Rumor: DL to announce MSP-ICN soon

Old Jun 12, 2018, 6:34 pm
  #16  
FlyerTalk Evangelist
 
Join Date: Jun 2001
Programs: DL 1 million, AA 1 mil, HH lapsed Diamond, Marriott Plat
Posts: 28,190
Originally Posted by Widgets

I’m not current on how international routes are allocated, but could it be a vestige of the old DL-AS partnership where Delta provided intl service to AS domestic traffic?
PDX-LHR started May 2017, the same month Delta/Alaska ended their partnership.
Widgets likes this.
3Cforme is offline  
Old Jun 12, 2018, 6:40 pm
  #17  
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Hilton Contributor Badge
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: San Antonio
Programs: DL DM, Former AA EXP now AY Plat, AC 75K, NW Plat, Former CO Gold, Hilton Diamond, Marriott Titanium
Posts: 27,040
Originally Posted by readywhenyouare
MSP can support Tokyo service with no problem. If anyone is losing Tokyo service my bet is on PDX. I'm also puzzled why DL operates PDX-LHR. There is no domestic feed on either end. Portland really isn't that big of a city.
VS/DL are in a JV on all US/UK routes. As part of getting it approved by pilots, X number/percent of hours must be flown by DL pilots.
flyerCO is offline  
Old Jun 12, 2018, 7:10 pm
  #18  
Suspended
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Orlando, FL Area
Programs: Delta SkySponge ExtraAbsorbent, SPG Gold
Posts: 29,988
Originally Posted by flyerCO
VS/DL are in a JV on all US/UK routes. As part of getting it approved by pilots, X number/percent of hours must be flown by DL pilots.
The yields must be very high. My friend has never had a problem non-reving on that route thanks to low load factors. VS has no domestic/EU routes to flow those passengers on to. And DL certainly has nothing at PDX.
readywhenyouare is offline  
Old Jun 13, 2018, 12:02 am
  #19  
 
Join Date: Apr 2001
Location: Any of the Following PDX SFO IAH YUL HPN CDG SYD WLG AKL
Programs: AA GLD 1MM, DL DM, UA 1K Marriott Platinum, Hilton Diamond, IHG Spire Ambassador , Hyatt Platinum
Posts: 464
Oh let’s see which of the Major PDX companies could want this flight? Nike, Intel, Genentech.

My bet is on Nike as the UK is their Megamarket in Europe.
MSPeconomist likes this.
kiwicanuck is offline  
Old Jun 13, 2018, 12:20 am
  #20  
FlyerTalk Evangelist
 
Join Date: Jun 2015
Location: Back in Reds Country (DAY/CVG). Previously: SEA & SAT.
Programs: DL PM 1MM, AA PLAT, UA Silver, Marriott Bonvoy Titanium
Posts: 10,334
Originally Posted by readywhenyouare
MSP can support Tokyo service with no problem. If anyone is losing Tokyo service my bet is on PDX. I'm also puzzled why DL operates PDX-LHR. There is no domestic feed on either end. Portland really isn't that big of a city.
Nike is HQ'ed in Portland and apparently generates quite a bit of premium traffic, among other companies HQ'ed in the Portland area. Additionally, Portland's metro area is 2.45 million. Orlando's is right at 2.5 million. Las Vegas is 2.2 million. Obviously Orlando and Las Vegas have the tourism draw (and that puts aside that Portland can generate a lot of business traffic, which is going to be higher yielding than leisure traffic), but if you're going to say "Portland really isn't that big of a city", then you have to be ready to admit that neither Orlando or Las Vegas are "that big of a city" either.
MSPeconomist likes this.
ATOBTTR is offline  
Old Jun 13, 2018, 12:31 am
  #21  
Suspended
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Orlando, FL Area
Programs: Delta SkySponge ExtraAbsorbent, SPG Gold
Posts: 29,988
Originally Posted by ATOBTTR
Nike is HQ'ed in Portland and apparently generates quite a bit of premium traffic, among other companies HQ'ed in the Portland area. Additionally, Portland's metro area is 2.45 million. Orlando's is right at 2.5 million. Las Vegas is 2.2 million. Obviously Orlando and Las Vegas have the tourism draw (and that puts aside that Portland can generate a lot of business traffic, which is going to be higher yielding than leisure traffic), but if you're going to say "Portland really isn't that big of a city", then you have to be ready to admit that neither Orlando or Las Vegas are "that big of a city" either.
Of course they are not. Look at the portfolio of international flights from MCO and LAS. It is very limited in destinations. MCO couldn't even support CDG when Air France tried a few years ago. It's basically just flights to the UK and S America. I'm not even sure if FRA is year-round. LAS has even less than MCO.
readywhenyouare is offline  
Old Jun 13, 2018, 3:19 am
  #22  
FlyerTalk Evangelist
 
Join Date: Jun 2015
Location: Back in Reds Country (DAY/CVG). Previously: SEA & SAT.
Programs: DL PM 1MM, AA PLAT, UA Silver, Marriott Bonvoy Titanium
Posts: 10,334
Originally Posted by readywhenyouare


Of course they are not. Look at the portfolio of international flights from MCO and LAS. It is very limited in destinations. MCO couldn't even support CDG when Air France tried a few years ago. It's basically just flights to the UK and S America. I'm not even sure if FRA is year-round. LAS has even less than MCO.
Well at MCO, besides the all the service to South America and both BA, VS, and Thomas Cook to the UK, you have LH to FRA, DL to AMS, Icelandair to KEF, Edelweiss to ZUR, Norwegian to quite a few cities, and even Emirates to DXB. I wouldn’t call that “limited” by any stretch of the imagination. LAS has both TATL and TPAC service as well, albeit much less than MCO.

Point being these cities can sustain a decent amount of longhaul traffic, and if it’s a city like PDX with a decent amount of business traffic that can command the nonstop premium, then the city can sustain the service even if it’s not an NYC or LA or Chicago. It also helps that Portland is the top 10 metro areas in the US for highest per capita income.
ATOBTTR is offline  
Old Jun 13, 2018, 4:31 am
  #23  
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: ATL/SLC
Posts: 3,540
Originally Posted by readywhenyouare
MSP can support Tokyo service with no problem. If anyone is losing Tokyo service my bet is on PDX. I'm also puzzled why DL operates PDX-LHR. There is no domestic feed on either end. Portland really isn't that big of a city.
A 4x weekly service during peak summer only doesn’t seem that unreasonable for PDX.
MastaHanky is offline  
Old Jun 13, 2018, 5:43 am
  #24  
 
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: NYC
Programs: DL DM; Marriott Ambasador Elite
Posts: 626
Originally Posted by kiwicanuck
Oh let’s see which of the Major PDX companies could want this flight? Nike, Intel, Genentech.

My bet is on Nike as the UK is their Megamarket in Europe.
I’d imagine the Weiden Kennedy folks fly a fair amount too, including internationally. That said, I think it takes a much larger portfolio of businesses to support an international route.
acrophobia is offline  
Old Jun 13, 2018, 6:13 am
  #25  
FlyerTalk Evangelist
 
Join Date: Jun 2001
Programs: DL 1 million, AA 1 mil, HH lapsed Diamond, Marriott Plat
Posts: 28,190
Originally Posted by ATOBTTR
Nike is HQ'ed in Portland and apparently generates quite a bit of premium traffic, among other companies HQ'ed in the Portland area. Additionally, Portland's metro area is 2.45 million. Orlando's is right at 2.5 million. Las Vegas is 2.2 million. Obviously Orlando and Las Vegas have the tourism draw (and that puts aside that Portland can generate a lot of business traffic, which is going to be higher yielding than leisure traffic), but if you're going to say "Portland really isn't that big of a city", then you have to be ready to admit that neither Orlando or Las Vegas are "that big of a city" either.
That's not a good comparison. Orlando's domestic O&D was 32.5 million passengers for 12 months ending 2q17; Portland's was 14.5 million. Las Vegas had 34.2 million. The attractions of LAS and MCO completely overwhelm the local O&D. Looking at domestic O&D in single-airport metros, PDX compares to Tampa and SLC.
manacit likes this.
3Cforme is offline  
Old Jun 13, 2018, 6:31 am
  #26  
A FlyerTalk Posting Legend
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Minneapolis: DL DM charter 2.3MM
Programs: A3*Gold, SPG Plat, HyattDiamond, MarriottPP, LHW exAccess, ICI, Raffles Amb, NW PE MM, TWA Gold MM
Posts: 100,369
Originally Posted by MastaHanky


A 4x weekly service during peak summer only doesn’t seem that unreasonable for PDX.
That might result in full airplanes due to leisure travelers, but it wouldn't work for the premium business traffic. Frequent convenient schedules are important, plus if there's an extended low season for business travel, it would be summer.
MSPeconomist is offline  
Old Jun 13, 2018, 9:00 am
  #27  
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: MSP
Programs: Delta Gold, UA Plat. Hyatt Diamond, Marriott Plat. Hilton Plat. US Airways, Starwood Gold, Avis Pres
Posts: 1,382
Ed announced it this morning while speaking to a few people at the Hyatt Regency in Bloomington, MN- MSP-ICN nonstop.....
twoner32 is offline  
Old Jun 13, 2018, 9:16 am
  #28  
Original Poster
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: MSP
Programs: Delta PM, Hyatt Discoverist, Hertz PC
Posts: 2,303
Originally Posted by twoner32
Ed announced it this morning while speaking to a few people at the Hyatt Regency in Bloomington, MN- MSP-ICN nonstop.....
I know he's been speaking to a bunch of the regional chambers of commerce, as well as meeting with Delta and Endeavor employees at MSP. Makes perfect sense.
jrkmsp is offline  
Old Jun 13, 2018, 9:25 am
  #29  
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Seattle, WA
Programs: DL Diamond 1.7MM, Starlux Insighter, Bonvoy Titanium, Hilton Gold, Hertz PC
Posts: 3,944
Originally Posted by MSPeconomist
That might result in full airplanes due to leisure travelers, but it wouldn't work for the premium business traffic. Frequent convenient schedules are important, plus if there's an extended low season for business travel, it would be summer.
Only the LHR flight is 4x weekly; AMS and NRT are daily. And 4x weekly covers plenty of flexibility, with M/W/F/Sa outbounds and returns for London. On other days, it’s not like folks are out of luck - it’s trivially easy to connect in SEA or AMS.

This does seem like a “hold the LHR slot” route, to be fair. But it was at least profitable enough to bring it back for a second year this summer...

Speaking from experience, PDX/SEA are also symbiotic reliever hubs for each other in a fashion recalling the way MSP/DTW once worked for NW. When SEA directs fill up, PDX connecting itineraries are often available at a lower price, helping fill remaining seats not consumed by the local O&D market. And it’s a useful tool for DL during irops to have at least one airport operating slightly under full capacity...
BenA is offline  
Old Jun 13, 2018, 9:27 am
  #30  
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: ATL/SLC
Posts: 3,540
Originally Posted by MSPeconomist
That might result in full airplanes due to leisure travelers, but it wouldn't work for the premium business traffic. Frequent convenient schedules are important, plus if there's an extended low season for business travel, it would be summer.
Right, and there isn’t enough business traffic to justify a daily service year-round. Hence why the last day of Delta Flight 36 is October 5th - resuming next year.
MastaHanky is offline  

Thread Tools
Search this Thread

Contact Us - Manage Preferences - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service -

This site is owned, operated, and maintained by MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. Copyright © 2024 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Designated trademarks are the property of their respective owners.