readywhenyouare

SFTNYC

As others have noted, the 764 flies with 4 FA's up front. You likely only saw 2 since 1 works each aisle, and the other 2 are in the galley plating, prepping carts or running food/beverage. The bit about the toilets being dirty is unfortunate, though probably has more to do with the particular individuals on your flight than the fact that business class was full. The cabin has 40 J seats because Delta thinks on certain routes they can sell 40 J seats. I used to fly JFK-LHR weekly back when the 764 was on that exclusively - Sunday and Thursday night business class would routinely go out full (with no upgrades clearing) and I never recall any cleanliness issues. I do understand frustration with so many upgrades clearing day of cheapening the experience of those who pay for it - hopefully a commensurate downgrade of food/beverage doesn't follow (though I've been told even before comp upgrades came to this route business class was always catered full, even if it wasn't sold full).

pvn

If you know they're common, why would you be surprised by them? I've taken widebodies from SFO to ATL/JFK more times than I can count.

I mean, if they only flew large equipment to stations with connections, how would they get them to the outstations in the first place in order to send them to hubs??? People move in both directions. You can't say it makes sense to use a widebody on SFO-ATL because of all the connections at the destination, but the opposite trip doesn't make sense.

tphuang

I can tell you for a fact that UA generates a much higher yield on EWR-SFO than DL on JFK-SFO. And AA commands higher yield even after factoring in the small cabin. SFO is far lower yielding for DL than LAX. And that's not even mentioning BOS-SFO, which is a financial disaster.

btonkid12345

What is/are the source(s) that validate your facts? Unless you have access to confidential financial data from the US3 this is not a fact. Its more likely just your opinion based on anecdotes.

bgriff

Actually this information is public.
https://data.transportation.gov/Avia...iguo/4f3n-jbg2

DL lags AA and UA in average fare on both NYC-SFO and NYC-LAX.

btonkid12345

This table shows Y fares. It doesn't show premium cabin fares exclusively (or at all) and I assume that is where a lot of the margin is coming from for all carriers - last minute premium cabin sales.

btonkid12345

Well, if that statement were true, I wouldn't be surprised only because EWR-SFO is a hub to hub route for UA. SFO is not a DL hub.

DL has a much higher yield on their fortress hub non stops - check out how expensive ATL-SLC - the point is comparing hub-to-hub versus none - and based on anecdotal evidence - is hardly definitive, or even an apples-to-apples comparison.

apodo77

Having flown the 767-400 recently on LAX-ATL that plane is a dump on the inside.
No clue on all the other parts people are discussing in this thread.

live5

Just to be clear, you're angry that there are other people in Delta One with you?

...I can't with these people.

355F1

awesome news!!!!!

Yay free upgrades!!!!!

Mountain Explorer

That's true. The 777s are getting interior mods now, and the 764s are next in line. Hopefully starting next year.

Alphazone

"Small outstation" would be something like RNO. Not SFO with >10 daily frequencies, surely one of DL's top 10 domestic markets.

SFO, PHL, PIT have had international service by DL in the past decade, too.

tphuang

Yes, exactly. a hub-hub operation that UA runs on EWR-SFO will always be more higher yielding than DL's hub-out station. I'm simply responding to the assertion that nobody would fly UA. DL dominates its fortress hubs more than any other airlines so it gets a huge yield premium, but UA will also get a yield premium (although smaller one) on its hub to hub routes. Nothing too scientific to it.

Airlines tend to do well on routes where they should do well on.

I get my data from Db1B who does a 10% sample on all the fares. I'm pretty sure that's what the dot link generates the data from too. It includes all fares. If you look into the raw data, you will see some really high prices in there for JFK-LAX that can't possibly be y fares. Let's just say there is no way AA can average over $600 a ticket on JFK-LAX in y.

SJC ORD LDR

I haven't seen a widebody on SFO-ATL in a while. I actually miss the 767s on that route. 739s are a horrible replacement IMO.

But, if I actually lived in SF and flew out of SFO, UA would be my airline. It's their hub and you can go lots of places non-stop. No one else comes close to them. But, I fly from SJC and I figured that most of the time, the time it takes to connect out of SJC makes up for the fact I don't have to get to SFO. Plus, I'm doing a lot of trips to SEA, which DL does non-stop.