Diamond Cancelling Award Ticket Last Minute?
Sep 17, 2018, 7:45 am
#16
Join Date: Feb 2003
Posts: 4,115
Think about what you have to do to “rig” the system as hypothesized. You have to have a ticket on the flight with an upgrade waitlisted. Add to the suspicion that you would use your own miles to rig this other ticket. You somehow have to have an expensive coach ticket if it leads you to believe you are #1 on the waitlist. Then, this only applies to a flight that otherwise goes to 100% sold out, so that your award ticket is indeed the “last seat”. Then, no reroutings on DOD due to IRROPs, paid passengers changing flights, etc.
Who is the sane person that actually relies on a star/planet alignment like this, in advance, to hinge such a scheme on? And as stated, you could just run this through as a refundable business ticket if so inclined, all to attract this level of legitimate suspicion.
I would suggest that Delta just saw people trying to swap routings at the last minute to get better flights as seats opened up (as the system is basically designed to do), deemed it “abuse” because it was screwing up their close in modeling of flight loads, and created a blanket rule to address it without any consideration of the pain it causes. That is a more plausible explanation than the widespread rampant abuse theories implied.
Last edited by HeadInTheClouds; Sep 17, 2018 at 7:52 am
Sep 17, 2018, 9:23 am
#18
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Seattle, WA
Programs: DL Diamond 1.7MM, Starlux Insighter, Bonvoy Titanium, Hilton Gold, Hertz PC
Posts: 3,947
Fortunately, this isn’t a case where we need to speculate on why Delta instituted the 72 hour rule - it occurred back in 2011 back when Delta still bothered to participate on FlyerTalk. Here’s their rationale for introducing the 72 hour rule from that mega thread:
Updated: Award Redeposit and Reissue Rule Change
Updated: Award Redeposit and Reissue Rule Change
Late last month, I posted information about recent changes to our Award redeposit policy. The changes were made after we reviewed the number of award seats that were going out empty and the number was large – massive, in fact. So we made some adjustments to help address the situation and increase award availability.
In response to that post, more than half a dozen FT members asked if we were looking at making changes to the policy for any time prior to departure. In fact, we were. During that review we determined that there are more than 1,000,000 award seats that were going unused at the 72 hour mark prior to departure. That is 3 days in which those seats could otherwise be sold or used for other SkyMiles members who truly intend to sit in the seat and travel.
As a result, we’re updating this policy once more. So, effective August 15, 2011, SkyMiles members who wish to cancel or make changes to their award ticket now need to do so at least 72 hours before their flight departure (for changes, this applies to each flight segment – outbound and return). This change will make those seats available to other members and ultimately increase award availability. Miles for tickets cancelled within 72 hours will be nonrefundable. Taxes and fees for award travel cancelled within 72 hours will be refundable upon request. Same-day standby options will remain.
For changes or cancellations made at least 72 hours prior to departure, Diamond and Platinum Medallion members will continue to receive reissue and redeposit fee waivers. Reissue and redeposit fees will continue to apply for other members.
We will be sending out an email to customers with advance award travel booked later today – delta.com is being updated with this information as well.
Because it was a trending theme in last month’s thread, let’s address another issue head-on. We understand that extenuating circumstances do happen and our agents are equipped to review those situations on a case-by-case basis to determine if an exception is warranted. (Just do us a favor and try to make sure it’s not the 8th time your great uncle has passed away.)
Candidly, we expect that this change may be unpopular with some – and we will hear all of your concerns related to it – so we are communicating this early and will be sending a variety of communications to customers later today. When program changes occur, we want our members to be aware of them so that they can adapt accordingly.
Now let’s start the conversation. I’m gathering your comments and bringing them all back to the team…
Michelle, SkyMiles Delta Social Ambassador
Connect with us at Twitter.com/Delta & Facebook.com/Delta
Late last month, I posted information about recent changes to our Award redeposit policy. The changes were made after we reviewed the number of award seats that were going out empty and the number was large – massive, in fact. So we made some adjustments to help address the situation and increase award availability.
In response to that post, more than half a dozen FT members asked if we were looking at making changes to the policy for any time prior to departure. In fact, we were. During that review we determined that there are more than 1,000,000 award seats that were going unused at the 72 hour mark prior to departure. That is 3 days in which those seats could otherwise be sold or used for other SkyMiles members who truly intend to sit in the seat and travel.
As a result, we’re updating this policy once more. So, effective August 15, 2011, SkyMiles members who wish to cancel or make changes to their award ticket now need to do so at least 72 hours before their flight departure (for changes, this applies to each flight segment – outbound and return). This change will make those seats available to other members and ultimately increase award availability. Miles for tickets cancelled within 72 hours will be nonrefundable. Taxes and fees for award travel cancelled within 72 hours will be refundable upon request. Same-day standby options will remain.
For changes or cancellations made at least 72 hours prior to departure, Diamond and Platinum Medallion members will continue to receive reissue and redeposit fee waivers. Reissue and redeposit fees will continue to apply for other members.
We will be sending out an email to customers with advance award travel booked later today – delta.com is being updated with this information as well.
Because it was a trending theme in last month’s thread, let’s address another issue head-on. We understand that extenuating circumstances do happen and our agents are equipped to review those situations on a case-by-case basis to determine if an exception is warranted. (Just do us a favor and try to make sure it’s not the 8th time your great uncle has passed away.)
Candidly, we expect that this change may be unpopular with some – and we will hear all of your concerns related to it – so we are communicating this early and will be sending a variety of communications to customers later today. When program changes occur, we want our members to be aware of them so that they can adapt accordingly.
Now let’s start the conversation. I’m gathering your comments and bringing them all back to the team…
Michelle, SkyMiles Delta Social Ambassador
Connect with us at Twitter.com/Delta & Facebook.com/Delta
Sep 17, 2018, 10:44 am
#19
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: MSP
Programs: Delta PM, 1MM
Posts: 3,783
The award booking would have to be in a different name. Do people really do that?
Sep 17, 2018, 10:45 am
#20
Join Date: Feb 2003
Posts: 4,115
Fortunately, this isn’t a case where we need to speculate on why Delta instituted the 72 hour rule - it occurred back in 2011 back when Delta still bothered to participate on FlyerTalk. Here’s their rationale for introducing the 72 hour rule from that mega thread:
Updated: Award Redeposit and Reissue Rule Change
Updated: Award Redeposit and Reissue Rule Change
Sep 17, 2018, 11:30 am
#21
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Jul 2003
Posts: 23,043
There was someone on AA a few years back who was caught making fictitious award bookings to hold back seats for upgrades. I think there's a thread around some where on FT on it. I was just speculating based on that and it's likely not a major part of it. Probably just speculative bookings or maybe people just forgetting about them. I went back and looked at the original announcement back 2011 and it said there were 1 million award bookings that went unflown the previous year. So it's probably mostly just to reduce seats from being tied up until the last minute (that could be sold, used for IRROP's, etc.). In the end, with DL (plus VS) no longer releasing last minute low-level awards (due to advance purchase requirements) and few other partners having anything open last minute (with perhaps the exception of VA), I don't see the big deal as long as they have some flexibility in the case of emergencies and unexpected events.
Sep 17, 2018, 2:27 pm
#22
Join Date: Feb 2003
Posts: 4,115
My travel plans sometimes change within 72 hours. High $ tickets involved. On UA, as a GS, when I change my revenue premium cabin ticket, they will automatically open up an award seat for my spouse to come with me on the new flight. On Delta, I lose all my miles. Tough choice on my part.
Dec 12, 2018, 9:25 pm
#24
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: AGS, CAE, ATL
Programs: Delta PM 2MM, Marriott Lifetime Titanium
Posts: 511
Trip Cancellation with Skymiles
Platinum Elite having to cancel a trip using my Skymiles, trip is a month away and for two passengers. I’m assuming that miles will be redeposited into my account but I’m not sure what will happen to the miles from passenger two. Will I get them back as well ?
Dec 12, 2018, 9:39 pm
#25
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: HNL
Programs: DL PM/1MM, BW DE (lifetime), HH DE, Marriott PE (lifetime), National Emerald Executive
Posts: 7,205
It'll get credited back to whichever account it was originally debited from. Who is the passenger doesn't matter, just the account it came from (and in terms of fee waivers, the current status of the account).
Dec 12, 2018, 9:49 pm
#26
In memoriam, FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: May 2005
Location: PIT
Programs: DM life is over 2MM PM now & NW MillionAir Wyndham Rewards Plat -Hotels.com Silver -Accor Silver
Posts: 15,408
As long as the award ticket was "purchased", so to speak, with miles from the account of a DM or PM, the miles and taxes will be fully refunded. No problem.
Dec 13, 2018, 6:19 am
#27
A FlyerTalk Posting Legend
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Minneapolis: DL DM charter 2.3MM
Programs: A3*Gold, SPG Plat, HyattDiamond, MarriottPP, LHW exAccess, ICI, Raffles Amb, NW PE MM, TWA Gold MM
Posts: 100,399
These answers assume that you have award tickets and didn't use "pay with miles."