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International Travel with Minor – Different PNR

International Travel with Minor – Different PNR

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Old Feb 19, 19, 10:12 am
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International Travel with Minor – Different PNR

I have a question for the experts here. This summer I am taking my 12 year old daughter to France. I am traveling MSP -> CDG (Delta) on the outbound and RNS ->AMS (Air France) followed by AMS->MSP (Delta) on the return. The RNS -> AMS leg is an independent, non codeshare, one way flight on a different PNR. To make matters more complicated, my daughter and I both have separate PNRs for the MSP ->CDG and AMS ->MSP legs. This was so I could use a credit from a previous flight.

Here is my concern: I have read that because the TATL legs are on different PNRs we will need to actually be present at the airport to check in for the Delta flights. If my RNS ->AMS flight is delayed for any reason, we would be inside of the 1 hr minimum check in requirement. My questions are: 1) should I just try to rebook this (and forget about using the credit) so we can be on one PNR (and presumably can check in online), or 2) will they be able to check us in for the AMS->MSP flight in RNS even though it’s a separate itinerary. I was not able to get a definitive answer to #2 after two calls to the diamond desk.

As an aside, the reason we didn’t book RNS all the way through to MSP (via AMS) was because it added $700 to each itinerary whereas booking a one-way from RNS to AMS was roughly $100.

Thanks much!
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Old Feb 19, 19, 10:24 am
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Originally Posted by mrdovenb View Post
I have a question for the experts here. This summer I am taking my 12 year old daughter to France. I am traveling MSP -> CDG (Delta) on the outbound and RNS ->AMS (Air France) followed by AMS->MSP (Delta) on the return. The RNS -> AMS leg is an independent, non codeshare, one way flight on a different PNR. To make matters more complicated, my daughter and I both have separate PNRs for the MSP ->CDG and AMS ->MSP legs. This was so I could use a credit from a previous flight.

Here is my concern: I have read that because the TATL legs are on different PNRs we will need to actually be present at the airport to check in for the Delta flights. If my RNS ->AMS flight is delayed for any reason, we would be inside of the 1 hr minimum check in requirement. My questions are: 1) should I just try to rebook this (and forget about using the credit) so we can be on one PNR (and presumably can check in online), or 2) will they be able to check us in for the AMS->MSP flight in RNS even though it’s a separate itinerary. I was not able to get a definitive answer to #2 after two calls to the diamond desk.

As an aside, the reason we didn’t book RNS all the way through to MSP (via AMS) was because it added $700 to each itinerary whereas booking a one-way from RNS to AMS was roughly $100.

Thanks much!
Rebooking an international ticket is going to incur huge change fees (an agent *may* waive them under the circumstances and then rebook with a full credit but that's no guarantee).
If your RNS-AMS leg is delayed for any reason and you no-show for the AMS-MSP leg, DL is under no obligation to rebook you, so this is also a huge risk depending on your "connection" time in AMS - you didn't mention baggage - will you be all carryon? If not, bags complicate this too.

Any chance you could fly or take a train for RNS-AMS the night before and overnight at AMS the night before you fly MSP-AMS? (If you could find a $100 flight for RNS-AMS already, a new RNS-AMS ticket is going to be way cheaper than two international change fees).
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Old Feb 19, 19, 10:40 am
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My guess is I can get the change fee waived. I'm not actually changing anything about the ticket, and the fare is still the same. The question is do I need to, given it will almost certainly involve brain damage. As for luggage, because Air France is an alliance partner, they are supposed to check you to your final destination, even when flying on different tickets.
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Old Feb 19, 19, 10:49 am
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DL doesn't have an obligation to protect you on separate tickets but many stories here indicate it's policy to do so.

The AMS-MSP check-in is a different issue. I wouldn't expect RNS staff to be able to check you in - but I might ask. (Ask in French if you can.) Worst case you miss your check-in deadline, miss your flight, get a day in AMS to visit the Rijksmuseum, and get rebooked AMS-MSP for the next day. (I wouldn't consider the alternative 6-hr train journey RNS-AMS for a minute.)
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Old Feb 19, 19, 11:09 am
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Not related to PNR's but to be safe, you may want to have a notarized letter from your daughter's other parent authorizing the journey.
You never know how an immigration official may perceive a minor traveling with a single parent in the grand scheme of "human trafficking". And of course, have proof of all of your hotel plans and returning flights.
https://help.cbp.gov/app/answers/det...ot-a-parent-or
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Old Feb 19, 19, 11:22 am
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Originally Posted by mrdovenb View Post
I have a question for the experts here. This summer I am taking my 12 year old daughter to France. I am traveling MSP -> CDG (Delta) on the outbound and RNS ->AMS (Air France) followed by AMS->MSP (Delta) on the return. The RNS -> AMS leg is an independent, non codeshare, one way flight on a different PNR. To make matters more complicated, my daughter and I both have separate PNRs for the MSP ->CDG and AMS ->MSP legs. This was so I could use a credit from a previous flight.

Here is my concern: I have read that because the TATL legs are on different PNRs we will need to actually be present at the airport to check in for the Delta flights. If my RNS ->AMS flight is delayed for any reason, we would be inside of the 1 hr minimum check in requirement. My questions are: 1) should I just try to rebook this (and forget about using the credit) so we can be on one PNR (and presumably can check in online), or 2) will they be able to check us in for the AMS->MSP flight in RNS even though it’s a separate itinerary. I was not able to get a definitive answer to #2 after two calls to the diamond desk.

As an aside, the reason we didn’t book RNS all the way through to MSP (via AMS) was because it added $700 to each itinerary whereas booking a one-way from RNS to AMS was roughly $100.

Thanks much!
To me, the real problem here is that you need more time in AMS to make sure your un-jointly-ticketed connection is valid and you have time to comply with the AMS-MSP flight's check-in requirements. In AMS, you WILL check in with KLM and not Delta.

Keep in mind that DL operates several flights/day AMS-MSP. (you didn't mention anything beyond "summer" in terms of date of planned travel). Have you looked into booking a later AMS-MSP flight which would allow more time for a safe connection in this circumstance?
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Old Feb 19, 19, 12:34 pm
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Not completely sure if the AF agents @RNS are able to see your Delta reservation and/or:
1. Are able & willing to check your daughter in for the AMS-MSP flight
2. Check in your (daughters) bagage all the way through
I fear you only will find this out in RNS.

IIRC there is one direct flight each day from RNS (arriving at AMS 11h25)
The AMS-MSP flight would be DL163, departing @12h50
If you have to pick up your (daughter's) luggage @AMS then that's not enough time.
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Old Feb 19, 19, 1:24 pm
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It doesn't matter whether the daughter is booked into the same PNR as OP. He will still need to appear with her at check-in to fulfill the "responsible adult" requirements. Thus, going to the time and expense of rebooking the TATL tickets is not going to fix the underlying issue.

To be safe, OP should either allow an oveernight or pay the UM fee of $150, This will permit whoever is bringing her to the airport to check her in. You, of course, will have missed the flight, so you will need a backup plan for the other end.

To be frank, this is a poor solution and I would not use it unless there are mission critical reasons. Otherwise, allowing an overnight will be much more sensible.
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Old Feb 19, 19, 6:24 pm
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Originally Posted by Grouchy View Post
Not completely sure if the AF agents @RNS are able to see your Delta reservation and/or:
1. Are able & willing to check your daughter in for the AMS-MSP flight
2. Check in your (daughters) bagage all the way through
I fear you only will find this out in RNS.

IIRC there is one direct flight each day from RNS (arriving at AMS 11h25)
The AMS-MSP flight would be DL163, departing @12h50
If you have to pick up your (daughter's) luggage @AMS then that's not enough time.
I've done trips similar to this before (multi-city international, different PNRs) and had no problem through-checking baggage. The key is they're both SkyTeam airlines, so I just printed detailed itineraries out for the agent before I went to the airport. It's not a guarantee, and I'd DEFINITELY recommend as much layover time in AMS as possible, but call to link the reservations (both separate PNRs and separate tickets--you and daughter) so they at least know at Delta you're together and in case of IRROPS can make sure they rebook you together.
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Old Feb 19, 19, 7:43 pm
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Originally Posted by ATOBTTR View Post
If your RNS-AMS leg is delayed for any reason and you no-show for the AMS-MSP leg, DL is under no obligation to rebook you
If all flights are DL/KLM/AF they will be taken care of.
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Old Feb 19, 19, 7:47 pm
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Originally Posted by jdrtravel View Post
If all flights are DL/KLM/AF they will be taken care of.
Yea OP later clarified it was AF, but I interpreted “independent, non-codeshare” to mean non-SkyTeam so OP is more likely to be okay in this situation.

Last edited by ATOBTTR; Feb 20, 19 at 7:47 am Reason: Fix typo
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Old Feb 19, 19, 7:54 pm
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Originally Posted by ATOBTTR View Post

Yea OP later clarified it was AF, but I intercepted “independent, non-codeshare” to mean non-SkyTeam so OP is more likely to be okay in this situation.

Yeah I though the at first also.
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Old Feb 19, 19, 8:39 pm
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Originally Posted by FlyBitcoin View Post
Not related to PNR's but to be safe, you may want to have a notarized letter from your daughter's other parent authorizing the journey.
You never know how an immigration official may perceive a minor traveling with a single parent in the grand scheme of "human trafficking". And of course, have proof of all of your hotel plans and returning flights.
https://help.cbp.gov/app/answers/det...ot-a-parent-or
was thinking the same thing. Not to minimize human trafficking, but the “false positives” are definitely growing and an issue for legitimate travels.
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Old Feb 20, 19, 1:57 am
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Originally Posted by dmarge18 View Post
I've done trips similar to this before (multi-city international, different PNRs) and had no problem through-checking baggage. The key is they're both SkyTeam airlines, so I just printed detailed itineraries out for the agent before I went to the airport. It's not a guarantee, and I'd DEFINITELY recommend as much layover time in AMS as possible, but call to link the reservations (both separate PNRs and separate tickets--you and daughter) so they at least know at Delta you're together and in case of IRROPS can make sure they rebook you together.
Without a minor & on a different PNR, that's nice.

Originally Posted by Troppy View Post


was thinking the same thing. Not to minimize human trafficking, but the “false positives” are definitely growing and an issue for legitimate travels.
This
  • Travel documents issued more than 10 years prior to arrival are not accepted.
  • Passengers may be refused entry if they do not have access to approximately EUR 34 per day of stay in the Netherlands.
  • Minors aged 17 or younger who are not travelling with both parents must hold either a letter authorising their travel from any absent parents or legal guardians, or documents showing that this is not needed (such as a death certificate if a parent is deceased, or court documents granting sole custody).
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Old Feb 20, 19, 6:25 am
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Originally Posted by Often1 View Post
It doesn't matter whether the daughter is booked into the same PNR as OP. He will still need to appear with her at check-in to fulfill the "responsible adult" requirements. Thus, going to the time and expense of rebooking the TATL tickets is not going to fix the underlying issue.

To be safe, OP should either allow an oveernight or pay the UM fee of $150, This will permit whoever is bringing her to the airport to check her in. You, of course, will have missed the flight, so you will need a backup plan for the other end.

To be frank, this is a poor solution and I would not use it unless there are mission critical reasons. Otherwise, allowing an overnight will be much more sensible.
My understanding is that OP and daughter are booked on all of the same flights. I don't think someone else is taking her to the AMS airport. The problem seems to be that she will probably need to present herself in person to check in at AMS with the parent and there might not be time to do that before the one hour check in deadline. Paying the UM fee wouldn't help as the daughter would still need to be taken to the service counter at AMS more than an hour before scheduled departure and she won't be getting to AMS with any time to spare.

Last edited by MSPeconomist; Feb 20, 19 at 6:44 am
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