Mileage Lover

Hi,

I'm booked on the LAX-AMS non-stop next year and wondered how the loads were looking. Hoping they will keep this route going.

When I fly, it's being operated by the A330.

Anyone fly this one yet?

Thanks!

flyerCO

Regardless of loads, they need to fly it so that pilots get enough hours. KLM drops their 2nd flight (at least temporarily) later this year.

mizzou miles

Um, so DL pilots can only get hours on LAX-AMS? Sorry but that makes no sense. The planes and the pilots are highly transportable assets that can be deployed wherever demand is greatest.

jdrtravel

I would be very surprised if this route was not successful. It's a great plane on a flight between two hubs, and I think most people prefer to connect in AMS over Paris, and that many people prefer DL to KLM all things being equal.

If they can bring PS onto this route I also think that would be a great move. I know they plan to eventually roll it out on the whole feel, but these west coast to Europe routes are just as long as some TPAC flights.

flyerCO

You've missed the whole point. As part of agreeing to the JV with AF/KL/AZ and soon to be JV with AF/KL/VS DL pilots are contractually guarenteed to fly X hours/percent of the TATL flights. DL pilots were short on hours, thus DL operates LAX-AMS/CDG so DL pilots get their hours. In fact while they kept it over the summer, the DL flight is replacing the 2nd daily KLM LAX-AMS flight.

3Cforme

Maybe. Have any data?

There's no doubt that CDG is a bigger gateway to the U.S. than AMS, with 7.0 million passengers 12-months ending 9/17 to 5.2 million for AMS.

https://www.transportation.gov/sites...ember-2017.pdf

jdrtravel

No, just antidotal from FT. Could totally be wrong, but it's just my sense that people prefer it if they have a choice and the prices are similar.

ChinaShrek

Yup! I hate connecting at CDG. AMS is fairly smooth.

WheelsFirst

I'm on this flight in January (CDG-AMS-LAX since that's what was available with SkyPesos). Fingers crossed it stays a 330 and doesn't get downgraded to a 767...

TheMadBrewer

I'm on it twice in October (LAX-AMS-PRG then AMS-LAX) and hopefully again in December (if it is still running). My GUC on the outbound cleared at booking and I think I am going to try for a miles+$$$ DoD upgrade out of AMS -- these are my last batch of GUCs so I'm trying to hoard them as best as I can

This summer it is a 777 and I was trying to get one of those but the timing didn't work.

Looks like next year I am going to have a bunch of trips thru AMS so on one hand I am happy -- but no GUCs for me so I hope they keep C+ around for a while

NOLAnwGOLD

I'm on this in Sept, booked with confirmed GUC on all the legs with DL on the outbound.
I don't want PS since you can't get it for free with PM/DM status and C+ disappears.....the leg room is really key for me....

I like KLM and AMS is easier (though the KLM lounges are a zoo these days, especially 52 which apparently isn't done until Dec 2019!) and Air Chance really is well a chance....

jdrtravel

I think it remains to be seen if they are actually going to eliminate C+ from the entire international fleet. I can't remember which thread but a recent post linked to something from DL that indicated some open questions about this.

ethernal

All action to date implies otherwise given that they are not doing it on their two largest planes (777 and A350). If they are going to have 4 "pseudo-classes", they would have put it on those. An A330 and definitely a 767 would likely feel a bit over-segmented if you had 4 pseudo-classes. (Note that I agree with the poster - the loss of C+ is a huge, huge, huge DM/PM devaluation and more or less eliminates incentives to book a DL flight as a hub captive given the pricing premium they usually charge over competitors).

If they re-introduece C+ on the planes, my guess is that it just takes the form of rebranded preferred seating (bulkheads, exit rows) that require upgrades or more expensive buy-up to get rather than today's preferred seating..

meh130

France is much more of an international destination than the Netherlands. AMS was designed to be more of a connecting airport so KLM could be a global airline.

In 2012 when I connected through CDG, CDG was poor for non-Schengen to Schengen connections. It required claiming luggage, clearing France customs and immigration, walking to the Schengen terminal, and checking in again. I don't know if it has improved since then.

I had wanted to connect through AMS in 2012 as I had found it be a smooth airport for connections in the past, but I could not make it work.

In 2016 when I connected through AMS, there is a large passport control station you go through to go from non-Schengen to Schengen, which are in the same terminal, just on different levels.

flyerCO

Customs is done at country of final arrival now. No picking up bags unless entering France. If connecting to another Schengen country bags transfer, and you clear customs there . You still clear immigration at first Schengen country .