RealHJ

Domestic DL, several times a year, say one round trip every 2-4 months or so. Usually the 767 via MSP or ATL (HNL-MSP/ATL-xxx).

On a 767, probably 2% realistically for a pax to have a broken seat (i.e. 1 out of every 50 flights, give or take some 25), given that every 1 out of 2~3 times there is a broken seat in the cabin that I've observed (or in other words, some 30% chance for there to be a broken seat in the 767 J cabin). The better stations will catch it and will pro-actively reseat you if you are in a broken seat (so has happened to me before, at gate someone found me and gave me a new boarding pass, saying my original seat was broken). The worse and lower standard ground stations (like MSP, ATL) won't check the aircraft while it's sitting on the ground for several hours or just knowingly ignore the broken seats, and as the flights are normally oversold, if you are in a broken seat, then tough luck. No compensation, nothing from DL when you're so stuck in a broken J seat on a full J fare as a DM (other than something purser may give you on the flight, but that never actually posts, as someone within DL seems to be in charge of stopping the purser awarded miles from actually posting to the customer; post-flight DL CS nowadays is pretty much non-existent, DL really has the worst service recovery of any US airline, by far).

I always encourage everyone to board DL J flights (esp. 767) early and check the seat functionality right away. Key is to catch it before door closes, then the crew can't ignore it and techs from the ground will be brought on to fix it (possibly delaying the flight, but, well, that is what happens as DL tech ops and maintenance is so sub-standard and doesn't believe in a pro-active approach, as most other airlines typically deal with this IME).

- not that there's no reason not to buy F/J fares, just that if it costs a few $100s more to get the exact flights you want, book the flights that you really want, don't book something sub-optimal and count on being able to SDC; you probably won't be able to do so (nothing wrong with that in principle also in my view, just it does take away a benefit of SDC that it could be used to save $ by booking a sub-optimal connection for less $$$ and then later SDC'ing to what you really want)

- DL normally holds back one J seat for day-of-flight irrops, but just one; four figure $ eCV offers - not just once but multiple days in a row of flying out a day later for J pax, while not common, are not uncommon (so if you are flexible, you can "make" several $1000s in Delta eCV "dollars" by pushing back your flights a day, then another day, and so on, until the irrops situation normalizes)

- the times that I've observed some F/J seats are open still a few days before flight, there is a pattern of 5 days before, and then 24 hours before flight, the seat map getting more filled (and fully or a lot more filled up at 23:50 vs 25:00 hours out), so when the flights are not full, it seems to be filled up with upgrades at T-24, i.e. just before SDC window opens, thus often leaving no confirmed and only standby room for same day change; that being said, seat map is not an exact representation of availability, but it does seem that DL is too generous with upgrades, at the expense of paying F/J pax SDC options, it in effect being a penalty for buying a more expensive ticket (with Y there are more seats and more likely open seats allowing you to SDC than with F/J)

WillBarrett_68

nm, read it wrong

SamOF

There really isn't a product that offers that flexibility. Buying a flexible fare to begin with is actually no different for the purposes we're discussing than just waiting to buy your ticket on the day of departure—the total cost will always be equal. And even if that did work—I still think there's a market for something that costs a small amount (or given as an elite benefit) for changes that no one in their right mind would pay hundreds of dollars in fare difference for.

I think the complaint is not about Delta restricting SDC on the flights that are about to sell out—it's the flight that's 25% empty but only selling and H fare, and you've booked a K fare. Especially irrational for the airline is where I originally booked a K fare on a flight that's now 99% full, and I can't change to the flight that's 75% full without K available.

ethernal

As someone that buys M/B fares for the most part (maybe every once in a while an H, Q, or Yfare), my issue is 100% load factor. I am literally blocked from buying flights, selecting seats, or having any flexibility on or before the day of departure.

Take SJC-ATL on this Saturday morning. I hate to fly back on Saturday, but I needed to. And when I tried to buy a ticket this morning, I was presented with a $1500 ticket for a one-way. For a 6:23 AM Saturday morning flight. Oh, and it's Economy, since first is completely sold out. Not just on the 6 AM flight, but on all flights that day. So even if I pay that $1500 fare, I will likely be stuck in my good friend 36C (all bookable window/aisle seats are already taken). This is just a typical Saturday. There is no major conference going on this week. It's just.. a regular Saturday.

This is just one example, but it is endemic on a lot of routes I fly.

I get that part of it is revenue management, but to me it's revenue management gone wrong - or at least to the extreme detriment of high value customers. it's just amazingly frustrating that Delta fills up the planes with complete below-cost garbage fares (this is the same flight they are happy to sell an $800 First Class round trip SJC-ATL-MIA/CLT/CVG/CMH/anywhere East Coast pretty much any time) and then leaves someone pay a high Y (no F options, no aisle/window seats available for selection - main cabin, preferred, Comfort+), and all for the steal of a price of either no option at all or - at best - for $1500+.

btonkid12345

Not really. They can't fill up a plane with YBM fares entirely.

You don't have a choice of seats and pay a sky high price because you buy at the last possible minute. All carriers charge through the roof and don't expect you to whine about not getting your choice of seat.

If you want that choice, fly private or plan in advance. I just don't get all the complaining when you're electing to pay the fare, seeing the seat map beforehand - if you don't want or need it, don't buy it.

I'm guessing you or your employer needs it so the price or your seat choice isn't much of a concern.

ethernal

Except I didn't buy this flight for that very reason. I decided to take a United flight connecting through Houston because it was a far more reasonable fare and got an Economy Plus seat. Out of principle I refuse to spend $1500 for a domestic ticket and sit in one of the worst Y seats on the plane - regardless of whether it is my money or OPM.

So this is my point. Delta is shooting themselves in the foot with these load factors by filling up the plane with garbage yields and then being in a sell-out or near-sell-out condition 3-4 days before the flight. That is what I mean when I say revenue management gone wrong.

It would be one thing if this was rare but these sell-out conditions are endemic on the routes I fly. That to me is broken revenue management.

Zorak

How many empty seats did your UA flight go out with? I mean, I don't pretend to understand the intricacies of RM, but to my naive eye I would say that the airline that has one seat left at Y/B/M is doing a better job of RM than the one that has already presumably had most or all its elites who were eligible already pick Y+ seats and still had some left over.

Now, if they were in a position of constantly VDBing people so they could sell full Y fares into an overbooked cabin, then yeah, maybe I could see the point that they were too generous with Z/LUTXV fares early on. But if that happened I also would think they'd learn from that and tweak the buckets for future flights to be less generous.

jrl767

Duke787

And how exactly do you know that the plane was filled with garbage yields?

Last I checked DL was still the market cap and profit king of the US3 -- so pretty safe to assume their RM is dialed in at the moment and they are content with the "garbage" yields they are getting

GagaPilot

I mostly buy paid F now for leisure travel 5-6 trips a year. With my routings there's usually few SDC opportunities. However I will comment on loads. I'm a Captain at a Regional Airline and because of loads I NEVER non-rev or jumpseat anymore. It's just not worth it. I buy the tickets I want on the flights I want and budget accordingly.

CMK10

I've been having mixed results lately. Last month I had my favorite: paid F on BOS-RDU, bought the cheapest flight (last of the night) and moved onto the one I wanted and got home in time for dinner.

However, I regularly commute between MSY and RDU via ATL and between ATL and RDU and it's been much more miss than hit recently. Thankfully I've been lucky with the standby option but I hate playing the gate lottery with that.