Delta returns to London Gatwick - its first trans-Atlantic destination
#16
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If I'm getting sub-$1000 per leg Mint fares to Europe, I'll be happy as a clam. I don't think B6 will be in any kind of position of strength but if they suck the average J fare down by $1000-1200 I think it'll benefit all of us.
#18
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#19
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I look forward to this because just like in the transcontinental market, B6 will be able to offer a comparable or better product at a lower price. Anything that weighs on the US3 is a good thing. AA/DL/UA are in too anticompetitive of a market and have it far too easy to provide high quality, competitive products.
#20
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I remember flying CVG-LGW in a DL L-1011 in January of, I think, 1989. It was early in January and the outbound (for me) flight had a lot of British passengers returning from Florida who had been rerouted from flights via ATL. Many seemed to be dressed in beach wear and were shivering in cold Ohio. On the return flight a week later, also an L-1011, there were only six passengers in all of Y. These were my only flights ever in a TriStar.
#21
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You caught the press release references to DL being the #1 TATL carrier all in destinations, U.S. gateways, city pairs and customers carried, right? B6 will not be operating from a position of strength TATL, not from JFK or BOS. They're not going to have the network, the fleet diversity, nor the corporate contracts. They certainly don't have the operational chops: look at on-time and flight cancellation data.
#22
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Yes, they did. They tried BOS-LGW from June 2001 to June 2002. This route has been discontinued. Due to low demand.
#24
Join Date: Apr 2011
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I think there's a better chance of B6 operating JFK-SYD on their own metal than DL offering comp J upgrades.
Eh, I'm pretty sure B6 planned for some reaction from the legacy carriers. TCON Mint has certainly stuck around, notwithstanding the major's ability to redeploy product on those routes. Furthermore, if (as rumored) B6 offers onward connectivity from LON into Europe somehow, they'll be a step ahead of DL/VS, which still doesn't have a good connectivity solution on the European side.
Eh, I'm pretty sure B6 planned for some reaction from the legacy carriers. TCON Mint has certainly stuck around, notwithstanding the major's ability to redeploy product on those routes. Furthermore, if (as rumored) B6 offers onward connectivity from LON into Europe somehow, they'll be a step ahead of DL/VS, which still doesn't have a good connectivity solution on the European side.
AA/BA run x12 747 and 777's
DL/VS run x8 A330 and A340
UA (from EWR) runs x5 767
Plus the VS and BA flights from EWR
All in, it's roughly 1,100 lie flat seats (or better)
B6 tossing a few narrow bodies out there isn't going to be the same type of game changer that it was for the domestic market. And I'm highly skeptical of how much traction B6 will get with ownard connections from LHR. BA already covers more than B6 can dream of, and on top of that from NYC and BOS you can get nearly anywhere in Europe Non-stop already.
This seems like a cute idea from B6, but I bet they would ultimately do much better BOS to EDI/DUB. A narrow body there probably has an advantage and isn't nearly as expensive to fly to for the airline. LHR taxes and fee's are crazy which will mute a lot of B6's ability to undercut DL/VS and AA/BA.
#26
Join Date: Apr 2011
Posts: 3,394
There are some parallels but I'd say the biggest difference is at LHR, you can buy slots from other carriers...it's just that B6 doesn't want to pay up. HND US carriers are not allowed to purchase any additional slots. Also LHR and LGW are 20 and 26 miles from the city center respectively. HND and NRT are 8 and 37 miles respectively from the city center.
#27
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But of course connecting via CDG/AMS on AF/KL can get you to at least as many places.
#28
Join Date: Sep 2015
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That would accomplish nothing. The moment B6 gave up, your comp upgrades would be long gone.
I look forward to this because just like in the transcontinental market, B6 will be able to offer a comparable or better product at a lower price. Anything that weighs on the US3 is a good thing. AA/DL/UA are in too anticompetitive of a market and have it far too easy to provide high quality, competitive products.
I look forward to this because just like in the transcontinental market, B6 will be able to offer a comparable or better product at a lower price. Anything that weighs on the US3 is a good thing. AA/DL/UA are in too anticompetitive of a market and have it far too easy to provide high quality, competitive products.
#29
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Even if B6 can somehow pry 6 slots for just JFK, for MINT that 6 x 16 = 96 seats.
AA/BA run x12 747 and 777's
DL/VS run x8 A330 and A340
UA (from EWR) runs x5 767
Plus the VS and BA flights from EWR
All in, it's roughly 1,100 lie flat seats (or better)
B6 tossing a few narrow bodies out there isn't going to be the same type of game changer that it was for the domestic market.
AA/BA run x12 747 and 777's
DL/VS run x8 A330 and A340
UA (from EWR) runs x5 767
Plus the VS and BA flights from EWR
All in, it's roughly 1,100 lie flat seats (or better)
B6 tossing a few narrow bodies out there isn't going to be the same type of game changer that it was for the domestic market.
It's enough to get traction and it's enough to change pricing dynamics. (Remember when B6 effectively killed Saturday night stay requirements in the US domestic market? They were a lot smaller back then than they are now. Remember when B6 introduced $600 fares to the premium TCON market? Mint was a lot smaller back then than it was now.)
And I'm highly skeptical of how much traction B6 will get with ownard connections from LHR. BA already covers more than B6 can dream of, and on top of that from NYC and BOS you can get nearly anywhere in Europe Non-stop already.
This seems like a cute idea from B6, but I bet they would ultimately do much better BOS to EDI/DUB. A narrow body there probably has an advantage and isn't nearly as expensive to fly to for the airline.
#30
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