Jackson Hole (JAC) Delta Service
Jul 23, 2018, 3:40 pm
#16
Join Date: Sep 2015
Posts: 863
Most of the time there are not issues. The 757-200 is the king when it comes to short runways. There are a ton of variables in why there could be a weight issue one day but not most days. They include aircraft MEL’s, surface wind, temp, ISA temp at cruise alt, weather at destination ect, winds at altitude ect..Weather at destination is probably the big variable. If you have a forecast for bad thunderstorms in ATL it might be prudent to put on 10,000lbs more fuel. That comes right out of payload. Add in bad flight winds and maybe you need 15,000 more lbs!
Jul 23, 2018, 4:58 pm
#17
Join Date: Jul 2014
Location: BOS/DEN/BUR
Programs: DL Gold, UA Gold, B6 Mosaic, Marriott Gold
Posts: 744
I took that video! Even at full thrust, it took over 5000ft until liftoff.
Jul 23, 2018, 7:43 pm
#18
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: Washington, DC
Programs: Delta PM, Delta Reserve, Amex Plat, Bonvoy Gold, Hilton Diamond, Starbucks Gold ;)
Posts: 1,775
I’ve been flying into JAC every winter for years. A few years back it was always a CRJ700 from SLC, but last year it was all 319’s. During weekends in winter, DL has direct flights from a lot of destinations, but it’s mostly mainline and the E175.
Saturdays at JAC we’re crazy last winter with all of the mainline aircraft from UA, DL and AA. Flights I’ve been on are always full.
Saturdays at JAC we’re crazy last winter with all of the mainline aircraft from UA, DL and AA. Flights I’ve been on are always full.
Jul 23, 2018, 8:50 pm
#19
In memoriam
Join Date: Dec 2001
Programs: DL 2MM, AA MM, DL Sky Club Life, AA Admirals Club Life, Hilton Gold Life
Posts: 1,732
Was this a hot day takeoff issue?
If so it could be more than a type of aircraft issue but also consider time-on-wing for one of the engines
If so it could be more than a type of aircraft issue but also consider time-on-wing for one of the engines
Jul 23, 2018, 9:07 pm
#20
Join Date: Jun 2013
Programs: DL Diamond, UA Premier Gold
Posts: 2,933
Jul 23, 2018, 9:26 pm
#21
Suspended
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Orlando, FL Area
Programs: Delta SkySponge ExtraAbsorbent, SPG Gold
Posts: 29,988
Hahaha Oh this is good. The 757 is the most capable aircraft in Delta's fleet. Whatever problem you are facing on the 757 would only be exacerbated on another aircraft.
Jul 23, 2018, 9:46 pm
#22
Suspended
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Orlando, FL Area
Programs: Delta SkySponge ExtraAbsorbent, SPG Gold
Posts: 29,988
Say what? The hatred of the 739 on this board is getting ridiculous. It handles some of the longest domestic flights without issue. United will even be running the 737-9M on IAH-ANC. The 739 can handle DCA just fine.
Boeing 737-990/ER - Alaska Airlines | Aviation Photo #4389489 | Airliners.net
Boeing 737-990/ER - Alaska Airlines | Aviation Photo #4389489 | Airliners.net
Jul 23, 2018, 9:57 pm
#23
Join Date: Jul 2015
Location: MCO
Programs: DL PM, UA Silver, Marriott Titanium, Hertz Presidents Circle
Posts: 4,309
Say what? The hatred of the 739 on this board is getting ridiculous. It handles some of the longest domestic flights without issue. United will even be running the 737-9M on IAH-ANC. The 739 can handle DCA just fine.
Boeing 737-990/ER - Alaska Airlines Aviation Photo #4389489 Airliners.net
Boeing 737-990/ER - Alaska Airlines Aviation Photo #4389489 Airliners.net
Jul 23, 2018, 10:06 pm
#24
Suspended
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Orlando, FL Area
Programs: Delta SkySponge ExtraAbsorbent, SPG Gold
Posts: 29,988
739 and 739M are very different aircrafts. Both are pigs when it comes to runway performance. IAH and ANC both have long runways so no issues their but DCAs main Runway 1/19 is only 7,100ft long and a fully loaded 739 flying a MidCon or Transcons from there would be cutting it close. The 739 probably would have no issue flying DCA-ATL, but it still probably would take up more than half the runway.
Jul 23, 2018, 10:22 pm
#25
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: SEA (the REAL Washington); occasionally in the other Washington (DCA area)
Programs: DL PM 1.57MM; AS MVPG 100K
Posts: 21,371
when AS first applied for DCA-SEA (~2001) they intended to use the 739; iirc they actually completed the first few days of operation in early Sep with the -900, but the sharp drop in demand meant the -700 was a much better fit
Jul 23, 2018, 11:16 pm
#27
Join Date: Jul 2015
Location: MCO
Programs: DL PM, UA Silver, Marriott Titanium, Hertz Presidents Circle
Posts: 4,309
Alaska has been flying the 739 between DCA and west coast for some time now. If it was that bad I doubt they would use it. I'm not saying it's the best performer but it isn't the pig some people make it out to be. And I'm betting the times it eats up the most runway is during a derated takeoff. Unless you are privileged to the takeoff data (sometimes the crew will print you off a copy) it's hard to say how well it performed on a particular flight.
Didn't DCA have a restriction of aircraft larger than 156 seats for a year or two after 9/11 in addition to the no standing up 30 mins prior/after landing/departure rule IIRC?
Jul 23, 2018, 11:32 pm
#28
Join Date: Jul 2014
Posts: 339
Alaska has been flying the 739 between DCA and west coast for some time now. If it was that bad I doubt they would use it. I'm not saying it's the best performer but it isn't the pig some people make it out to be. And I'm betting the times it eats up the most runway is during a derated takeoff. Unless you are privileged to the takeoff data (sometimes the crew will print you off a copy) it's hard to say how well it performed on a particular flight.
interestingly the 321s do just fine... tons of them daily
Looking back through FlightAware for AS flights out of DCA, it’s -800s as far as the eye can see
Jul 24, 2018, 9:32 am
#29
Join Date: Sep 2015
Posts: 863
Both the A321 and 737-900 are pigs and will not provide a reliable trans con flight off 7000 foot runways. It can be done but you will have load restrictions and or flag stops. The 757 on the other hand can takeoff from SNA with a 5700’ runway and go to ATL nonstop with alternate fuel and a full load of passengers.
Jul 24, 2018, 10:36 am
#30
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: SEA (the REAL Washington); occasionally in the other Washington (DCA area)
Programs: DL PM 1.57MM; AS MVPG 100K
Posts: 21,371
"tons" = TWO long-haul (AS nee VX to SFO, AA to PHX)
extremely minor point in terms of fuel, but SNA-ATL is 60 miles shorter than DCA-PHX
ok, sorry I got pedantic about DCA; let's get the thread back on the topic of JAC
Both the A321 and 737-900 are pigs and will not provide a reliable trans con flight off 7000 foot runways. It can be done but you will have load restrictions and or flag stops. The 757 on the other hand can takeoff from SNA with a 5700’ runway and go to ATL nonstop with alternate fuel and a full load of passengers.
ok, sorry I got pedantic about DCA; let's get the thread back on the topic of JAC