this forum, even if you don't fly KE. One just sort of assumes that another company that rises to the level of a Joint Venture partner with Delta, and hence is effectively being endorsed by Delta, follows reasonable standards of service and safety, which includes a modern day safety culture.
People should research the companies that they fly, not just blindly follow DL and assume they will be enforcing any type of regulation on their partners. It simply doesn't work that way.
Jul 17, 2019, 10:52 pm
#32
Join Date: May 2006
Location: NYC
Programs: Delta DM/2MM, Flying Blue Gold, Hertz Platinum
Posts: 1,934
Yes it is a leap in logic. They are funneling you onto another company, so only those flying on the other company could realistically find this to be a big deal. I mentioned I realize this is a big deal for you, and I get that, but not all of us.
The leap in logic is saying the influence of the safety of their partner airline of 20,000 employees will override the culture of Delta's 80,000 employees. To your point if anything Delta will probably pressure KE to change. So these incidents could be catalysts for improvement not some big deal red flag of KE somehow eroding DL's safety culture.
The sky(team) is not falling.
The leap in logic is saying the influence of the safety of their partner airline of 20,000 employees will override the culture of Delta's 80,000 employees. To your point if anything Delta will probably pressure KE to change. So these incidents could be catalysts for improvement not some big deal red flag of KE somehow eroding DL's safety culture.
The sky(team) is not falling.
My point is that KE, when it gets the privilege of marketing its flights with DL flight numbers, becomes implicitly endorsed as sharing the same culture. You may not remember that DL blacklisted KE before for issues of crew resource management that were leading to crashes. DL actually sent it’s own people in to train KE pilots to its own standards. This is a similar (if not as severe) issue. That’s all I’m saying.
Jul 17, 2019, 11:04 pm
#33
A FlyerTalk Posting Legend
Join Date: Dec 2000
Location: Shanghai
Posts: 41,990
When did I say anything about “eroding DL’s safety culture?”
My point is that KE, when it gets the privilege of marketing its flights with DL flight numbers, becomes implicitly endorsed as sharing the same culture. You may not remember that DL blacklisted KE before for issues of crew resource management that were leading to crashes. DL actually sent it’s own people in to train KE pilots to its own standards. This is a similar (if not as severe) issue. That’s all I’m saying.
My point is that KE, when it gets the privilege of marketing its flights with DL flight numbers, becomes implicitly endorsed as sharing the same culture. You may not remember that DL blacklisted KE before for issues of crew resource management that were leading to crashes. DL actually sent it’s own people in to train KE pilots to its own standards. This is a similar (if not as severe) issue. That’s all I’m saying.
Jul 18, 2019, 4:40 am
#34
Join Date: Oct 2017
Location: BNA
Programs: DL GM, HH Diamond
Posts: 1,027
When did I say anything about “eroding DL’s safety culture?”
My point is that KE, when it gets the privilege of marketing its flights with DL flight numbers, becomes implicitly endorsed as sharing the same culture. You may not remember that DL blacklisted KE before for issues of crew resource management that were leading to crashes. DL actually sent it’s own people in to train KE pilots to its own standards. This is a similar (if not as severe) issue. That’s all I’m saying.
My point is that KE, when it gets the privilege of marketing its flights with DL flight numbers, becomes implicitly endorsed as sharing the same culture. You may not remember that DL blacklisted KE before for issues of crew resource management that were leading to crashes. DL actually sent it’s own people in to train KE pilots to its own standards. This is a similar (if not as severe) issue. That’s all I’m saying.
As far as being implicitly endorsed, that is a bit of a stretch. I do agree that associating with, and not condemning bad behavior of another company could be problematic. However these are separate companies, I would never assume two companies hold the exact same standards just because they are aligned. Heck people are arguing here about which partners offer better service or catering all the time.
If your point is simply problems are a problem then we agree. But again the leap in logic is that this is some big deal red flag systemic issue that everyone that flies Delta should be concerned about.
Jul 18, 2019, 6:10 am
#35
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That much is true. When KE cockpit culture was getting a lot of people killed, DL did issue an ultimatum: shape up with our training, or lose the relationship. So there are limits.
Last edited by BearX220; Jul 18, 2019 at 9:36 am Reason: Fix typo
Jul 22, 2019, 9:24 am
#36
Join Date: Oct 2016
Posts: 92
[QUOTE=moondog;31312185]I don't doubt that there is more to the story, and that she was probably a b---h.
According to the Korea Times story, the FA was a man, the chief FA on board. But, yes, female FAs who speak up about safety issues to their betters may indeed have to put up with being labeled: all power to them! Korean Air pilot asks for alcoholic beverage but let off with warning
According to the Korea Times story, the FA was a man, the chief FA on board. But, yes, female FAs who speak up about safety issues to their betters may indeed have to put up with being labeled: all power to them! Korean Air pilot asks for alcoholic beverage but let off with warning
Jul 22, 2019, 9:42 am
#37
Join Date: Oct 2016
Posts: 92
Wow. On KE we observed a clear racist / sexist hierarchy: a few Korean men traveling alone were fawned over, brought extra treats from first class, lots of simpering and brazen / literal butt-and-cleavage displaying. To the Caucasian men flying solo the FAs were formally, cautiously polite. Caucasian men sitting with wives / SOs got minimal, perfunctory service. Caucasian women (there were 3 in the J cabin) got no service at all; my wife had to bus her own tray back to the galley after lunch, and the FAs would not answer call buttons or even make eye contact. We laugh about it now, but would not book KE again.
